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"You don't care about Warhammer canon..." Topic


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Fantasy

549 hits since 8 Jan 2019
©1994-2019 Bill Armintrout
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Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian08 Jan 2019 11:24 a.m. PST

You were asked – TMP link

On a scale of 0 (not at all) to 10 (complete fidelity), how closely do your Warhammer/Age of Sigmar armies follow the official Games Workshop background?

16% said "zero"
9% said "I don't know what canon is now"
8% said "8"

Mithmee Supporting Member of TMP08 Jan 2019 12:26 p.m. PST

Well Age of Sigmar has nothing to do with Warhammer Canon.

GW killed off WFB and brought out that dreg of a game.

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP08 Jan 2019 3:24 p.m. PST

How can Age of Sigmar have nothing to do with Warhammer Canon? It literally is Warhammer Canon.

GW stopped supporting WFB, they certainly didn't kill it. Why here are two people playing it this past week:

link

And you are welcome to your opinion about AoS but it would seem that more people disagree with you about AoS vs. Warhammer than agree if GW sales are any indication.

Why just last month they were reporting continued increases in sales:

link

Even after profit doubling from the year before:

link

I mean, $94,800,000 USD profit, must mean that they are doing more than something right. Not too many miniature companies can boast of that.

Thresher0108 Jan 2019 5:44 p.m. PST

Man, the UK language is confusing.

First, one must remember to insert superfluous vowels when writing/spelling many words, and NOW, we must also delete consonants too?

That is a bit too (or is it tooo) far, me thinks.

jsmcc9109 Jan 2019 3:47 a.m. PST

….and here is the reporter for Games Workshop showing up on every thread of WFB or WH40k…

StCrispin09 Jan 2019 7:30 a.m. PST

Age of sigmar is a lot of fun! Way faster and lighter than wfb. Which is great for playing with minis while having drinks with a few friends.

I'm not overly enthusiastic about the AOS background, but in my mind my games are still in the warhammer world. Empire, undead, and skaven are all still there for your gaming pleasure. Amd the warhammer world still lives on! Warhammer fantasy role play, warhammer total war, etc, are thriving.

Mithmee Supporting Member of TMP09 Jan 2019 12:56 p.m. PST

GW sales are any indication.

That is only because their stuff is over priced and if you want all aspects of a game you will need to spend and spend some more.

That is their current business model.

Put out a small portion of the game rules into one book and then put the rest in several books.

Thus is you want it all you have to buy every single book.

For GW that equals profit.

For me I voted with my wallet and I do not buy their stuff.

Plus as I have stated many time before Age of Sigmar is just not played in my area.

Warmachine and X-Wing yes, Age of Sigmar just does not happen.

I mean, $94,800,000 USD USD profit, must mean that they are doing more than something right. Not too many miniature companies can boast of that.

So pre-tax dollars and I would bet that Fantasy Flight profits are far higher.

X-Wing
Armada
Imperial Assualt
Runewars

Plus all of their other board games.

I will tell you that between GW and Fantasy Flight…

Fantasy Flight has gotten a bit of money from me while GW has gotten none over the last decade.

Plus CMoN has gotten nearly four figures from me due to their kickstarters.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP09 Jan 2019 1:19 p.m. PST

If you haven't bought anything from GW for a decade, how do you know if AoS is following canon or not?

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP11 Jan 2019 10:24 a.m. PST

Wow, two days and no response. That must have been a particularly painful burn.

The H Man12 Jan 2019 2:16 p.m. PST

Perhaps he felt he had said his piece.

I'm sure he was not waiting around for people's replies, then making snide comments.

Good on him.

You don't need to buy books to read them. Last time I was in a GW store, back when they were actually open, they had copies you could read.

I feel deus ex machina kills cannon.

"…then the world blew up!"

I'm sure the campaign led up to it, but as a whole, and certainly in the real world of GW, it was not cannon as it was just made up to solve whatever business issue they had at the time. Any fluff was written to achieve that, not to be part of cannon.

From that point forward it made its own cannon, not directly linked to the former cannon.

Confusing, I know, and it would not have been the first time GW went off cannon. Where are the Zoats? Are squats finally coming back? So on. Bretonnia have machines, now they don't, now they do, now they're dead.

