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"Koenig Krieg rules question" Topic


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481 hits since 18 Sep 2018
©1994-2018 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

von Schwartz19 Sep 2018 6:06 p.m. PST

I currently have two copies of Koenig Krieg, one is copyright 1982 and the other appears to be a updated edition of undetermined date. The question is, the newer version penalizes "Irregular cavalry" such as Grenz Hussars and Cossacks by requiring them to remain in skirmish formation at all times and therefore they receive no melee die and no modification in a melee, they simply use their current morale, the same number as if they were Att/Def in road column. The older version has no such rule. Why would Cossacks and especially Grenz Hussars be treated in this fashion? Are they saying that they never charged, or never charged in formation, or that they were inherently inferior quality cavalry?

von Schwartz19 Sep 2018 6:06 p.m. PST

I currently have two copies of Koenig Krieg, one is copyright 1982 and the other appears to be a updated edition of undetermined date. The question is, the newer version penalizes "Irregular cavalry" such as Grenz Hussars and Cossacks by requiring them to remain in skirmish formation at all times and therefore they receive no melee die and no modification in a melee, they simply use their current morale, the same number as if they were Att/Def in road column. The older version has no such rule. Why would Cossacks and especially Grenz Hussars be treated in this fashion? Are they saying that they never charged, or never charged in formation, or that they were inherently inferior quality cavalry?

von Schwartz19 Sep 2018 6:09 p.m. PST

Sorry, don't know why this seems to do this to me on new posts.

dragon620 Sep 2018 8:14 a.m. PST

I don't know the answer but you might try the TMP Koenig Krieg Forum TMP link

von Schwartz20 Sep 2018 5:09 p.m. PST

Thanks, didn't know there was a forum.

von Schwartz20 Sep 2018 5:36 p.m. PST

Well, I tried the forum link, lots of good info such as the fact that there appears to be a lot of different editions, at least three and some appendices such as additional army lists.
I tried to submit my question but the screen never came up to write my question. So, I leave it here and if anyone else has any ideas or comments, please let me know.

Mr Steve Inactive Member21 Sep 2018 3:18 a.m. PST

There have been a few versions of these rules over the years, currently at v3, my set has this printed on the front page but I cannot see any date anywhere relating to this update. A new v4 set is in process which according to their facebook page (26th August) has gotten as far as editing.

link

"Yay! Koenig Krieg is currently undergoing its first edit by a very good friend and editor, Phil Petty…. Just a quick update!"

I have both Cossacks and Turkish Irregular cavalry in my Russo-Ottoman armies.

Yes they can only be in Skirmish order and get no dice or +1 for melee as they are not formed light cavalry.

Why? This is only my opinion so feel free to disagree but their purpose is not to be battle cavalry but to be extremely annoying. They can charge if an opportunity presents itself but not head on against infantry or formed cavalry. On table they are both quicker (more operations) and easier to move so I try to get them around flanks to disrupt the enemies plans as no one wants people behind them or on the flank when there are troops bearing down on them from the front. You would of course get the x2 bonus for flank or rear. They are also very good at getting rid of pesky light infantry rather than wasting much better types. But don't get caught by battle cavalry as you try and work your way around as happened in my last game.

I cannot comment on Grenz Hussars as I have never looked into their history and generally as you probably already know light and skirmish troops were aimed at raiding and scouting (known as Kleiner Krieg) away from the main battlefields.
On the plus side they are amazingly cheap in points and being independent they don't need to be in command. We also don't count them towards army morale as they are not a Brigade.(my interpretation)

von Schwartz21 Sep 2018 11:49 a.m. PST

Thank you Mr Steve, very interesting and some tips on how to use my Grenz Hussars. Still, odd that they didn't have that "skirmish order only" in the first edition, but I guess that why they are sometimes referred to as "revised editions".

von Schwartz22 Sep 2018 12:26 p.m. PST

My oldest copy refers to Mikes Models USA 1982 on the cover (now there's a Blast from the Past), the second copy has no such notation but it does contain rules and charts for Festung Krieg, La Guerre Du Roi, and Der Grosse Koenig in addition to Koenig Krieg. Any idea which edition/version that could be?

Mr Steve Inactive Member23 Sep 2018 1:08 p.m. PST

I suspect you have similar copies as per the attached link below :

link

My copy has a front page as per the picture in our club game report.

link

I am not sure where the 'picture editor' got that picture from , probably the old KK website, because my actual pdf set isn't quite identical.
My text reads:
Version 3
By
Siege Works Studios

elsewhere I have found out that the publication date was 2007 , I am afraid that the Mikes Models ad has been dropped from this edition.
link

The other bits you mention have unfortunately been dropped out of v3 however they are due to return in v4

von Schwartz24 Sep 2018 6:05 p.m. PST

Very interesting, loved the links and would like to get the v4 set but NOT at $65 USD a throw. I think I payed somewhere around $12 USD for the oldest version in 1982 and $25 USD or there abouts for the newest version sometime around 2005-2005 I think. There appears to be some changes from even my newest to the one described in the last link.
My GOD I don't believe I paid that much for some collectors editions of Gunther Rothenburg's studies of the Austrian frontier troops and the hardcover editions of Armies of Maria Theresa and the Armies of Frederick the Great, both unfortunately lost in the Great Migration of 2010 when I moved to the wilds of central Florida.

Mr Steve Inactive Member26 Sep 2018 11:36 a.m. PST

neither would I but fortunately I was able to agree a deal for a PDF version at a greatly reduced price however it was a few years ago so I don't remember how much I paid. Siegeworks realized that hard copy shipping from Australia was so prohibitive that any future sets would need to be arranged from nearer to their markets so v4 will be available from North Star in the UK.
link

von Schwartz02 Oct 2018 3:18 p.m. PST

Any idea as to where to get such a copy without having to send my oldest male child out to work in the mines?

Mr Steve Inactive Member03 Oct 2018 10:56 a.m. PST

I am disappointed that said chid is not already down the mines earning a pittance but I suppose that's the soft ways we have to get used to now that we are in the 21st Centaury.

I am afraid that Siegeworks pulled all further sales of KK pending the much delayed arrival of Version 4. They are no longer available from their own website and they didn't pass them over to North Star when they agreed the deal for KK and Grand Battles Napoleon.

link

von Schwartz04 Oct 2018 10:52 a.m. PST

c'est la querre

I'll just need to be patient. Patience doesn't suit me though.

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