UshCha | 19 Jun 2019 8:05 a.m. PST |
So its becoming more of a need to mark units both in and out of Foxholes and fighting positions. What are the options? I did think of printing some real scale models with eiterh heads out(fox holes) or covered Fighting positions, but may meed occupied and unoccupied and then its getting to the case of spending too much time sorting markers out just when its getting adrenalyn filled and fun. In addition it may need diffrent makers for each nationality so that seems a loser. So what do you use? |
Formerly Regiment Games | 19 Jun 2019 9:00 a.m. PST |
Small brown aquarium stones. |
Extra Crispy | 19 Jun 2019 9:17 a.m. PST |
Old Glory in their 15mm range make "infantry in fox holes." The figures are just heads and shoulders and the foxholes are rings. So when a unit enters a foxhole, replace the stand with the dug in figures, then swap out again when they leave. Requires a little book keeping to know who is who…. Alternatively, yes, make a terrain piece the size of your stands, or just use a marker for "dug in." We use a piece of twig in some games. Looks like a log being used for cover (ish). |
Lee494 | 19 Jun 2019 10:06 a.m. PST |
In my games we use little (about 1/2 x 1") Markers, green to go with most table tops with a large DUG-IN printed on them as I prefer clarity to esthetics when marking troop status. Lee |
trenchfoot | 19 Jun 2019 10:51 a.m. PST |
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Extra Crispy | 19 Jun 2019 10:57 a.m. PST |
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Lion in the Stars | 19 Jun 2019 11:52 a.m. PST |
For Flames of War, we usually use a marker that wraps around the base and has some logs or sandbags or similar. Relatively cheap to buy, and not difficult to make. |
Gungnir | 19 Jun 2019 10:51 p.m. PST |
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UshCha | 20 Jun 2019 1:38 a.m. PST |
Thanks folks, it interesting to see the range. One thing that struck me odd, almost everybody did the Dug in markers in earth even though most are placed on green wargames table. For guys that don't want to be seen this struck me as odd. Formally Regiment Games, that is a clever use, artistic, repaceable and simple. Gungnir yours has the advantage of easily covering faceing. I think a print of somthing like that perhaps taperd to show faceing and flocked in base coloure looks good. Its always a help helps to see other folks options even if you don't use them, it sparkes creative thought. Thanks everybody. |
Extra Crispy | 20 Jun 2019 7:16 a.m. PST |
If your dug in marker matches your table too well, you won't see it and might forget to give the cover bonus. Also, hasty works usually are dirt colored as the soil removed from the hole is piled to make a berm. You keep out of sight by keeping low, but yes, the enemy will know you're there. If you want heavily camouflaged positions that takes time and I then refer to those as "works." |
UshCha | 20 Jun 2019 9:14 a.m. PST |
Extra crispy, what better way to add real fog of war which is what many including me to aspire to. Forgeting or missing a dug in position is perfection incarnate. All the gains with no rules the ultimate in simulation and no die rolling! |
Umpapa | 20 Jun 2019 2:12 p.m. PST |
You can simulate deepness by darker shade of the green. I am using cut outs (diameter several cm) of the same fabric I use for terrain, but darken in the center and sculpted sandbag wall at the edges. |
TacticalPainter01 | 20 Jun 2019 4:46 p.m. PST |
I've approached it from two angles. I've used some off the shelf sets that AB Figures produce that gives you half figures and some of the foxhole/entrenchment. I've added a bigger base but these are pretty much as they come. Nice, but time consuming and only useful for specific nationalities. You can see how I made them up here.
For something that can be used for any nationality but not looking quite as effective as figures dug in at ground level I scatchbuilt a number of 'entrenchments'. While I'm happy with the way they came out they were made with playability top of mind. There's a simple tutorial on how I made them here.
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Martin Rapier | 20 Jun 2019 11:19 p.m. PST |
I've made various foxholes, trenches etc (48 feet of trench!) but for adhoc dug in markers I very got a pile of Irregular log barricades. With a bit of flock they look like berms, they are small and handy, and you can just lay them across the front of the unit bases. |
Lion in the Stars | 21 Jun 2019 10:01 a.m. PST |
Extra crispy, what better way to add real fog of war which is what many including me to aspire to. Forgeting or missing a dug in position is perfection incarnate. All the gains with no rules the ultimate in simulation and no die rolling! The Defender forgetting that those troops were dug in is desirable? |
UshCha | 22 Jun 2019 6:21 a.m. PST |
Yup! If the defender misses where he put his troops then its his fault, add real fog of war. The defender may not desire it, like he does not desire any roll of the die other than the best possible, but for a credible game fog of war is a key parameter. |
UshCha | 22 Jun 2019 9:01 a.m. PST |
Ok so I looked at all the options you presented and went for a version of Gungnir's. The work well when not occupied and in my version (all for Real scale 1/144 troops) they denote note which way they are faceing by a slight taper to the front. They are low for two reasons, most of my figures are lying down or kneeling. Standing in a middle of a firefight to me just looks daft. Plus they are easy to paint and stack well so don't use too much storage volume. Secondly , as simulator I need to mark in some cases, low ridges which obscure prone troops from direct fire, which are not direcly mapped on the table at game start. These markers have to be distinct from them to avoid confusion, so cannnot be taller. I have done some in basic brown, brown with a bit of flock and almost all flock. Me I'm leaning to almost all flock but what do you think? link link |
Lion in the Stars | 22 Jun 2019 3:08 p.m. PST |
I think I like the partially flocked the best, but to me a 'dug in' marker is supposed to be easily seen. |
UshCha | 22 Jun 2019 10:09 p.m. PST |
Lion in the starts, why would you want then easily seen? Real troops would not want to be seen. |
Lion in the Stars | 23 Jun 2019 6:58 p.m. PST |
Because it's a status marker. The purpose of a status marker is to be seen, so that the information it conveys can be relayed. Would the real thing be better camouflaged? Almost certainly, though firebase defenses in Vietnam were not particularly camouflaged, and I'm not sure how well hidden hasty-defenses would be. If you're trying to get into hidden units, use counters for that (and include dummy counters). By having models on the table, the opposing player already knows where the troops are. So there's no reason to have perfectly camouflaged 'dug in' markers to conceal the troops. We make diorama markers to make the table look prettier, so we don't have some random bits of paper or whatever with words on them. |
ScottWashburn | 24 Jun 2019 4:29 a.m. PST |
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