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP13 Jan 2019 9:36 a.m. PST

Let me get this straight. You think that someone who reads a forum called Warhammer, when that person does not buy anything Warhammer, and has not for 10 years and hates, no dislikes or is not a fan of but actually hates, the company that makes it, is on the forum to do anything but make snide comments?

There are plenty of GW stores open. Over 500 of them.

link

If you live in the UK, there is probably one within an hour's drive of you.

"Any fluff was written to achieve that, not to be part of cannon."

As is true in almost any continuously running storyline.

A huge change in the structure of the fiction does not change cannon. Any fluff written by any company that is trying to make money is going to be a business decision. I don't even know why that would have to be said.

Comic book companies do this all the time. DC seemingly reboots its universe every three years or so now.

Soap Operas do it to write out characters whose actors leave the show.

Even the church has done it. The new testament was the reboot of the old. Vatican 2 went through and redid some stuff.

And on and on and on.

What GW did with AoS is not very confusing at all. Sure there were minor changes in lines here and there but you can still use Brettonians in AoS. As a matter of fact the rules are free on the GW website.

"You don't need to buy books to read them." Maybe some people don't. Clearly you do. Or maybe it is that you have not used the methods that you know to read them for free to read them at all.

Obviously you are out of touch with what is going on at GW.

The H Man13 Jan 2019 3:11 p.m. PST

I was just pointing out your snide comment, as it was obvious to me.

I'll avoid religion, as I believe it's banned here.

I was commenting that my local GW is never open when I pass. Only open a few days a week and not all day. It used to seem 24/7 so many years back. Add to that local ones are moving from malls into back alleys, where I don't frequent.

With the fluff, I mean that, while they make up new stuff to make money every day, a new troop here a new weapon choice there, blowing up the world and replacing one game and game world with what is essentially another, goes far, far, beyond that. It was not a regular day to day business decision. You don't just scrap over a decade of ip, fans, customers, potential sales, so on, on a whim.

You could use tiddlywinks to play the games. The fact whole armies are dropped is no small thing, even if you can still use the models, many of which are no longer even available for GW, in some fashion.

If I was out of touch with GW, I would be their biggest fan.

Mithmee Supporting Member of TMP13 Jan 2019 7:33 p.m. PST

when that person does not buy anything Warhammer

Why would I want too buy anything from them?

I do not like any of their current miniatures at all, they are too expensive and I have over 1200+ of their older stuff which is far better.

They have only killed off more games and screwed over most of their customers at one point or another in the last two decades.

You like GW and still want to give them more of your money.

Well I and many others don't and refuse to give them any of our money.

But there are other manufactures and gaming companies who do get our money.

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP14 Jan 2019 9:16 a.m. PST

"I was just pointing out your snide comment, as it was obvious to me."

So you can't actually answer the question then? I thought that might be the case.


"I was commenting that my local GW is never open when I pass. Only open a few days a week and not all day. It used to seem 24/7 so many years back. Add to that local ones are moving from malls into back alleys, where I don't frequent."

I don't think they can help when you walk past. The local one here is open from 11-7 Wed-Saturday and 12-6 on Sunday. I would imagine that is pretty standard.

I'd guess that this "seems" business is due to being out of touch with reality on your part as it was probably never open 24/7.

" You don't just scrap over a decade of ip, fans, customers, potential sales, so on, on a whim."

And they didn't. They increased sales, so potential sales were certainly not scrapped. They still have a ton of fans, the fantasy game has more fans than ever, customers too.

The armies that are no longer in production were probably not selling very well and they decided to focus on others. The fact that you can still use your old armies and play them for free is pretty great actually.

Games Workshop is a business. I know you don't really understand what that means, but the fact that they are still making games means that figures you bought 30 years ago can still be used in their games.

There are not too many other companies like that out there.

I suspect it is not just GW that you are out of touch with.


"Why would I want too buy anything from them?"

Because they make the best models out there at the best price, of course.

"They have only killed off more games and screwed over most of their customers at one point or another in the last two decades."

More games than what or who?

"You like GW and still want to give them more of your money."

I do. I've spent more money with GW since September than I spent on my first car. I dropped almost a grand on Adeptus Titanicus alone and from the fun I've had with it it has been worth every penny spent.

"Well I and many others don't and refuse to give them any of our money."

But you keep spending your time on this forum, which is interesting in the sense that time = money, so you kind of are spending your money on them, in that the time you spend on here could be used to make money.

"But there are other manufactures and gaming companies who do get our money."

