"Never played 40K....but might consider it" Topic

Hi guys,
I have never played 40K. This is mainly due to no members of my club playing it and always selling their stuff at our bring and buy sales. I know that I really should make my own mind up, but it would be a serious investment to find out why my gaming friends don't rate it.

However, with the advent of the new version, I must admit to being tempted after some of the good things being talked about.

I do play WFB but not Age of Sigmar, and I think GW,s figures are some of the best around….a fact recently confirmed when I assembled and painted an Ogre Stonehorn…

So…will I commit or not…hmmm….will anyone else out there who maybe used to play 40K, return to it with the latest version, or is there anyone else out there who may be tempted for the first time?

I've only ever played a handful of games in the late 90's and wasnt impressed. Recently though, my group has been all a buzz with talk of the new system. I am now following in, with a mind to trying it!

I'am going to started playing 30k ( Horus Hersey) era games

This will be my plunge.

The first thing you need to understand is what the name of the game means. Some people think it is a reference to the year. 40,000AD. 40K actually means about how much money you will have to spend to get everything you want.

I bought all my 40k stuff off ebay for minimal outlay, even got pro painted stuff for under a pound a figure. Mind you I own first edition/rogue trader.

Ignore all the s whining about uncompetitive armies or nerfed weapons/tactics they've epically missed the point of wargaming.

GW prices have gone down noticeably over the last 3 years and are now very affordable and in-line with other popular games like Warmahordes.

Most stores (brick-and-mortar or on-line) offer 20 percent discounts on Citadel products. If you look on Ebay or the consignment case of your FLGS they become even cheaper.

I will give the rules a try. They'll reportedly be free so why not?

However, if I didn't already have two complete 40k armies and lots of additional unassembled/unpainted stuff sitting around from years ago I wouldn't touch 40k with a 10 foot pole. It's just too expensive to buy the figs, and my suspicion is that free rules will soon lead to expensive all-but-neccessary codicies and supplements.

I've got an Eldar army. I will take a look at the new Eldar force org and see if it will work with what I have. If I can add Kroot mercenaries to my Eldar, the likelihood of my trying the new edition will rise considerably

We still play 3rd edition around here but are probably going to jump into 8th when it comes out. We will at least try it.

uncompetitive armies

Well for nearly 15+ years there were many armies that were totally uncompetitive.

But this new Edition looks to be changing that.

Will need to see just what GW puts out over about it over the next several weeks.

One thing for sure it will be different.

GW prices have not gone down in the last three years and anyone who claims that is flat out lying to you.

The new rules might be cool. At least they will be free.

Buy used when possible. Scratchbuild or proxy units to try out before you commit. Magnetize.

These are some of the ways you can save money.

You are still going to pay a mint, but you can reduce the wallet damage if you are smart.

ROI is good if you like the minis and even better if you like the game. Cost is reasonable for a lot of GWs minis, especially considering the prices of a lot of other manufacturers' products.
8th has my curiosity piqued, but if I don't like it I'll continue to get my locals back into 1st edition Warzone…

Well not liking their new miniatures.

My ROI on their miniatures that I do owned is very good, but I got most of those back in the early to mid 1990's.

Played lots of 1st & 2nd, one whole game of 3rd. Then it was back to a house medley of mostly the first two, until my group moved off, one by one.

I am very excited about what I'm hearing, and am looking toward playing 8th.

I am also looking forward to picking up a few new minis, especially the upcoming plague marines. I went an dug out my RT-era ones, and was surprised at how many I had- and many finished, all at least up to wash/highlight. Several conversion jobs, too.

I will mostly be using my old minis. The new plastics are cool and all, but I take greater enjoyment in getting my old soldiers back in the fray. Plus, they're painted & paid for.

I used to Play Rogue Trader and 2nd edition back in the 1990's but gave up playing in the early 2000's. from what I hear the later versions of the game are an unplayable mess. I'm hearing good things about the 8th edition, so will probably get a copy. If it's not good then I will probably go back to Rogue Trader.

I do like a lot of the new miniatures, although some are daft (Space Marines riding giant wolves for example…)

GW prices have not gone down in the last three years and anyone who claims that is flat out lying to you.

GW's newest releases, particularly their "Getting Started" boxes, are really good value for the money.

Some of their boxes are still horribly priced. Their newer boxes are either cheaper or more models for the same price.

Apparently GW corporate is unwilling to do a massive price cut, as that would cut the throats of all the shops with old stock on the shelves.

I'm trying to resist, though my group did manage to sucker me into playing Armageddon (with a $35 USD Grey Knight kill team)

With all the talk over on DAKKA DAKKA about Numarines, which are supposed to be "tru scale", I guess we will have to rethink our idea of selling the nearly 100 first edition metal marines my husband had squarled away.

Those old metals seem to have much more personallity, to my eye…

"GW prices have not gone down in the last three years and anyone who claims that is flat out lying to you."

GW prices have gone down in the last three years, anyone who claims otherwise is ignorant of the facts.

Pictors
I'd be curious to hear more examples of how GW has gone down. I'm sure there are some examples, but my general vibe was that stuff costs more and with the splitting of codicies, you generally have to buy even more expensive books.

