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"Things You Can't Do on TMP" Topic


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3,092 hits since 26 May 2017
©1994-2017 Bill Armintrout
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Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian26 May 2017 4:54 p.m. PST

I've been having some interesting discussions with some of our members who have broken forum rules lately, and thought I would share some observations about things you can't post on the TMP forums:

1. "TMP Stinks!" No business would allow its own forum to be used to attack that business, and the same is true on TMP. If you have a suggestion, that's fine; if you just want to rant about how bad things are here… not here.

2. "TMP is dying!" See above.

3. "The Editor is a tyrant!" If your purpose is simply to tell the world what an awful human being I am, or that I am incompetent at my job, that's not appropriate here. On the other hand, if you have a specific criticism, that is fine.

4. "Sigh" "How sad" It is not appropriate to post "put down" comments like these, whether about TMP or myself personally. If you have a real suggestion, please be specific.

5. We have long had a "no shut up" rule, the essence of which is that members of TMP should not tell other members what not to talk about. It is the role of the moderators to decide what can and cannot be talked about. Similarly, please don't tell the moderators that they can't talk about something – after all, we work here!

These are not new policies I believe they are already covered in the site FAQ, as well as my earlier editorial about "raising the bar" on our forums and being less snarky.

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member26 May 2017 5:04 p.m. PST

6. Order a pizza at the press of a button, like you can apparently do now with tennis shoes.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP26 May 2017 5:06 p.m. PST

LOL. So the re-hashing and beatings will continue until morale improves?

Geesh, man, seriously? Then what's the point of ever posting or replying to anything anymore, unless it is to grovel or bend over*?

Dan
* I assume that grovelling and bending over are still perfectly acceptable. :)

robert piepenbrink Supporting Member of TMP26 May 2017 5:17 p.m. PST

As long as I don't have to sign a statement saying I've been briefed…

14Bore26 May 2017 5:18 p.m. PST

https://youtu.be/LvwqK2gn3S0
The List of infractions

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP26 May 2017 5:21 p.m. PST

14Bore,

Lol. I hadn't seen that awesome clip in years.

Dan
PS. This poster should read "Any questions? Wanna trip to Siberia?"

picture

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian26 May 2017 5:26 p.m. PST

I think it just boils down to common sense, CC.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP26 May 2017 5:28 p.m. PST

It's not as common as you'd think. Specially when you try to herd cats. :)

Dan
PS. You can herd cats, but they can't know that's what's happening or everything grinds to a halt.

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member26 May 2017 8:48 p.m. PST

I will agree with Bill on one major point, there's been far too much drama, and far too little in the way of interesting postings, and/or even questions/discussions about wargaming with miniatures, or other related subjects of late.

I hope that changes soon……….

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian26 May 2017 8:54 p.m. PST

No point in making suggestions like you state in #4. I'm pretty sure many folks here can point to specific good suggestions that had favorable comments in the thread that you simply said "No"

You have the right to do so, but to pretend that you are really open to suggestions seems a stretch.

Don't take it so hard that I don't take all of your suggestions, JJ. I do listen.

VVV reply26 May 2017 11:53 p.m. PST

I think Bill covers what you cannot do nicely. One of the most controlled sites for wargaming there is. The motto has long been 'Bills house, Bills rules'.

GarrisonMiniatures Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member27 May 2017 1:48 a.m. PST

Good set of rules. Totally agree…

'5. We have long had a "no shut up" rule, the essence of which is that members of TMP should not tell other members what not to talk about. It is the role of the moderators to decide what can and cannot be talked about. Similarly, please don't tell the moderators that they can't talk about something after all, we work here!'

As you know, that (though I agree with it) as it stands is fine, but the adage 'do as I say not as I do' does cause dissent and a feeling of unfairness. The old 'with power comes responsibilty.' You have the right to do it – but if you choose to do things that people consider unfair then the question to be asked – is right to do it.

Basically, if carried out poorly then I think constructive criticism is all but impossible.

HammerHead27 May 2017 6:11 a.m. PST

Terrement there are lots of interesting post, but just look at the replies most gets. If a post gets say 12 relies they are lucky this has already 20 odd relies. Just to say nice or cool doesn't add anything to a regular post.
There several people who post in anything and everywhere I guess to see their name in TMP and think they add anything to the subject, which they don`t.
I have been chastised for saying something was boring, which it was. So, I understand this topic. If you really can`t be bothered to add anything, just go paint something.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP27 May 2017 6:18 a.m. PST

All this talk of feeeeeelings just gives me a headache.

If I go through the trouble of taking and posting photos of something I'm working on, hoping for honest criticism but all I get is compliments, I always feel like they are just being nice and are holding back … which isn't what I need to improve.

