"Is this for real?" Topic

Ummm…
Grimdark go PG?

link

Yep… Its the latest ploy from the Child Catcher… It turns out that GW aren't that interested in adult 'hobbyists' – too discerning I guess…

It is. If you have a look on YouTube you will see quite a bit of comment. Be forewarned it has caused some polarisation; A full on outbreak of rabies in some cases.

ok…backs away slowly

When did the Mouse buy GW?

Slaanesh is going to be a bit of a hard sell in this context I think ;-)

After living through the transition from Rogue Trader to the shiny cartoony mess of 2nd edition, this does not seem like such a big deal.

I'm sure they did their marketing focus groups, and it was positive. Personally, I'm glad to see GW changing into a more contemporary company and broadening their base and products.

Green Tiger: just the opposite. This branding at a young age makes great marketing sense. Basic stuff, really.

Why all the fuss? GW is merely "prepping" the next generation of potential gamers. Preteens comprise a demographic GW hasn't targeted before. Introducing them to and immersing them in the "rich" worlds of AoS and 40K through stories at a young age can pay dividends in the long run.

We're not talking Phillip Morris marketing cigarettes to kids here.

Amen, Fanatik.

"Horton hears a Heretic"…
"James and the Giant Tzeentch"…
"Harry Potter and the Prisoner of Khorne"…
"Abaddon and the terrible, horrible, no good very bad day"…

I'm not sure why there is any debate about this. Star Wars did exactly the same thing. Certainly there are probably some aspects of the 40K universe and, certainly, there are some of the AoS world, that could be interpreted to younger potential gamers.

" It turns out that GW aren't that interested in adult 'hobbyists' – too discerning I guess…"

It would seem that the opposite is true. GW has turned back towards a lot of its adult fans and have re-released many products that people have been craving as well as releasing a number of things that are for the very discerning gamer, like the Horus Heresy stuff.

Something tells me this may be closer to the mark that we may have feared.

My take on this is that GW is marketing this towards the adult players who have children. "Hey now my children and I can share something in common, look what I bought for the kids honey". Is it for me? No, but I'm pretty sure that GW knows exactly what they're doing here. TBH this is how I've viewed their stuff for quite a while now.

To be completely clear about this, I do like the idea.
I sorta fell out from 40,000 right about the change from 4th to 5th edition. But it was the Battle for Vedros line that got me interested again.

WHFB I stuck with all the way until the end of 7th, I think. Was that was when all the Army Books went hardback?
I just couldn't afford the books and minis and etc.
But Age of Sigmar got me interested once again, with it's free rules and free Warscrolls.

Age of Sigmar, the basic game without all the Handbook stuff, Battle for Vedros, and now whatever this edition of 40,000 is. Are much easier to learn and teach youngsters.

I wouldn't call them family friendly games for Family Game Night. But if you have a kid interested in this stuff anyways
than I don't think there has ever been easier route into "The GW Hobby". Even the "Easy to Build" lines are expanding and making even the model building more accessible to younger hands.

I have no problem letting my daughter go to town painting a 3-man team of Primaris Marines at around $12 USD a box (discount pricing of course). But I know she is not ready for gluing stuff together. Both super glue and plastic glue give off fumes harmful to health and not good for the developing brain.

My point is, GW showing a "lighter side" making it easier for younger audience is a good thing in my opinion.

I have played World War Tesla with my 13 year old daughter, but this? Nope. Something about Slaanesh demons says its not a good idea,and she wouldn't like it anyway. She cannot stand Star Wars, either.

Both super glue and plastic glue give off fumes harmful to health and not good for the developing brain.

Only if you sniff it. Directly. In a paper bag. Normal use shouldn't cause any problem. except if you have an allergy to any of the chemicals. The amount employed to glue a plastic figure is too small.

No great surprise and slightly surprising at the same time -clearly following a bit of a trend in kids books (one of the authors has written SW Wild Space stories). One assumes that 'gateway games' may follow.. Though I've thought creating a 'gateway game(s)' via licensing deal for one or other of the popular kids fantasy book series might be a more obvious approach as it taps an established audience. And removes the elephant in the room which is the very nature of GW's IP. Just doing a Google image on 40K would probably frighten the pants off a lot of non-gaming parents!

I reserve judgement until I have a book in my hands. My hope is that this will be similar to Star Wars Galaxy of Fear, incredibly dangerous situations featuring main characters with little actual agency in the event (because they were kids) that were very well done.

However I wonder if Black Library can actually write a book without hay to use the words "Brains" "Viscera" or "Crawling Flesh".

A complete failure of both theme and setting wrapped up in half ass effort to sell the IP! …Not that the IP hasn't already become a silly half-ass parody of itself anyway. …Just a natural progression these days…

billthecat where did you get your copies and how did you read them all so quickly.

billthecat where did you get your copies and how did you read them all so quickly.

