"Dutch Horse Artillery Limber and Guns (28mm Waterloo)" Topic

Anyone interested in my experiences in building and rigging a horse artillery limber along with my half-battery build – please find it at the end of this – it's a two part posting. link.http://unluckygeneral.blogspot.com/2018/05/dutch-artillery-limber-and-guns-part-2.html

Sorry, the link didn't work out – scratching my head now.

this worked for me

link

It certainly "worked" for me. The Netherlands HA from Perrys were my first ever foray back into Napoleonics after a 30 year gap.

I had never heard of this weird pair until my two sons introduced me to LOTRs and Games Workshop…..
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Then somehow I heard that they had set up on their own.

I must congratulate you for doing the tracings/ropes…the tackle that pulls the guns.

No one does that because it is so confusing. You see the pole that sticks out between the two rear horses? You have the tip giving out a V shaped rope for the next two horses to pull. Actually, that V should be a metal chain attached to the two rear horses, dead centre, front of their bridle. It is to pull backwards not forwards. They were the only horses that could reverse.

The tip of that pole really had a single chain to the swingle pole, you show, that then connected to the next two horses. If that bothers you, then you are very sad and need to get out more. Thing about TMP is that you can learn things like this and then choose to totally dismiss, as absolute obsessionalism….or take note for the future.

I could add many a diagram, if you wish, but suspect you would tell me what to do with such. All I would say is how much I enjoyed your posting…everyone does HA of the French Imp Guard or RHA……..

Lovely stuff and very interesting, thanks for posting!

Nice work, but again, I suggest showing hollow on the wheels which are dished would add accuracy.

Liam. I think I may need a diagram. I have read and re-read your note and cannot quite get the arrangement clear. I like the idea of reversing horses though. And was this all limbers, or unique to the DBs ?

Thanks

Marc

That question about the harnessing of French (and indeed most countries that used the pole arrangement) artillery vehicles.

The first diagram shows the obvious, the horses are pulling the vehicle. The wheel horses have the central pole and are the strongest, of necessity. All pulling is through swingle trees, transverse wooden bars. The arrangement is a big single one giving off attachments to two smaller, one for each horse. The front of the pole is then attached to another large swingle tree, so when you think about it, the next two horses are still pulling the vehicle itself, not through the horses behind them. The snag now is that any additional horses contribute surprisingly little, as they are only pulling on the harness (not the collar) of the horses behind. All the forward force, the pull, is directed onto the collar of course, the bit we paint Artillery Green.

But what if we want to brake, going down a slope or even to reverse? Only the rear two horses can do that. Notice the chains hanging in a V shape in the main diagram? They contribute nothing when pulling. But reversing (lower diagram) the chains allow a rear pull, not through the collar obviously, it would be pulled straight off. Now you see why only the rear horses in every artillery set have a much more complex rear harness (as in the DB set above)….indeed only they have a massive horizontal strap running front to back, either side of their body………it is all something to take the strain of that reversing move. Most model limbers do have a little hook pointing forwards, now you also know what it is for.

Jouineau's diagram is far better

Of course the British………well that is another story

Ah ha – that makes sense now of that extra thick strap. Love the middle drawing Liam – reminds me of so many 28mm horse poses :-) So reversing, the load is taken on the straps over the horses' rumps (the multi straps we see on the rear most horse models). Silly isn't it – now you have pointed it out, it all makes sense, but up to now I never worked out why the rear horses had all that rump harness stuff going on – I just thought it was cool to paint.

Thanks for that – I shall try to pay more attention when I limber up now.

Yes, it is far more fun when you suddenly realise what all these different straps, chains, ropes etc all did.

I think it is worth remembering that, for the pre industrial age, a huge amount of thought and design when into the kit of the Napoleonic Wars, just limited by the materials available.

They already had the idea of breechloaders, but their metallurgy was not up to it. Even modern style rounds were not beyond them, with a fixed cartridge for artillery anyway, if not yet for infantry weapons.