"Rule sets and chariots" Topic

I have a collection of Hittite/NKE which have been stored in a box in the closet for several years waiting for a set of rules that provides a good feel for chariot warfare…anything new and promising? How does To the Strongest work for chariot warfare?
Mark

What scale? Pictures?

6mm Baccus — hoping to play large scale battles
Mark

I like Warmaster Ancients for this period, but that's just me.

I'd like to have a rule set which differentiates between NKE, Hittite, Syrian and Myceanian chariots and so gives each army a unique feel, tactics and challenges

I'm using Hail Caesar Rules.

As always, comments are appreciated.

Take care

Andy

What do you think the differences are supposed to be between NKE, Hittite, Syrian and Myceanian Chariots modelled in a large scale battle?

I play a set of rules (Triumph!) which definitely gives a difference between those armies, but Chariots are either missile platforms or battlefield transports. It models the interaction of the Chariots and the masses of low quality troop types well in my opinion.

It does not dive into the specifics like the difference between suspensions on a Hittite vs. NKE Chariot.

You posit that there is no difference in the chariot arms and their usage between NKE, Hittites, Hurrians or Syrians? That makes things pretty dull.
All WWII armies used tanks — so all the same? I'd like to see at least some differentiation attempts made, even if it's in optional or house rules.

You posit that there is no difference in the chariot arms and their usage between NKE, Hittites, Hurrians or Syrians? That makes things pretty dull.
All WWII armies used tanks — so all the same? I'd like to see at least some differentiation attempts made, even if it's in optional or house rules.

No I asked what difference did you expect to see modelled in a mass scale battle. After you posted:

6mm Baccus — hoping to play large scale battles

And

I'd like to have a rule set which differentiates between NKE, Hittite, Syrian and Myceanian chariots

It is a question of detail. WWII Tanks varied, but zoom out far enough and they can be modelled as light, medium and heavy tanks as an example. If you zoom in and play "What a Tanker" then sure the differences in individual tanks are important. Zoom out and how many tanks and how they were deployed and intermixed with the other troops becomes important.

Hittites, Syrians, and NKE used Chariots primarily as missile platforms. Mycenaeans used them as missile platforms or battlefield transports depending on the time frame. Arguably the NKE Chariot at the time of the battle of Kadesh was the pinnacle of Chariot technology. This is speculatively what we think we know, we have pretty good information on NKE Chariot technology, not sure how good our information in on the others.

The rule system I use for mass battles differentiates between the use of Chariots as missile platforms and battlefield transports in how they interact with the different troop types they encounter. It does not differentiate in the performance of a Hittite Chariot and an NKE Chariot because zoomed out to the level of a mass battle they are assumed to perform in a similar manner. So the superior spoke design and axle placement of the NKE Chariot do not enter into the rules.

The games army list do differentiate in the makeup of the armies. The ratio of different troop types and the number of Chariots available to each. So a Hittite army will not have the same make up as an NKE army. Therefore the armies play differently on the battlefield. You need different tactics, different deployment, and even prefer different terrain. This difference is not in the "rules" on how the Chariots function by army, but is inherent in the performance of the overall army and how the general then utilizes the available troops. I do not find it dull at all.

We have played the battle of Kadesh with these rules multiple times and it was quite an interesting fight.

Most "modern/new" rule systems (To the strongest, Field of Glory, Mortem et Gloriam, Art de la Guerre…) distinguish between different chariot using armies, but not in a complex technological way. Chariots (and other troops as well) are defined by "class", "drill" and "weapons", maybe one or two extra rules. So you might have ten different combinations that you could find, but on first sight those differences would not seem very "colourful". Only when playing one will realize if those differences mean much in a certain rules system, or not.

I recon WAB and its successors have most potential to go into detail about differences, but at least Clash of Empires does not. That system sticks to describing chariots a similar weapons with (on first sight) minor differences between states/cultures (but with differences nevertheless).

You can check out army lists here link and here link

Warhammer Ancient Battles made a separate "Chariot Wars" supplement book. That might be something of interest to you.

If you learn the tactics of each army then have them play that way you will then differentiate between them better.

We just used To the Strongest for a game pitting Assyrians against Egyptians and Hittites. The rules worked well; chariots act as both missile platforms, and possibly shock troops (in the case of the Hittites and Assyrians). Heavy Assyrian chariots are very tough.