"The Battle of Vienna 1683" Topic

During this time period were Pike&Shot tactics still used? And if so were matchlocks still being used.

Some of the units within the Ottomon-Turkish forces beseiging Vienna would likely have still been armed with matchlocks.

Unlikely that Austrian units defending Vienna would have still been armed primarily with matchlocks. Some of the civilian inhabitants helping defend the city may have been so armed.

Some units within the Polish, Austrian, and German relief forces may still have been armed with matchlocks, but the majority would have carried muskets or wheelock firearms.

Any pikes or was that part over by 1683

Plenty of matchlock muskets at Wien, primarily in Austrian and allied hands as the Austrians did not make transition to an exclusivly flintlock armed force until 1702 regulations. The situation was similar among many of the German contingents and with the Poles as well.

Wheellocks would be found among cavalry as it was dominant type used for pistols and carbines but was much too expensive and fragile for infantry use, the only wheellock infantry arms would have been found among Wien burghers who had the money and also indulged in shooting matches as a tradition. But even they had pretty limited number.

Both Austrian, German and Polish infantry still had pikes, Saxons & Bavarians used ratio of 1 pike to 2 shot, Austrians probably the same while some Polish regiments had pikes but I'm not sure about the ratio.

Theres a vast diorama using flats in a museum in Vienna which I saw in 1986 . I have googled it , this may indeed be it ; link

Has anyone seen good movies about the Battle?

link

Not all that good, but it shows he enormity of one of the largest cavalry charge in history.

The Saxons did not carry pike. Although part of the regimental organization, pikemen were issued muskets, and all carried boar spears.

9th Maine,

That is an interesting fact I have not seen before, could you possibly share your source? Many thanks in advance,

Mollinary

Mollinary, Here are two:

Thenius, Walter. Die Anfänge des Heerwesens in Kursachsen unter Johann Georg III und Johann Georg IV. Leipzig, 1912. Page 81.
Hassel, Paul, Zur Geschichte des Türkenkrieges im Jahre 1683. Die Betheiligung der kursächsischen Truppen an demselben. Dresden 1883. Page 115.

Thanks for that, I am off to track them down! It is a fascinating period, and particularly so with regard to the comings and goings of the pike. Much recent research has pushed back the date for abandonment of the pike in the English establishment into the early 18th century. The Saxons were heavily involved in the GNW where both Swedes and Russians continued to use the pike, so I had assumed the Saxons did the same. It just goes to show what assumption is the mother of! Thanks again,

Mollinary

9th Maine,
Thank you for the references, I was using older army history by Schuster & Francke which seems to only have looked at muster rolls, not at Zeughaus records.

It should be noted that "Schweinsfedern" are swinesfeathers aka Swedish feathers in English boar spear would be knebelspeiss). Together with chevaux de frise common defence used against Ottomans.