Probably, he doesn't. It is just preventive hate.

Was about to hate on this, then remembered Space Crusade and Heroquest- this might actually be a really smart move. Whatever it is, it's probably better than having them glued to the TV/iPad/Facebook..

I'm certainly looking forward to this.

So, the truth finally surfaces.

Prepainted figs far behind? Maybe in skylander style?

Aos rich? Warhammer was rich. Aos is a baby.

Rereleasing and rewriting are two different things.

I wonder if this runs the risk of (further?) dumbing down GW games. Like with marvel, where its hard to see where the classic comics and all the modern movie stuff meet as its all so mixed up in such a mess.

I always thought 8-12s were GWs demographic? Well 10-15s maybe 10-20s at least. They still seemed to be at the young end of who I used to see filling their stores.

Perhaps its more that parents are not wanting to buy it for them, so, to save or increase sales for kids, they look to expand with another range?

Marvel and Lucasfilm did this as they have huge properties. Is GW big enough to be able to prolong and support such a similar offshoot? That may be the question.

A risk may be in kids growing up and viewing it (as some already do) as kids stuff. This approach may increase this view, as it would quite literally be kids stuff. Adults can buy Barbies, but most women don't.

So on…

"A risk may be in kids growing up and viewing it (as some already do) as kids stuff. This approach may increase this view, as it would quite literally be kids stuff. Adults can buy Barbies, but most women don't."

Yes because all those adults that bought Star Wars toys as kids avoid Star Wars stuff like the plague now.

Transformers has only had so many sequels because it is little kids that are interested in it.

Admittedly the GI Joe movies didn't do so well but they were terrible.

AoS does have a rich background. If you don't think so you really are ignorant of the material. It has the whole history of Warhammer to pull from.

The Old World may have existed as most of that but certainly it developed much of the fantasy stuff that continues and is improved in AoS. It has expanded that stuff in addition to improving on it.

AoS is a far richer background to mine for gaming than the Old World.

Star wars was not aimed at kiddies.

Correct, Transformers newer stuff has young appeal. Many G1 fans avoid it.

The GI Joe films were not at all like the original franchise, nor were they made for kiddies. Hence their problem.

Ignorance is bliss. However Fantasy battles was around for what, 20 plus years? Aos about 5? The background for Aos could not possibly be as rich as Fantasy, with all its white dwarfs, rules editions, army books editions, novels, comics, rpg, computer games, so on… Unless quite a lot has happened in about 5 years???

Before we turn this into another debate over the subjective merits of GW's current vs old game storylines, let's get back on topic.

I think it is entirely possible for a story which is dark and violent to be retold in a more sanitized manner for children.

Think Greek mythology – it's full of really sordid stuff. As a kid, I read lots of children's books on Greek mythology – they were sanitized, of course, and rightly so. But this does not mean that if you give a kid a book about Greek mythology, you're going to start them on the road to reading about adultery, murder, the feeding of children to their parents, incest, and overall Olympian level depravity.

40k as a story does not depend on blood and skulls, and certainly not Slaanesh. It really does not. Nor do you need to focus on fanatically purging xenos and heretics and exterminating mutants. GW is free to do whatever they want by setting up a separate, self-contained line of fiction that removes most of the overt unpleasantness of the original.

As for the risk of kids seeing Warhammer as kids stuff after they grow up, this is already a problem that everyone (Especially GW) is keenly aware of. Plenty of kids give up on miniatures after growing up and never look back. These kids weren't going to stay tabletop wargamers anyway. However, it does not mean that they won't buy Warhammer for their own kids.

I plan to introduce my kids to Warhammer in a few years if these books are still available. They already know about my good space marines (Ultramarines) and bad space marines (Word Bearers), and I can guide their introduction into other aspects of the setting where appropriate, if they want to explore it. And I don't ever have to mention Slaaneshii perversions.

The whole dumbing down debate is hardly new. Space Fleet, Ultramarines, Kerruch and related titles kick started it back in 1991! And Space Fleet was clearly popular enough for them to run a bunch of WD articles and produce additional miniatures.

In the UK at the moment there is some heat around the subject of boy's, and kids generally, reading. I'm fairly sure GW are getting in to kids literature out of altruism, but I have noticed that they aren't afraid of getting into projects part funded by grants…

Miniature wargaming is often viewed by many as for kids. This is not helping. As far a GW it may actually turn some potential adult customers away, if this new idea is the first thing they see.

Another thing. Its called Warhammer adventures. Not Warhammer 40,000 adventures. ??? Is there some writing on the wall there? I see 40k characters, but I must be missing something? There must be a reason for the name. Dropping or merging AOS spring to mind quickly. It can't be just because they name stores warhammer, as they also sell lord of the rings and it would conflict with Aos also. Warhammer is 40k and Aos. Interesting.

