"British Battalion Distinctions" Topic
13 Posts
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Old Contemptibles | 08 Aug 2017 8:52 p.m. PST |
Does each battalion of the same regiment have something on their uniform which denotes which battalion they belong? |
Winston Smith | 08 Aug 2017 10:03 p.m. PST |
In the American Revolution, with very few exceptions, all regiments had only one battalion. The only exception I'm aware of is the 71st, Highlanders. They came over as two battalions with the only distinction being a flash on the Colours. For a brief time, a 3rd battalion was formed ad hoc, but this didn't last long. For all intents and purposes, a regiment was the battalion. The 60th may have had more than one battalion, but they were weird anyway. If you are talking about converged Grenadiers or Light Infantry battalions, each company retained the distinctions of its parent regiment. |
Old Contemptibles | 09 Aug 2017 6:52 a.m. PST |
British Grenadiers scenario book shows that two battalions of the 42nd Highland were involved at Pell's Point. Because this is so unusual I am not sure if there is anything on their uniform that denotes what battalion they were in and for that matter, are the flags the same or slightly different? |
Winston Smith | 09 Aug 2017 7:35 a.m. PST |
Ok. Another Highland regiment. I wasn't sure about that. The Colours would have a "pile", a thin golden or yellow narrow wavy triangle coming from the top of the flag by the staff. |
Bill N | 09 Aug 2017 8:00 a.m. PST |
The 60th was a 4 battalion regiment during the AWI, and at least the 2nd, 3rd and 4th battalions served in North America. Prevost took a force consisting of companies of each of those three battalions with him to Georgia in 1779. I am not aware of any distinctions between the battalions, or even whether they took any flags with them on campaign. |
historygamer | 09 Aug 2017 8:06 a.m. PST |
Tricky question. There was apparently a distinction on the colour(s) – the shape of a gold cone in the upper corner(I forget the actual name of the thing.) by the staff end. Bill – I don't recall if the 60th spun back up to four battalions or not in the AWI – but it had four in the F&I period, then stood down to perhaps two after. I know there were distinctions even within the same battalion during the F&I as Bouquet noted his four companies during the Forbes campaign did not have blue welted button holes on their waistcoats like the other companies with Stanwix. Other than that… The Marines may have had distinctive buckles (whatever that means – bayonet belt plate?) between the three divisions of Marines. Not sure what they were though and neither does anyone else. Other than that…. likely not as noted above. |
42flanker | 09 Aug 2017 10:42 a.m. PST |
two battalions of the 42nd Highland were involved at Pell's Point After their arrival in America in August 1776, the 42nd RHR, newly recruited up to full strength, was divided into two ad hoc 'battalions, but these were more akin to 'wings' as they would later be termed, so there would have been only one set of regimental colours (which would not have been taken into action). The two 'battalions' of the 42nd deployed in echelon to support the Light infantry during the action at 'Haarlem Heights' on Sept 16th 1776, though only one was engaged, suffering some of the heaviest casualties of the day. A second battalion for the 42nd, in the proper sense, was authorised in 1779, embodied in Perth the following year and sent out to India in 1781. In 1786, rather than being disbanded as part of peacetime reductions, 2nd Bn, 42nd RHR was embodied as a separate regiment, the 73rd Highland Regiment. They remained in India for another 20 years. When they returned they were converted to a standard regiment of the line and so remained until in 1881 when they joined the 42nd again to become 1st & 2nd Bn, The Black Watch. |
Winston Smith | 09 Aug 2017 11:36 a.m. PST |
Yes. I forgot to mention that. In many BG scenarios, a regiment/battalion may be divided into "wings". It's a purely ad hoc arrangement, not permanent enough to require uniform or flag distinctions. |
Garde de Paris | 09 Aug 2017 12:28 p.m. PST |
Many years ago I seem to remember reading that the regulations for the colours (1745?) specified a "pile wavy" for a second battalion. There are a few in this link below. link It is a flame starting at the upper corner of the King's colour on the staff, pointed toward the center; and coming from the union at it's inner corner, again toward the center of the colour. It looks like they had to be yellow to contrast with the white ?St. Andrew's? cross. But what would I know? I's a Yank! GdeP |
Supercilius Maximus | 11 Aug 2017 12:22 p.m. PST |
A "pile wavy" is indeed the correct method of distinguishing a second battalion. I'm not sure what 3rd battalions did, possibly a second "pile wavy"? As 42nd says, the regiment was split into two sub-units that were more akin to wings than actual 1st and 2nd battalions – they only had one set of colours in N America. The 60th did have four battalions in the AWI, but I'm not sure what form any distinction on their colours took. The 71st was a two-battalion regiment; the "third" battalion was an ad hoc field formation and only two sets of colours were issued. There were two battalions of Marines in Boston; again, I'm not sure there were any distinctions, either in their uniforms or their colours. The Composite Brigade of Foot Guards seems to have not carried colours in N America; however, it is thought that the 1st battalion retained the white lace on their shoulder straps as a distinction. |
Bill N | 11 Aug 2017 4:04 p.m. PST |
@Historgamer-I don't have any primary sources indicating when the 60th was expanded back to 4 battalions. In 1776 though you have elements of the 3rd and 4th battalions of the 60th arriving in East Florida, and 3rd and 4th battalions of the 60th were among the troops evacuated from Charleston in December of 1782. For British flag information I usually rely on fifedrum.org/crfd/BD_1.htm . |
historygamer | 11 Aug 2017 5:13 p.m. PST |
I can look it up. The National Army Museum has a piece of a 60th colour – the L and X are intertwined. |
42flanker | 11 Aug 2017 5:13 p.m. PST |
Bill N, Historygamer- a 3rd and 4th Battalion, 60th Royal Americans, were raised on August 25th, 1775 and moved from the Isle of Wight to the West Indies the following year where they remained until 1778 when they moved to the Floridas. This is according to 'A regimental chronicle and list of officers of the 60th, or the King's Royal Rifle Corps, formerly the 62nd, or the Royal American Regiment of Foot.' N.W Wallace, 1879. link |
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