"Setting up defences" Topic
10 Posts
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UshCha | 01 May 2019 12:38 p.m. PST |
After an interesting battle in our long running micro campaign. Involving a bridge complex with a full boxer company vs a dug in enemy platoon, where I for once played a master stoke, one of our other players who is into 1/72 wanted a go. Fortunately the 1/144 map could be more or less translated onto a 4ft by 12 ft board. However I was now the defender. To get a reasonable defensive layout with sensibly protected lines of fire and positioning the M113's and sections within the anti tank defense to be effective as Machine gun positions, while not being exposed to too much return fire from tanks was no mean feat. It took me a good hour or so trying different options to get something I am happy with. So how long would you expect to take to set up a platoon in defensive positions with most of the sections having alternate positions, assuming you play seriously to start with. |
Legion 4 | 01 May 2019 1:01 p.m. PST |
Are you digging in all your weapons and troops ? Or a Hasty Defense ? How well trained are your troops, i.e. have they set up a defense before ? Do have any CE support to assist in digging in, if you are digging in ? When you say Sections do you mean Fire Tms ? Are your M113 Plts organized like those in my Mech Company,'87-'89 ? J Series TO&E … 3 Squads, with each Squad consisting of two 5 man Fire Tms + 1 SL[w/M16] 1st Fire Tm. 1 M60 MG 1 M203 GL 1 M249 SAW 2 M16s 2d Fire Tm. 1 M47 MAW 1 M203 GL 1 M249 SAW 2 M16s 1 M113 APC with M2 .50 cal The 4th Track in the Plt is the PL's with .50 cal, 3-4 M16s. So … roughly … Depending on terrain, a Mech Plt should be able to set up a Plt Def. And be integrated into the Company Def plan. In couple of hours or to 4-6 hrs if you are digging. We rarely dug in, we preferred to stay mobile. But as usual that depends on the terrain and situation. |
UshCha | 01 May 2019 11:51 p.m. PST |
Again I screwed up! I mean it took me over an hour with the map on the screen, just to define where my forces would go on the table! I went through several scenarios to work out how best to defend the area. Its a sad truth, no wargames rules can make you a better general than you are. If you can't plan a set of rules can't make you plan better. Defence in wargames is one of the hardest things. In part because many wargames deliberatley (I will give them credit for not being just plain supid) depart form the real world to make the thing more "gamey", and pointless in my opinion. That means when you have even a halfway decent set you have as much to unlearn as actaully learn. The unit was a German one with M113G's. They had had planty of time to dig primary and secondary positions and clear/set up some fixed lines for The MG's on Tripods. For consealment reasons my opponent and hence me as I am undertaking the same scenario, did not use wire. Unfortunately for me he "sqauerded" all the currently available ammunition an hour on beating the Cr** out of me in his last position where I attacked. So there will be none available for me. |
Legion 4 | 02 May 2019 8:00 a.m. PST |
Well you answered your own question then … Although after doing it for real in my youth. I find setting up a defense for wargames fairly "easy". I.e. : Digging if you have time, etc. [So for wargames it adds to your survivability, e.g. adds to save mods, etc., etc.] Setting up obstacles to channelize enemy movement. Interlocking FOF, Sectors of fire, Clearing LOS, setting up Kill Zones, etc. Covering Dead Spaces, Kill Zones, etc., with Indirect Fires[if possible/available ?] Again with a Plt you may only have about 4-5 Vehicles and maybe 8-10 Infantry Fire Tms[stands] + 1 or 2 Cmd/CP stands. So that should be fairly basic … IMO … |
UshCha | 02 May 2019 9:28 a.m. PST |
I wish! took me ages looking at the ways the ememy might come in and how bwst to counter each one. |
79thPA | 02 May 2019 10:46 a.m. PST |
Sometimes all you can do is set up a defensive position based on what intelligence says is the most likely avenue of approach. Keep a small quick reaction force to send to a threatened spot while you shift your line. |
Legion 4 | 02 May 2019 1:56 p.m. PST |
I wish! took me ages looking at the ways the enemy might come in and how bwst to counter each one. You always have to look at likely enemy avenues of approach … Tying in your flanks with units on your left & right. Areas of responsibility, boundary lines and physical terrain. E.g. who gets covers/responsibility of this road/trail, stream, etc. And as 79th points out to generally designate a reserve. But sometimes you may not have the forces based on what your Tactical Area or Responsibility[TAOR]. A narrow front may give you the ability to designate a Reserve. E.g. 2 up … 1 Back … However you may have no choice but 3 up … period. Or with maybe a very small Res. E.g. Fire Tm, Squad, etc. But again that is not always possible. I.e. my 112 man Mech Co could only deploy 63 … . I even had to put the VTR [M578] up forward with my Infantry squads. It had a .50 cal too. You don't have to physically sit on every piece terrain in your TAOR/Area of Operation[AO]. But on Key pieces, e.g. high ground with good FOF, etc. But you also can control terrain by fire, obstacles, etc. Again terrain & situation … I would hope it would be easier for me. I was trained and paid to do it and did it. For over a decade … in my youth … |
Apache 6 | 02 May 2019 6:57 p.m. PST |
Are you counting real time or 'game time?" There should be a big difference between hasty defensive positions and prepared positions. Every time a platoon stops, they should move into the best covered and concealed positions, orienting themselves on the most likely enemy avenue of approach. Infantry will not normally dismount (since they don't want to get left or slow down resumption of march. This should be a standard operating procedure and take less then five minutes. Occupying a hasty defensive position, should also be a battle drill, would take 10 minutes =/-. In this case the infantry would dismount, but stay relatively close to vehicles. These positions might be selected by map reconnaissance. This might be improved into deliberate position or often the platoon might shift slightly to better ground. Prepared positions require at least an hour. The unit would likely pick better defensive positions. A M-113 equipped unit facing tanks is going to want to pick terrain that will minimize lines of sight and have covered and concealed egress routes. Urban terrain or a reverse slope defense would be classic examples. The platoon would send out an observation post to prevent surprise and allow for better observation. It would be tied in by a field phone. Infantry will dismount and begin to dig in. US Marines and Army use the ACRONYM SAFE to remember priorities in the defense; Security, Assign sectors of fire, Field of fire (clear fields of fire) and Entrench. Alternate positions may be designated and reconnoitered but are unlikely to be improved until primary positions are developed (I'd say after four hours) |
UshCha | 03 May 2019 1:00 a.m. PST |
Apoatche 6. Not game time but my "player time". The unit had at least a day to dig in but no supports like engineering assests they were otherwise engaged. Its really how long it takes you as a player to analise a map and creatare the interlocking fields of fire in the enemy approach routes (which I have to analise and protect. |
Legion 4 | 03 May 2019 7:48 a.m. PST |
+1 Apache 6 And once in a position for any length of time you are constantly improving it, etc.
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