"15 Legere Cornet Sapper and Drummer uniforms 1812" Topic

So I am not going too well with this search. I have found some references for 1809 and 1810, which show a spectacular red vest and sky blue shako for the Cornetists (knotell) and red vested Sappers and drummers with sky blue shakos (Henri Boisselier). The Cent Jours plates for the 15th in 1815 have none of the red/sky blue frivolity, showing Chasseur and Carabinier drummers to have a standard dark blue jacket with white chevrons and the voltigeurs having dark green jackets and yellow chevrons.
Assuming the accuracy of all, what happened? I am hoping that the change to orthodoxy in 1815 was an indirect consequence of, well everything that happened in 1814-15, and that the mighty 15th marched into Russia with its 1809/10 kit as depicted by Knotell and Boisselier.
If I am completely wrong I would really like to know what sources should be checked for this type of information. The project is to do Friant's 2nd Division, and I will have similar questions about the 33rd and 48th line drummers & sappers.
Many thanks in advance!

Well, the Cent Jours plates are based on after the Bardin uniform was finally put in practice, removing a lot of the uniqueness of the regiments. Despite the generally used term "1812 uniform", afaik it was very sparsely implemented in 1812, so you can go with the 1810 plates if you don't find any contrasting evidence.

Personally I think that it makes the hundred days into the boring campaign for French gamers. You get what you describe – the uniqueness of the facings on the musicians, sappers etc. is replaced by uniformity. I find 1812 to be more rewarding as a painter, as you have an excuse to keep some variation in your units.

E: I'm actually playing the 33rd right now in our Sharp Practice campaign in summer of 1812, but I must admit I haven't done too much research into the actual regiment.

Hello setsuko and thanks for your quick reply. I can see how my question was poorly phrased inviting the response of the Bardin regulations – of course the obvious answer!

I don't really know much about french uniforms in 1815, but I had thought, like most other periods in the French Army at this time, that the take up of the Bardin regulations was haphazard, meaning that a regiment might keep the eccentricities of its drummers, cornetists and sappers. Maybe this assumption is wrong, and if taken up Bardin was Bardin.

Anyway my main question is about the 15th in 1812, and the working hypothesis is, as you as, in the absence of any other evidence 1809/10 dress did apply.

Also very much agree with you about 1812 uniforms. For me the 1812 Grande Armee is the most wonderful collection of diverse kit. I can remember getting Philip Haythornthwaite & Michael Chappell's Uniforms of 1812 Napoleon's Retreat from Russian a long time ago and still thinking how good they looked…

Yes, afaik the Bardin uniform was haphazardly implemented in the 1813 and 1814 Campaigns, but more or less completely implemented by 1815. Generally, the sources I've found put the 1812 regiments in the same uniforms that they wore in 1810 at least, so if you find a plate for 1810 it's a good guess that it's good for 1812 as well.

I assume you've seen this link?

link

Another bonus for 1812 is the vast number of possible allies to paint up – allies that can fight against you in other games if end up having too many French for a fair game. :) I ended up making the mistake of starting my collection with Perry's 1812-1815 infantry, which are nice but not all that correct for 1812. Now I look forward to their previewed pre-Bardin kits.

I've posted my progress here if you're looking for more 1812 inspiration.

link

By 1815 the uniforms were more likely to resemble those of the Restoration Army than that of 1812. I think the Royal Lace on drummers and the Bourbon Crown on the shako plate was more prevalent than was the uniforms in which they entered Russia!

1812 (the war fought this side of the Atlantic is just marvellous for the variety of nations and their uniforms, well up until it turned a bit parky anyway)

setsuko that is a fabulous site you have there. I looked at it when you had 4 or 5 postings and then it slipped my mind. Now it is a visual feast – well done and thank you for reminding me!

Hello Deadhead. Standing here on the shores of 1812-14 I think I can just make out your silhouette on the shores of 1815! I am glad to momentarily took the ferry across – careful you don't fall in love with the place and get stuck here…

So far red & sky blue is the go for the mighty 15th Legere. As an aside, did the Bardin regulations prescribe green jackets with yellow chevrons for Voltigeur drummers of light regiments, or was that just a Colonel's whim?

the new Perry Plastic Set would be ideal for your project.

Thank you von Winterfeld – yes it would but I am doing this project in 10mm, as an excursion from my preferred 20mm.

That being said the Perry sculpting in 28mm, along with the Paul Hicks Murawski Poles are for me the most compelling in that scale.

Thanks for the kind words. :)

As for bardin and jackets, I'm 99% sure that the Bardin regulations prescribed the green jackets with red and yellow stripes (the Imperial Livery), but… I've also seen plates with clearly bardin style jackets but in blue with yellow stripes. The rules for Napoleonics seems to be that there's always an exception to what you Believe to be the rule.

Some of the French infantry regiments at Waterloo had drummers in blue with white chevrons on the sleeves, tapes on the chest. This may have been the King's livery, tapes replaced by all white instead of white chains on red background.

You can see some of these illustrated in the French-created Cent Jours site.

GdeP