Shirleylyn
GW has always been good about stating in the rules that old models can be used even if they have a different size base as long as it's the base the mini was sold with. I agree about the appeal of the old figs. However, if you want to upsize to the new basing conventions, Irregular Miniatures sells 2-part rings that you can use to make the bases larger.

If you want to sell stuff, vintage GW figs were already smaller than standard and they still seem to get a good price on ebay.

I have hated GW of years. There attitude stunk and they way they treated their customers got me mad. BUT I have been watching how they have started to change. I have seen what they are doing with the new rules and it has me intrigued. It sounds like they are making some really good changes. And they have done something that I have wanted for many years. hey are making almost true scale marines. At last we will get 7 ft warriors. So I might end up buying the new 40k starter box and spend money with GW for the first time in 20+ years.

Stormcast Liberators were reduced in price. That's just the first one that comes to mind.

Like many of you I haven't played 40k in many editions (tried a couple games of 6th, hated it, sold my Eldar army). I started in RT and 2nd and played 3rd and 4th but after that, and my dissatisfaction with 6th, it was over.And Warhammer 8th was the worst thing ever, I said adios to GW.

In the last year or two I have gotten back into GW stuff, I have enjoyed AGe of Sigmar, the new Warhammer Quest games, the new boxed games like Gorechosen, all top notch stuff. The new 40k has me very interested, obviously, as I am posting the Community updates on TMP.

I will be buying the 8th edition starter which looks to contain Death Guard Nurgle Plague Marines (who I've loved since Realm of Chaos) versus Space Marines. And there's a local Warhammer store that will probably run a big launch event so I gotta go to their party ;)

An awful lot of what I'm seeing looks very smilar to Epic SM1/SM2 mechanics (saves and modifiers being a big thing).. very interested to try it. Just really hope they've canned IGO UGO, you wouldn't play a game of chess where black waits until all whites pieces are moved, would you?

Very definitely looks IGO UGO but with Command Points interrupting your enemy's turn…

Also they have said nothing about overwatch if it's in or not. as far as I know.

"I'd be curious to hear more examples of how GW has gone down. I'm sure there are some examples, but my general vibe was that stuff costs more and with the splitting of codicies, you generally have to buy even more expensive books."

There are plenty of examples:

Prosecutors in AoS were something like 3 for $70 USD, now they are 6 for $75 USD or thereabouts, almost half price.

In AoS you can get a unit of saurus warriors, a unit of cold one cavalry and a carnosaur for $85 USD, just the carnosaur alone would have cost you $85 USD before.

The price dropped on Khorne warriors on Juggernauts from $18.33 USD each to $16.66 USD each.

There are similar deals on 40K stuff. The stuff has not universally decreased in price, but if you buy the right things you can put an army together for a really reasonable price.

For example you can get two characters, 30 space marines, 5 terminators and a dreadnought for $150. USD It isn't a whole army but it is a pretty decent force.

Before that would have run you something like $250 USD depending on the character models you purchased.

Then, of course, there are the rules which went from $75 USD to free. Not exactly comparable because there were the little rulebooks before and the big rule books came with fluff but if you want to play AoS right now it will cost you $25 USD for all you need to make an army list.

@Pictors technically with Age of Sigmar you can buy a Start Collecting box, which has the rules for the models in it, plus special battalion rules, and the core rules are free. So one purchase gets you a starter army.

Gosh I love the "free rules" business model. It's what turned me on to Mantic and now I'm experiencing it again with GW

Yes I have seen that they are at least trying with some of their newer box sets.

Now back when Assault on Black Reach came out I picked up three copies. So;

3 x Space Marine Characters
30 x Space Marines
15 x Terminators
3 x Dreadnoughts

Also

3 x Ork Warbosses
75 x Ork Boyz
9 x Ork Kopters

All told 138 miniatures for the price of around $315 USD for an average of around $2.28 USD per miniature.

GW is still no where near that type of price with their Box Sets

Oh and I picked up more of the Orks off of Ebay so my Ork army is over 350 models.

I do believe in having the ability to field large forces.

I would hate to try and get what I have from GW today because the cost would be over $1,800. USD

Pictors

Grouping together units that are blah on the table into "army" boxes is a way to clear inventory. They are not doing you any favors.

GW prices have been far too for far too long.

The fact that you are willing to pay $75 USD for 3 to 6 small miniatures is just evidence that

Mithmee, the Age of Sigmar starter set Spire of Dawn contains 74 miniatures, and it's $80 USD when in stock. That's about 93 cents per miniature. Pretty good. No wonder it's tough to keep it in stock.

Mitochondria, I would hardly call Stormcast Prosecutors "small miniatures." They are the size of Space Marine Terminators, bounding in the air on massive wings. Bad example to pick on.

Ah, the justification of the personal attack after proving someone wrong. Thanks, Mitochondria!

Also Mithmee you are just straight up wrong about that.

With the AoS starter set you get 47 minis for $125 USD, so $2.65 USD a figure.

Not much different from and with inflation from 2008 the $2.28 USD works out to be $2.63 USD 2017 so almost the exact same price. So not only are they near it they are almost exactly on it.

