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"Condolences to Winston Smith" Topic


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©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
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Ottoathome04 Oct 2017 5:09 a.m. PST

Dear Winston

Allow me as first act on my return to express my displeasure and disquiet over the attack Mitochondria made on you. There are attacks and then there are savagings. I am of the opinion that this was in every sense a "Frothers" act which confirms in the public mind the basic evil of that site.

Otto Schmidt

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 5:18 a.m. PST

Was Mitochondria a Frother?!?

Truly they walk amongst us!

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 5:31 a.m. PST

Otto, stuff like that rolls off my back. I laughed at it. It brings to mind the picture of the angry fat guy sitting in his underwear pounding the keyboard so hard he sends plastic flying.
He's not a Frother. Just someone who was never disciplined in his youth.

YouTube link

Dynaman878904 Oct 2017 5:31 a.m. PST

> So a bunch idiots on a website you would define as evil?

Don't underestimate it, "A bunch of idiots" on other websites have led teenagers to commit suicide.

Ottoathome04 Oct 2017 6:42 a.m. PST

Dear Pondoo

Yes.

Dynaman8789 has provided proof more eloquent than any.

I suppose it depends on your definition of evil. Mine is pain and suffering. Although it may be minor compared with murder and the like nevertheless it is pain and suffering. Also it is the WILL to produce pain and suffering which is an evil in and of itself even if it is unable to produce pain and suffering.

There are two types of evil in this world. Natural evil (hurricanes and Tornados, meteorites and volcanoes, cancer cells crippling diseases and the like). These things cause pain and suffering and therefore are evils. Then there is human evil, which is everything else. Nature inflicts its evil unknowing and unthinking by laws which take no account of us nor even recognize our presence. Human evil is a purposeful act of meaning to cause pain and suffering. A human being commits them WISHING to cause pain and suffering on a fellow human being. Therefor-- yes, Mitochondria was evil.

We can do nothing about natural evil. We can about human evil. If we could eliminate human evil the world, even with natural evil still in it would be as a return to Eden.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 6:46 a.m. PST

Otto. Sticks and stones may break my bones, but mitochondria just made me laugh. No pain and suffering here.
And again, he's not a Frother/Farter. He couldn't last 5 minutes there. He's cursing and swearing looking forward to getting the DH or locked out.
"Over there", in that wretched hive of scum and villainy, that's how they say "Please pass the ketchup."

Personal logo Flashman14 Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 6:50 a.m. PST

Link?

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 6:52 a.m. PST

It's been nuked.

Ottoathome04 Oct 2017 7:10 a.m. PST

Dear Winston

Perhaps. But nevertheless the wish to cause pain and suffering was there.

You will notice that I framed the case in a completely non-theistic way. However it is obvious how it fits more traditional definitions with regard to secrets in the heart and their relationship to deeds done by the hands as spoken by the orater on the mountain.

The simple fact is this Winston. TMP is a place for talking about war games. I come here to talk about games, see what new projects people are working on, glean new ideas, talk about how we implement facts or historical aspects into games. Occasionally have a knock-down-drag out with McLaddie and UshCha about the utterly arcane realms of game design and theory, see what others have done and get advice one way or the other which I can use or ignore at my pleasure. There is a place for disagreement and a place for debate, and even a place for principled railing and ranting. I think most do that also.

While it may "roll off your back" nevertheless in spite of past history between us you deserve support and condolence even if it were ineffective. There is more at stake here than simply "your back."

That he may not be a frother is immaterial. He acted in a "frother" like manner. If you load anothers bullet into your gun and shoot someone, it's not the fault of the others bullet. Likewise if one loads an idiotic opinion in one's mouth and says it, it does not absolve one from being an idiot. Words have meaning, words have power. We are not a telepathic species who can know anothers mind, we rely upon words to convey what we think.

Legion 404 Oct 2017 7:30 a.m. PST

Well said Otto …

Don't underestimate it, "A bunch of idiots" on other websites have led teenagers to commit suicide.
So very sad but true Dyanman … E.g. look what scum like ISIS/Deash have done using the net.

"Over there", in that wretched hive of scum and villainy, that's how they say "Please pass the ketchup."
Again very true. … " … that wretched hive of scum and villainy … ", that is being far to kind. As many of us know …

Personal logo War Panda Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member04 Oct 2017 8:42 a.m. PST

Firstly i did not see the attack but I completely agree that in my own belief system any 'communication' thats sole purpose is to cause pain or injury can constitute 'evil.' Of course it can.