Same goes for everything else posted here. People who say they are open to suggestions and criticism shouldn't say that unless they mean it and are really ready for what comes from it.

Dan

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian27 May 2017 8:40 a.m. PST

One of the most controlled sites for wargaming there is. The motto has long been 'Bills house, Bills rules'.

That motto never came from me! grin And you could argue that "those other sites" are more controlled (i.e., censored) than TMP.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian27 May 2017 8:44 a.m. PST

As you know, that (though I agree with it) as it stands is fine, but the adage 'do as I say not as I do' does cause dissent and a feeling of unfairness. The old 'with power comes responsibilty.' You have the right to do it but if you choose to do things that people consider unfair then the question to be asked is right to do it.

One of the problems is that some people don't understand the forum rules very well, so they think I've broken the rules when I haven't.

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian27 May 2017 11:01 a.m. PST

You would probably have been better to flag up your rules clarifications as a statement on the front page where they will be seen by the greatest number of members rather than as a discussion in TMP Talk

I considered doing that, but I didn't want to distract from the current advertiser welcome, and putting it on the homepage would not have allowed for feedback.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP27 May 2017 11:10 a.m. PST

Gen Disaster: "Not quite sure who that was directed at"

Every one of us all actually. We shouldn't act surprised or indignant when we occasionally get what we openly asked for.

Dan

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member27 May 2017 11:33 a.m. PST

To be fair, Lead Adventure has a lot more restrictions, due to Nazi-like controls to ironically, avoid Nazi propaganda and images.

They also don't permit the posting and discussion of Ultra-Modern topics (which sort of happens here, to some people).

JMcCarroll27 May 2017 1:28 p.m. PST

Can we get a poll on this?

GarrisonMiniatures Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member27 May 2017 1:28 p.m. PST

'One of the problems is that some people don't understand the forum rules very well, so they think I've broken the rules when I haven't.'

True, but… (always a but)

I could write something that I know has one meaning. Others can interpret what I wrote in a way that was different to my intention. Being me, I would possibly find their interpretation to be wrong, and wouldn't be able see that what I had written was wrong. I would strongly protest my innocence and consider everyone who disagreed with me to be bleeps.

If I was the editor this could lead to them being put in the DH or Locked…

If they were the editor then it could lead to me being put in the DH or Locked…

And that is why I posted my suggestion re splitting your personna into two to give you the chance to gauge (and react to) your membership in a way that seems less dictatorial/arbitrary than it perhaps does now.

I really don't think that you appreciate (or even could appreciate) how much a lot of British wargamers felt insulted during the recent unpleasantness. Or how the things you wrote came across.

My final words on this issue I think.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP27 May 2017 1:46 p.m. PST

@Mako11: "To be fair, Lead Adventure has a lot more restrictions, due to Nazi-like controls to ironically, avoid Nazi propaganda and images."

Sometimes I go there just to see how they discuss WW2 topics and figures without crossing their ridiculously strict government Nazi picture/insignia bans. It can be funny, but it also makes me so appreciative to be somewhere where more topics are allowed.

Deleted by Moderator

Dan

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member27 May 2017 2:02 p.m. PST

"You could post about Ultra-modern gaming all you want, but not the thinly-veiled political nonsense that happens here".

Actually, per their new rules, the discussion of battles – even hypothetical ones is "verboten" (banned).

You can discuss post-2000 weapons systems, and perhaps even about paintjobs, but battle reports, hypothetical discussions, etc., are not permitted.

Khusrau27 May 2017 2:04 p.m. PST

You might not be aware, but as LAF is hosted in Germany there are very strict legal controls about the display and posting of Nazi content. They are simply complying with the law in their jurisdiction Mako11.

I am sure as ex military you would be aware of the need to comply with legislative controls.

Legion 427 May 2017 2:51 p.m. PST

Mako, I didn't know you were a Vet ? No matter … We are all entitled to an opinion. But should be able to express it without making a personal attack(s), I'd think … [FYI I'm not saying this to you Mako]…

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian27 May 2017 3:48 p.m. PST

(Sock puppet account locked and post removed.)

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP27 May 2017 5:23 p.m. PST

Khusrau: "You might not be aware, but as LAF is hosted in Germany there are very strict legal controls about the display and posting of Nazi content. They are simply complying with the law in their jurisdiction Mako11."

Of course Mako11 is aware of it, and I also made mention of that very point in my last post, but that part was snipped off for some reason.

It still doesn't make Germany's laws any less ridiculous and frustrating, specially for non-German gamers* wanting to discuss and share photos of WW2 and Pulp games they may have. And complaining about their hyper-regulation, like Mako did, doesn't mean he is the kind of person "Malcontentmachinist" calls him in the next post.

