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"Fall In F&I and AWI games?" Topic


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499 hits since 6 Nov 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

historygamer06 Nov 2017 8:35 a.m. PST

Did anyone here run any (18th century) games at Fall In?

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP06 Nov 2017 2:06 p.m. PST

The title doesn't match the text. The events list mentions six FIW and AWI events. There were also four other 18th Century battles listed--one Marlburian, two SYW and one early national period woodland wars.

Not much when you compare them with zombie games.

historygamer06 Nov 2017 6:53 p.m. PST

Here are the German gren battalions advancing on Birmingham Hill

picture

The Lights advance on the Crown left flank and overrun the Quaker Meeting house.

picture

Agnew's Brigade marches on in support

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Major General Agnew leads the 4th brigade

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Early morning writer06 Nov 2017 7:47 p.m. PST

Is the moral here that we need to run Zombie AWI and Zombie FIW games? If so, I'm throwing my miniatures away! To each their own but I'm heartily sick of hearing about zombies. Who gives an unwashed rats backside?!

Rant done, moving on.

historygamer07 Nov 2017 5:21 a.m. PST

I saw some nice looking AWI and F&I games. Hopefully they will post here as well.

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP07 Nov 2017 7:22 a.m. PST

Sorry, EMW. My thinking was exactly the opposite: when you start having more zombie games than AWI games at what is nominally a historical miniatures convention, I think something's gone wrong. But I think I'm a minority position within HMGS, so I'm enjoying the historical miniatures while there still are some, and not thinking too hard about the future.

95th Division Supporting Member of TMP07 Nov 2017 7:48 a.m. PST

My son and I ran a Sharp Practice AWI game set in the southern theater. I'll try and get some photos up once I get organized.

historygamer07 Nov 2017 7:56 a.m. PST

Robert:

It is still largely a historical game con. Though I generally share your feelings. :-)

95th – I look forward to seeing the photos. :-)

coopman07 Nov 2017 2:59 p.m. PST

What? You never heard of historical zombie gaming?

historygamer07 Nov 2017 3:23 p.m. PST

Here was a nice looking Fort Necessity game I saw:

picture

Early morning writer07 Nov 2017 8:35 p.m. PST

I'm starting to suspect most of the 'modern' converts to 'historical' gaming know no more about history than what is potted in the latest 'oh shiny' range of figures and/or rules and wouldn't have a clue how to do research on a 'period'. We who came to the hobby through kids games and then graduated to studying history and then playing it on the table top seem a dwindling few.

This is not a rant against people who arrive from the above path, just an observation. Perhaps in time some of them will convert. Times change.

What was that line, "Oh, we happy few"? Henry somebody?

Hafen von Schlockenberg Supporting Member of TMP08 Nov 2017 6:14 a.m. PST

Him?

picture

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP08 Nov 2017 7:27 a.m. PST

historygamer, it's running on momentum--a general miniatures convention, still attended by a number of historical gamers because--except for the SYWA Con--there are no historical miniatures gaming conventions. They put "historical" in the name of the society, but nothing about how the conventions are run prioritizes historical gaming.

Enjoy it while it lasts, but expect more zombies, dragons and space marines every year, and fewer historical miniatures.

dantheman Supporting Member of TMP08 Nov 2017 10:19 a.m. PST

Early morning writer. Good observation, Our hobby is graying. Zombie is ok if I can play my games. Not a problem for me if we get crossovers. We are dwindling as the cons reveal. Wonder what is happening in Britain?

In a hobby store nearby me kids came looking for a fantasy game. The owner told him up the stairs past the arguing old men. We have an marketing and imaging problem in our hobby.

95th Division Supporting Member of TMP08 Nov 2017 12:13 p.m. PST

I've started a blog called Miniature Soldiers and Stuff. Here is the link to my first post. It contains some photos from the AWI game at Fall-In.

https://minysoldiers.blogspot.com

Supercilius Maximus In the TMP Dawghouse09 Nov 2017 9:52 a.m. PST

Wonder what is happening in Britain?

Not sure about the regional shows, but Salute this year was far more Sci-FI/Fantasy (and considerably less historical) than it has ever been before.

One thing I would say in its favour is that such games do attract more female players.

Well done to those who put on AWI games – they looked superb.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP09 Nov 2017 4:14 p.m. PST

Lets get a grip here.
I suppose I could look at my printed program and do some math, but I'm not the one complaining. Not my job. grin

What is the TOTAL number of games in the program?
What is the TOTAL number of zombie games in the program?
What is the TOTAL number of AWI/FIW games in the program.

AWI and FIW games have always been a very small percentage of Games run at conventions. So much that when I have free time, there's never a game available!
Plenty of Napoleonic games, plenty if Ancients, plenty of WWII, plenty of ACW…… and a few AWI games starting an hour too early.