Warhammer- Stories From The Far Future
Warhammer- Stories In An Age Of Fantasy
I think it's pretty clear what's what…
Lighter fare for younger minds. Pretty obvious that they're building up future market shares.
Getting back to the question on Marvel Comics- it's been made clear for some time now that Marvel (and I believe DC as well) have said that the Marvel Cinematic Universe (and DC Extended Universe) are alternate universes from the comics universes.
Fairly easy to deduce, if you think about it….

"I see 40k characters, but I must be missing something? "

From your comments on here, it is pretty clear that you are missing almost everything.

"Ignorance is bliss."

I hope you are enjoying your nirvana-like state then.

I was looking for answers not ridicule.

Thanks to capt flash for providing.

As for the comics, of course the films are not consistent with the comics. They are only based on the comics. But, then most of the comics are not consistent either. I just meant that with all the film fan fare, its easy to forget where the characters came from or what they originally were like. The films also have and make far more money than the comics ever will, so they get pushed pretty hard.

For instance, I only recently got hold of some original TMNT comics. If there was ever a series that was overshadowed by TV and film adaptations. But they made far more than the comics and most people only remember the adaptations, as cool as they were…are.

>>>Star wars was not aimed at kiddies.

Pardon?

See "The Rescuers" thats a 1977 kids film.

The star wars films have wider appeal. They were certainly made to appeal to kids as much as anyone, but not at the cost of losing an adult audience. Most of the merchandise was aimed at kids, originally.

If you're looking for answers rather than just bashing GW, which I doubt, then even the smallest amount of investigation into AoS would show that the game incorporates everything that was in Warhammer and expands on it and doesn't limit it.

And 20+ years, try almost 35 years. The background for AoS has been building since 1984. All the development of the forces of Chaos, the forces of Death and Destruction has been building over all that time.

It has changed but the change allows more richness, it allows for players to add to the background themselves and create their own stories and places that the stories take place.

The Old World was much more limited in that sense. Certainly a player generated campaign that wiped out the Empire couldn't really happen in the fluff. Now it can because when that Empire falls, there are plenty of other types of civilizations around because it is so big.

And your statement that Star Wars is not aimed at kids is just straight up ignorance because it means one of two things, or at least implied it.

1. Star Wars was not aimed at kids and nothing Star Wars did was aimed at kids. Which is as you admit.

2. Warhammer is aimed at kids.

Your statement above could easily be rephrased now about Warhammer.

See "Big Bird in China" thats a 1983 kids film (sic.)

The Warhammer games have wider appeal. They were certainly not made to appeal to kids as much as anyone and were made originally to gain an adult or at least older teenage audience. Some small fraction of the current production is aimed at kids.

Massive amounts of Star Wars stuff was aimed at kids. The Christmas Special was aimed at kids. The toys were certainly not aimed at nostalgic 30 year olds in 1977.

The rights to make the toys were being shopped around in 1976, before the film came out and were obviously a massive part of the Star Wars franchise.

In 1978 they did a Christmas special which was not well received which seemed to be aimed in a more kid friendly direction.

And if you aren't looking for ridicule then stop giving it out.

"Ignorance is bliss."

You're totally ignorant about almost everything you've brought up. Calling you ignorant is not ridicule, you've proved that you just don't know what you're talking about.

Despite having a freaking Golden Book library Star Wars is still loved by people of almost all ages.

Your continued and thinly disguised trashing of GW is not adding to the conversation because the criticism is not well informed. You aren't looking for answers, if you were you would have done even the slightest bit of research before implying that others were ignorant and then looking so foolish when your own ignorance is pointed out.

My 10yr old is enjoying the book.

It's not ridicule- it is pointing out your hyperbole.
The points I made were simply one liners pointing out the obvious flaws in your comments.
As for the comics- the movies stand alone just fine for the general public. The cinematic universes are creating their own history.

Capt, (on ridicule) I was referring to Pics comments, which, unlike your own, were of no help what so ever.

In the grim darkness of the far future, there are only noogies.

I don't really see a problem with this. My kids would like these and there is still plenty of mature material in actual 40k/30k.

Besides – what some of you grognards are missing is the fact that children have been part of the 40k "lore" *cough* since RT.

Cadians called them "white shields" because "child soldier conscripts" was perhaps crossing one too many lines?

As for Star Wars not being made for kids ????

Lucas wanted them to evoke the feelings from HIS childhood with the SF serials in the mould of "captain video" and they did. The marketing of merch (mostly to kids – although I'm sure waaaaaay too many pubescent boys got the "slave leia" bubble bath …