I respect Otto's good intentions but I'm not sure if I was savaged upon here I'd want another thread posted immediately after entitled "condolences to…" I thought Winston had a bereavement! I was actually relieved when I read the opening post. I'm really not sure if some weasel attacked me here I'd want another thread posted immediately after discussing it. Maybe a private message may have been more appropriate?

While I didn't read the post personally I believe that of all people 'Winston' is rough and tough enough not to give a rats ass what some internet weirdo thinks of him.

Personal logo David Manley Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 9:17 a.m. PST

When "condolences" are offered because someone posts a few rude words on a toy soldier web forum (especially when the "target" is entirely indifferent to the "attack") it is time to think about developing a sense of perspective.

And is suggesting that such posts might encourage suicides amongst the TMP readership entirely realistic? One would hope not…..

Dynaman878904 Oct 2017 9:30 a.m. PST

> And is suggesting that such posts might encourage suicides amongst the TMP readership entirely realistic?

I suggested NO such thing.

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 9:37 a.m. PST

No bereavement. My dog is fine, although those wretched hot spots came back right after I discontinued the Benadryl. She gets them in July and August. Right now in NEPA, October temperatures are in the high 70s, so the fleas are still active in the yard. Damn. I thought we were done with that.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian04 Oct 2017 9:42 a.m. PST

Was Mitochondria a Frother?!?

He did sound like a Frother, but I don't know his actual identity. Probably from the Houston/Pinehurst/Trinity area. He's already tried to sneak back in with a sock puppet.

Personal logo The Virtual Armchair General Sponsoring Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 9:43 a.m. PST

"Winston!"

You, Sir, are--and always have been--A Class Act.

TVAG

Personal logo David Manley Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 9:43 a.m. PST

"Don't underestimate it, "A bunch of idiots" on other websites have led teenagers to commit suicide."

There's a clear inference :)

Dynaman878904 Oct 2017 10:56 a.m. PST

No there is not. I was going to add to that original post "I'm not implying that Winston will kill himself" but I foolishly thought that it was not needed.

rmaker04 Oct 2017 11:00 a.m. PST

"A bunch of idiots" on other websites have led teenagers to commit suicide.

Or attempt murder (e.g., the Slenderman case in Wisconsin).

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 11:04 a.m. PST

No. I have too much unpainted lead to kill myself.
In fact, I'm assembling a Foundry Order. Must have the 35th foot, and somebmore Maroons.

Legion 404 Oct 2017 11:34 a.m. PST

too much unpainted lead
I'd say most of us do … as well …

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 11:42 a.m. PST

He did sound like a Frother, but I don't know his actual identity.
picture

Hafen von Schlockenberg Supporting Member of TMP04 Oct 2017 11:55 a.m. PST

I think it was Bob:

picture

tookey2304 Oct 2017 1:02 p.m. PST

If the ultramodern threads are to be believed its always the Chinese Fault. Maybe they used the super ship navigation\crew sedation super weapon on Mitocondria to make him type those words. Are Frothers now in league with China ?

Almost as fanciful as comparing Frothers to ISIS or that that they make people commit suicide.

Legion 404 Oct 2017 1:07 p.m. PST

A group of idiots is a group of idiots regardless … And it was not a direct comparison but a generalization.

You may be being a bit "fanciful" with your entire post, I'd think …

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian04 Oct 2017 2:50 p.m. PST

Post from sock puppet account ("Pondoo") removed

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian04 Oct 2017 2:57 p.m. PST

Almost as fanciful as comparing Frothers to ISIS or that that they make people commit suicide.

Or turning a blind eye to the impact of bullying.

Darrell B D Day05 Oct 2017 12:19 a.m. PST

David Manley's first post says it all. Perspective is required.

DBDD

Condottiere05 Oct 2017 9:53 a.m. PST

When "condolences" are offered because someone posts a few rude words on a toy soldier web forum …it is time to think about developing a sense of perspective.

Exactly.

Legion 405 Oct 2017 11:33 a.m. PST

Yes … the majority here [and supposedly elsewhere ?] are full grown adults. High functioning, tax paying, mature, in some case professionals, men [and some women].