Dan
*And LAF has loads of posts explaining why they are so proactive and aggressive in their compliance to whatever laws they're under. The reason they need to keep repeating their position is because the overcompensating law sounds ridiculous to the rest of the people in the free world. Talking about the German army during WW2 (or even a hypothetical SF government styled in that fashion) doesn't mean you share their politics or insane philosophies.

Thomas Whitten27 May 2017 6:08 p.m. PST

#1 and #2 are you rules.

No business would allow its own forum to be used to attack that business,

That is not true though.

Mako11 Supporting Member of TMP Inactive Member27 May 2017 6:28 p.m. PST

I am aware.

Interesting that they allow far leftists in Germany to express their views, and/or to control the government and its policies, but middle of the road views can't be expressed, and those that do are frequently labeled as Nazis, there and abroad.

I suspect we are straying off the subject though. I was just trying to point out that there are other sites with more onerous rules, in some ways, than here on TMP, in order to set the record straight.

I am not a veteran, but my father, and many of my uncles were. Grandmother was tasked with listening for enemy bombers at night, near the coast, from a watchtower, which she had to climb, even while pregnant, in order to protect the US mainland.

I was fortunate enough to reach adult-hood, when only the Cold War was the concern, and not a hot one.

The invasion of Afghanistan, and some of the tensions while dear Ronnie was running the Soviets into bankruptcy were certainly interesting though. Thought my number might be called for several of those events, during that period of history.

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP27 May 2017 9:53 p.m. PST

Does LAF allow members to show and share photos or illustrations, insignias, etc of Stalin's Russia? Or Mao's China?

Not to defend Hitler in any way* but, of those 3, who killed the most innocent civilians? If you ban one of them, you should ban all of them. No selective outrage. And no exceptions to appease the sensitivities of one nationality or the other, or to sympathize with one group of victims over another.

And the WW1 Turkish leaders should also figure in there somewhere for their systematic genocide of Armenians and other populations.

If they can all be discussed objectively, then discuss them all. But if it's to promote their views or repeat their barbarity, then have at it.

But some people feel that they can legislate the human heart and the minds of their subject. That always backfires in a very sad way.

Dan
* I shouldn't have to, but I am purposely inserting that clause there for the sake of those who are overly eager to label other people as Nazis or as Nazi sympathizers.

platypus01au27 May 2017 9:59 p.m. PST

Interesting that they allow far leftists in Germany to express their views, and/or to control the government and its policies, but middle of the road views can't be expressed, and those that do are frequently labeled as Nazis, there and abroad.

Well, as they say, "Their country, their rules". Though I suppose that the last time the Germans started listening to the Nazis, it didn't end up too well for them….

Not sure what to say about the current topic, but I would like to be able to talk about wargaming without politics. _any_ politics.

JohnG

cosmicbank27 May 2017 10:01 p.m. PST

Let me get this right "No Santa Claus" you mean to say there is No Santa Claus.

Legion 428 May 2017 7:00 a.m. PST

I am not a veteran,
Note: I was not being "judgmental", etc. I just like to know other Vets here. As we may have some things is common, etc.

Or as I see we may not. And again, everybody is entitled to an opinion. And anyone can agree or disagree, but IMO as long as the posts remain civil, etc. You can learn more about any topic by calmly discussing it, etc. And not make it an argument, with personal attacks, etc. Better to be humorous/pleasant than vitriolic, mean spirited, immature, etc.

If some have noticed Bill has about 0 tolerance for that sort of posts. Believe me, I know. Keep it civil, adult, etc. AS many of us know it can very quickly get out of hand when the posts revert to "playground" behavior, etc.

there is No Santa Claus.
THERE ISN'T !?!?!? Wow, that now explains a lot to me ! frown

Personal logo Cacique Caribe Supporting Member of TMP28 May 2017 7:59 a.m. PST

Well, this went nowhere fast. No point following the discussion any longer when everything you go through the trouble posting is seen as offensive by someone and gets censored.

What a bunch of babies we've become.

Dan

Don Manser28 May 2017 9:26 a.m. PST

Dan
* I assume that grovelling and bending over are still perfectly acceptable. :)

I'm offended. 🙄

cosmicbank28 May 2017 11:32 a.m. PST

You can't roller skate on TMP

Legion 428 May 2017 2:38 p.m. PST

I don't think you can run with scissors either … Or is that somewhere else ? wink

Personal logo etotheipi Sponsoring Member of TMP29 May 2017 3:55 a.m. PST

Of course, there's a Noh Santa Claus …

Noh Problem Here…

Legion 429 May 2017 8:24 a.m. PST

huh?

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.