Let's not get carried away about number of AWI Games. It's not the AWI Miniature Gamers Association after all.

historygamer10 Nov 2017 9:36 a.m. PST

Someone posted that 18% of the games at FI were not historical military games. It may (or may not) have been higher as apparently this con has a massive amount of no-show games. According to the convention director, he said the number of no-show games equaled all the other ones combined for the FIs he has run. Some of the no-shows were likely also not historical as well.

The old anecdotal number of non-historical games at HMGS cons was 10%. The all-time high, as far as I know, was about 28%. Now I think that number hovers around 20%, though it is really hard to say if you factor in the cancelled (including no-show) games and pick up games. There was some sort of fantasy/sci-fi tournament for only the second time (GW attended an FI years ago) as far as I know.

There was only one historical speaker this year, a volunteer from the Old Flagship Niagara. FI has always been the smallest of the three cons, though Hcon has considerably shrunk over the years.

I agree that AWI and F&I are a smaller subset of the historical games at the cons. WWII, ACW and Nappy are the three leaders, not surprisingly.

I saw some photos of this year's MFCA show and was stunned to see the number of fantasy stuff there.

Rallynow Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2017 8:20 p.m. PST

I never really bought into the graying of the historical gaming hobby mantra. But I am starting to come around to it. I game with about 12 guys in our club and I am the only one not retired.

We quit having a convention here because the only ones running games are the same ones who play in them. We were all standing by our tables looking at each other and that was that.

I am grateful for any historical games at the cons. I know that these non-historical games bring in revenue which helps the conventions out.

I for one would rather see a smaller convention with only history games, than to see it taken over by dragons and zombies (no pun intended). I still maintain that historical gaming is a distinct hobby unto itself. Related but not the same.

Rallynow Supporting Member of TMP13 Nov 2017 8:23 p.m. PST

On the other hand someone has got to be buying all these figures and stuff. I see new historical figure companies starting up all the time. How do you explain that?

nevinsrip Sponsoring Member of TMP13 Nov 2017 11:33 p.m. PST

"How do you explain that?"

Simple. Older people have disposable income to spend. As you mentioned many (me included) are retired and have the time and money to devote to a hobby.

I started Kings Mountain Miniature because I wanted the figures and I could afford to finance the project.

Der Alte Fritz, who owns Fife and Drum, is retired and like me wanted his own line of AWI sculpts.

I suspect there are others.

historygamer14 Nov 2017 1:12 p.m. PST

"I never really bought into the graying of the historical gaming hobby mantra. But I am starting to come around to it. I game with about 12 guys in our club and I am the only one not retired."

It's hard to judge the health of the hobby by the conventions. I know more guys (of all ages) that don't go to the conventions than do. I suspect many have the same experience.

"We quit having a convention here because the only ones running games are the same ones who play in them. We were all standing by our tables looking at each other and that was that."

Not sure where you are located, but there are a lot of smaller conventions now. I have also noticed that people of all ages seem less inclined to travel these days.

"I am grateful for any historical games at the cons."

I knew some of the founders of the cons. HMGS was founded in response to military historicals being shoved in a corner at the then large cons featuring other types of games. HMGS never built any internal breakwater on non-historical games being put on at their cons. Maybe they should have.

"I know that these non-historical games bring in revenue which helps the conventions out."

Can you prove that? Not likely. All of the guys I know who go to HMGS cons who play the non-historical games also play historicals. If you give them a choice they will play whatever appeals being offered to them at the time. If the con only had historicals, they would gladly play historicals.

"I for one would rather see a smaller convention with only history games, than to see it taken over by dragons and zombies (no pun intended)."

I generally agree, but suspect a new convention would need to be created. However, I am not sure HMGS cons will be taken over, but they product will be watered down, especially if the org is run by people who don't primarily game historicals.

"I still maintain that historical gaming is a distinct hobby unto itself. Related but not the same."

I would agree.

Early morning writer14 Nov 2017 11:18 p.m. PST

Can't prove nothing. But! In northern California and the San Francisco Bay area, when I go to conventions the predominant hair color is very definitely gray – at maybe 10:1 ratios. And most of them are familiar faces seen many times over the last twenty years. The new blood, while there, is few gamers far between appearances. It is entirely possible that we are simply viewed as crusty curmudgeons and the younger set chooses to avoid us and have their own gaming circles. It is so bad that the local convention all of five minutes from my house this weekend has exactly ONE game of interest so I will only be attending for that one day. And don't speak of vendors. Haven't seen a historically oriented vendor in more than a decade at the cons out this way.

Despite all this, I drive on collecting figures (though nearly done with that) and painting when I can. My 'insanity' is that I still collect for games with a dozen or more players even though I know I'd be lucky to get a game with four committed players. Oh, well, collecting all the stuff is a huge part of the hobby – especially for me.

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