Maybe, but very few of them get as much money as GW does.

Mithmee Supporting Member of TMP15 Jan 2019 10:48 p.m. PST

They still have a ton of fans, the fantasy game has more fans than ever,

I would bet that there where far more Fantasy players back in the 1990's then there is today.

As I have stated many times AoS is not being played in my area; but X-Wing, and Warmachine are.

Because they make the best models out there at the best price, of course.

They neither have the best miniatures or the best price at all. They are making a profit because they are gouging their customers and piece mealing out their products.

More games than what or who?

Really!

I sought you were someone who knew everything about GW.

Maybe, but very few of them get as much money as GW does.

GW can only wish to get as much as Asmodee makes in profits.

link

Asmodee is the owner of Fantasy Flight games and is one to the reasons why GW will never contend with them.

Better games = greater sales.

The H Man16 Jan 2019 2:47 p.m. PST

Actually Pics, I don't recall making any snide comments. A few jokes here and there among my posts, sure. It is you, posting on another topic re Mantic, when you suggest you know nothing about it, who may fit the bill best.

The shops used to be open almost every day, only early Sundays. They are not open much these days and are not in good locations.

They scrapped their flagship game, thus I was correct. Any success of aos does not change that, or any negative impact sustained.

"Games Workshop is a business. I know you don't really understand what that means"

At least I know not to take you seriously. If I needed proof, there it is.

"Because they make the best models out there at the best price, of course."

Pure fiction.

A. You have to like plastic and resin. Also, you have to like scfi and fantasy. Remember a great many minis made are metal historicals.

B. They are not the best priced plastic or resin figures, unless by best you mean highest.

C. Much of them are cgi figures, I would suspect. Thus not hand made, certainly not hand cast, being plastic. Resins may be hand sculpted and cast.

D. Plastic and the resin used are not natural materials (this means something to a growing number of people).

E. Other things I forgot.

Personal logo Pictors Studio Sponsoring Member of TMP19 Jan 2019 8:06 p.m. PST

"More games than what or who?
Really!

I sought you were someone who knew everything about GW."

Mithmee, you said

"They have only killed off more games and screwed over most of their customers at one point or another in the last two decades."

I'm asking you: than who? Simple question. You said they "killed off more games." More games than who?


Okay, Asmodee makes more money than GW. I didn't say there were no companies that did. I said there were not many who did. Name a bunch of others and I'll concede the point. Name a bunch of other miniature gaming companies that make more money than GW.

"They are making a profit because they are gouging their customers and piece mealing out their products."

This is absurd and shows you haven't bought GW in more than 10 years.

They are certainly not gouging anyone. Look up the definition of price gouging.

"Actually Pics, I don't recall making any snide comments. A few jokes here and there among my posts, sure. It is you, posting on another topic re Mantic, when you suggest you know nothing about it, who may fit the bill best."

Well, I was referring to mithmee, but if you thought the shoe fit . . .


"They scrapped their flagship game, thus I was correct. "

Maybe you are suffering from some memory loss, like about how you said the store seemed to be open 24/7 but here is what you said before:

"From that point forward it made its own cannon, not directly linked to the former cannon."

The new canon is directly linked to the former cannon. Your own ignorance of anything GW is what allows you to make absurd and flat out wrong statements like that above.

You were not correct, you were 100% wrong. The current story line in AoS is so directly linked to the old that many of the same characters are in it carrying it forward.

You might not need to buy books to read them but you do need to read them.


"A. You have to like plastic and resin. Also, you have to like scfi and fantasy. Remember a great many minis made are metal historicals."

It would be hard to forget since I actually make metal historical miniatures.

What do any of your other points have to do with anything?

Especially this one:

"D. Plastic and the resin used are not natural materials"

Because the metal alloy that other comprises metal figures is a natural material?

Do we have seems of perfect alloy for casting figures underground somewhere?

Is there anything you know anything about?

Borderguy19020 Jan 2019 4:07 p.m. PST

Why do you waste your time PS? Haters gonna hate.

I am not a fan of AoS, but I'm still buying models to finish my 5 fantasy armies. The models look better than every, too good in fact. I keep thinking about adding an army or three despite not even playing with the ones I have.

I stifled H and Mith months and months ago bc everything they post is just complaints and hating. Like you said, "if you hate GW, why browse a thread on GW?"

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