| Tango01 | 11 Jun 2018 10:51 a.m. PST |
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 Legion 4  | 11 Jun 2018 3:34 p.m. PST |
The US ARMY was still using them in '78 when I was a Ft. Lewis, WA. There were even some with a US ADA unit at Khe Sahn … Supporting the USMC … |
| Lion in the Stars | 11 Jun 2018 4:27 p.m. PST |
I'm surprised that the Army isn't *still* using the beasts, but my guess is that they've all been broken down for the .50cal guns. I know my friend in the Army had a 1950-vintage .50cal still in use at the Stryker school! |
| Mark 1 | 11 Jun 2018 6:56 p.m. PST |
> US WWII 4x 12.7mm M2HB Turret Can't say about current practice, but I am PRETTY darned sure the US didn't have a 12.7mm M2HB in WWII. > I know my friend in the Army had a 1950-vintage .50cal still in use at the Stryker school! Yep. Feels much better when it's called a .50cal. Never saw it called a 12.7mm in WWII US Army parlance. And before anyone goes off on "Mr. Picky" … in WWII the British had a 17pdr gun, the US had a 76mm gun and a 3-inch gun, and the Soviets had 76.2mm guns. They all had the same bore, but they were different calibers, different cartridges, different capabilities. Much easier if you don't call them all 76.2mm and leave it to the reader's imagination as to which gun you are talking about. [/rant mode] -Mark |
| 4th Cuirassier | 12 Jun 2018 4:13 a.m. PST |
@ Mark Don't forget the British 77mm in the Comet, which was a 76.2mm but was called a 77mm to distinguish it from the 17-pounder, which was a 76.2mm. I'm sure it made perfect sense to someone somewhere. The award for misnaming a weapon must go to the IJN, which had a naval rifle officially called the Special 16-inch. What was "special" about it was that it was in fact an 18-inch weapon. I always think these deliberate misnamings are fun. The Upkeep bouncing bomb was described as a "mine", which it isn't really; strictly it's surely a depth charge delivered in an unconventional manner. Likewise the acoustic homing torpedo that Allied ASW aircraft dropped from 1943 was called a "Mark XII Mine" when it wasn't of course a mine at all. In all these cases they had a good excuse though, which was to mislead the other side as to the nature of the weapon should they get to hear of them. The 17-pounder / 77mm / 76.2mm / 3-inch thing does a fine job of confusing me. Does anyone know if the idea (or part of it) was to dissuade gun crews from loading the wrong type of ammo? I'd have guessed that you couldn't fire a 3-inch round from a 17-pounder but that is only a guess. |
| Legion 4 | 12 Jun 2018 7:21 a.m. PST |
Well many of the tracks, trucks, etc., still used the M2 in '78 – '90 … When I was in the US Army … 
And from what I understand … the US and many other NATO forces, etc., still do. But IIRC the newer M2s, didn't have to set "Headspace & Timing" … That was a real PIA IIRC … !
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| Walking Sailor | 13 Jun 2018 6:48 a.m. PST |
The 122mm Guards Mortar (Katyusha) is actually 120mm. At the premier of the newly invented 120mm Multiple Rocket Launcher, with senior members of STAVKA present, they opened up boxes of 120mm mortar ammunition. Oops… I don't know who got to tell that to the the assembled guests but it must have been a good day to get out of The Kremlin. First Comrade Stalin simply "suggested" that they relabel the new weapon 122mm to prevent future confusion.
And now you know, "The Rest of The Story". |
| Fred Cartwright | 13 Jun 2018 8:36 a.m. PST |
And before anyone goes off on "Mr. Picky" … in WWII the British had a 17pdr gun, the US had a 76mm gun and a 3-inch gun, and the Soviets had 76.2mm guns. They all had the same bore, but they were different calibers, different cartridges, different capabilities. Much easier if you don't call them all 76.2mm and leave it to the reader's imagination as to which gun you are talking about. Well Mr Picky they are all the same calibre. Calibre refers to the internal diameter of the gun. They were however different lengths, which could be expressed in calibre lengths ie. L55 which would be 76.2 x 55, or just in feet/inches or meters. |
| Tango01 | 13 Jun 2018 11:39 a.m. PST |
Thanks!. Amicalement
Armand |
| Lion in the Stars | 13 Jun 2018 4:30 p.m. PST |
But IIRC the newer M2s, didn't have to set "Headspace & Timing" … That was a real PIA IIRC … ! That's the M2A1. There might be a few non-modified M2s left in the lockers someplace, but I'm honestly surprised it took so long to realize that machine tools were now precise enough and consistent enough to allow for headspace set at the factory. M2A1s didn't get deployed until 2004 or so! |
| Wolfhag | 13 Jun 2018 5:08 p.m. PST |
I remember guys talking about checking the .50 headspace on the perimeter of a firebase in VN. Wolfhag |
| Legion 4 | 14 Jun 2018 6:31 a.m. PST |
but I'm honestly surprised it took so long to realize that machine tools were now precise enough and consistent enough to allow for headspace set at the factory. I agree it shouldn't have taken so long with the USA's tech/industrial capabilities to "fix" that … M2A1s didn't get deployed until 2004 or so! I was long gone by then. ETS'd in '90 … I remember guys talking about checking the .50 headspace on the perimeter of a firebase in VN. Yeah, with .50s that was standard … and could be a PIA … I had 15 in my M113 Mech Co., '87-'89 … Also IIRC I read the French at DBP has some Quad .50s too … Again the original designed was for ADA/AAA, but it will cut swathes thru massed Infantry formations, e.g. Viet Minh, VC, etc. And a .50 will chew thru bricks like peanut brittle … as well as the flank/rear of a BMP, etc., … |
| deephorse | 14 Jun 2018 6:50 a.m. PST |
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| Legion 4 | 14 Jun 2018 7:32 a.m. PST |
ETS = End Time in Service … sorry … again …  |
likes the look of the Soviet KV-1 tank, and plunges into a project to paint three of them - plus a spare KV-2 turret!