So why all the vitriol, pettiness, disdain, hatred, subterfuge, divisiveness, etc., etc. ?

We all share a similar hobby and interests. That should bond us not create polarization, divisions, etc. Towards each other here. And on two separate webs sites that exist in an almost constant virtual state of an internet street fight … It still baffles me …

Winston Smith Supporting Member of TMP05 Oct 2017 11:39 a.m. PST

There's no street fight. One site does stupid things and the other laughs st them.
Naming no names…..

Elbow Mac05 Oct 2017 1:55 p.m. PST

There are those who constantly tell us they don't care what others on the internet say about them but then seem unable to go even a few days without bringing "the other place" up again.
If a handful of people on another site (which, of course, you never visit) are being rude about you then don't go there. Simples.
Go and paint something instead.

tookey2305 Oct 2017 2:43 p.m. PST

It gets a bit tedious to be honest. If it was not being mentioned every 5 seconds in threads as weak excuses for poor behaviour from TMP members then it would go away.

Condottiere06 Oct 2017 3:29 a.m. PST

So why all the vitriol, pettiness, disdain, hatred, subterfuge, divisiveness, etc., etc. ?

Nothing better to do? All their miniatures are painted?

23rdFusilier Supporting Member of TMP06 Oct 2017 4:33 a.m. PST

"There's no street fight. One site does stupid things and the other laughs st them.
Naming no names….. "

"It gets a bit tedious to be honest. If it was not being mentioned every 5 seconds in threads as weak excuses for poor behaviour from TMP members then it would go away."

Brilliant! Thank you both for clear thinking.

Legion 406 Oct 2017 7:46 a.m. PST

Yes … as Bill has mentioned before … There is always the "Stifle" option here on TMP …

Of course no one forces anyone to click on and read a thread on TMP …

And as always … everyone has an opinion, and can state that opinion. As well as anybody can agree or disagree with that opinion or statement.

And if they feel that they have to respond it should be done without vitriol, mocking, etc., I'd think. Regardless, the easiest thing to do is agree to disagree … And move on to our hobby that [should] bring us together, yes ?

Tango0106 Oct 2017 10:22 a.m. PST

My doubt goes to…"…One site does stupid things and the other laughs st them…"… which is which?… (smile)


Amicalement
Armand

Legion 406 Oct 2017 11:08 a.m. PST

evil grin

Charlie 1206 Oct 2017 6:30 p.m. PST

And move on to our hobby that [should] bring us together, yes ?

Nice thought. Not much evidence to support it, though…

Legion 407 Oct 2017 6:25 a.m. PST

Yes, Sir … none at all … Especially when TMP vs. TMP in arguments. Instead of having a useful discussion, etc. Not mentioning any names … evil grin

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP07 Oct 2017 12:47 p.m. PST

And move on to our hobby that [should] bring us together, yes ?

Ralph: any chance you can follow your own excellent advice & move on rather than post cryptic references to your enemies?

Legion 407 Oct 2017 2:02 p.m. PST

… as Bill has mentioned before … There is always the "Stifle" option here on TMP …

Of course no one forces anyone to click on and read a thread on TMP …

And as always … everyone has an opinion, and can state that opinion. As well as anybody can agree or disagree with that opinion or statement.

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP07 Oct 2017 5:16 p.m. PST

Was that 'yes' or 'no', Ralph?

Legion 408 Oct 2017 5:48 a.m. PST

There is always the "Stifle" option here on TMP …

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP08 Oct 2017 12:23 p.m. PST

Thank you for your reply, Ralph.
However, we seem to be at cross-purposes. I ask one question, you reply to another.

Unless this is the notorious Bug, it is undoubtedly my fault. So, to clarify, you have on several posts laudably recommended a spirit of tolerance & respect on TMP.

I am asking whether you intend this to be applied to all or just one's cronies because if the latter, it seems redundant.

So: 'all', 'a select group' or perhaps the Fifth Amendment?

Legion 408 Oct 2017 1:48 p.m. PST

As mentioned previously, there is always the stifle option here on TMP … or report a post to the Editors …

Personal logo ochoin Supporting Member of TMP08 Oct 2017 10:16 p.m. PST

OK Ralph, I'll take that as a "no".

Legion 409 Oct 2017 7:08 a.m. PST

there is always the stifle option here on TMP

kcabai24 Oct 2017 5:28 a.m. PST

Sorry for your pain

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