Space Marine Terminators at least have a modicum of poseability.

The AoS is all monopose and people are eating it up for $12 USD+ per miniature.

Absolutely no self worth to that.

First off I hate Age of Sigmar and those Fantasy Space Marine miniatures.

Second I am talking about my 40K Ork army which has nothing to do with Age of Sigmar.

As I stated above it has over 350 miniatures.

Over 200 Ork Boyz
130 Gretchen
30 Ork Looters
Over 20 Ork Bikers
Over 10 Ork Kopters
Plus other Ork models

So price this out at today GW prices.

Oh and I do not buy those Battalion boxes due to them having miniatures/models that I do not want.

So yes it would be over $1,800. USD

So I am not wrong and inflation has nothing to do with this.

Oh and Age of Sigmar is not Warhammer Fantasy Battle and to me the miniatures for are just plain horrible in both style and cost.

At one point there was a nice thread going.
Mithmee: You have had some really positive post recently. Proud of you bro!! I do understand where you are coming from, but the game (and company) is still growing even after all these years which means there will be changes to the troops you love and the rules as well. They are trying to make a living as well.

Mitochodria: Not sure how you are contributing..

I recently got back into warhammer because of the Betrayal at Calth set and the price. Started in 88 and collected off and on again until 07. Kind of want to play Armageddon Shadow war, but want to play Space Marines, not Scouts. I bought Kill team for a small scale skirmish game, but would rather it be more like Armageddon.

"GW is still no where near that type of price with their Box Sets"

"Second I am talking about my 40K Ork army which has nothing to do with Age of Sigmar."

You were literally talking about GW boxed sets.

You're not only wrong about GW, you're wrong about what you yourself wrote.

You're wrong squared.

"The AoS Bleeped text is all monopose and people are eating it up for $12 USD USD+ per miniature."

See, ignorant of the facts.

I see that you have still have not priced out what those miniatures would cost.

Here I will start it out.

130 Gretchen

13 x $16.50 USD = $214.50 USD

24 x Ork Bikers

8 x $41.25 USD = $330.00 USD

So nearly $550 USD without tax, with tax close to $600. USD

So try doing the Ork Boyz, and you have to get them from GW.

I know that is not fair but we are talking about GW prices.

Oh sorry guys, too late at night for math apparently. Spire of Dawn is $1.08 USD per miniature.

Mitochondria, at one point I preferred multipart posable miniatures. Now, with limited hobby time, dynamically single-posed minis work well for me. That being said, the Stormcast kits that aren't part of the starter sets can be equipped with various weapon options and posed in various ways. If you're going to rail against something you should have some knowledge about your subject.

Mithmee, are you trying to convince us that GW starter sets are a great value? No need, we can definitely agree on that!

Wow you got me!

"The one or two boxes out of an entire range is posable, therefore the entire range is poseable!"

Only if you like to struck with miniatures that you do not want.

But if you want to be struck 10 Deff Dreads than use that the Starter Box for Orks.

That still would be 10 x $85 USD or $850 USD before tax and for me around $940 USD with tax.

Though you will still be short around 20 Ork Boyz give or take.

It does not matter how you try to buy what I have for my 40K Ork army you will to shell out a chunk of money if you buy from GW.

Because their prices today are overpriced.

Mitochondria, good job recognizing that I did get you. You said AoS is all monopose, and you're wrong. Nice attempt at changing the goalpost though.

Yes Mithmee the dollar is worth less than it was 20 years ago, we again agree on something. Honestly at this point I'm trying to figure out what your argument is when we both agree that starter sets are a good value. Are you not saying you bought some 40k starter sets and it allowed you to make two inexpensive armies? What am I missing?

Can we move on already? How many times are we going to end up in this conversation on any and all GW posts? And yes, I can simply scroll past, but then I need to search out the positings that do not have these comments…

To drag the thread back on track, I drifted out of 40K after 3rd edition and the new edition+the Shadow War thing will probably bring me back, at least a little bit.

It's kind of funny to read this as your own rules offerings are good, Ivan.
My own locals are stuck on 40K and a few are getting back into Warzone(1st) thanks to my efforts. People around here don't want to learn completely new rules.
Comes with the greeting of the beards, I guess.

I hate learning rules myself. IF AoS had been a 120 page rule book with all kinds of special rules and complexity I would never have jumped in.

Four pages though, I can read that.

Similarly with 7th edition 40K. When I bought the BaC set I pulled out my copy of the little rule book for that, which I hadn't read, started reading it, saw it was over 100 pages of rules and just pulled out 3rd edition after 10 or more years.

Edit to my previous comment: "Greying" of the beards***
Pictors- you may have missed out on some good gaming. 7th gives a good game. My personal preference is 3rd, with 7th a very slight second place. 8th may be the new champ though…

Age of Sigmar is filled with Special rules since every unit has it own rules.

I like "the greeting of the beards"!

And it's a "thing",apparently:

link

Capt Flash – Thanks!

I fundamentally just like playing lots of different things and I want to try /everything/ :-)

Besides, I could call it market research! :)