ochoin | 03 Apr 2017 3:33 p.m. PST |
I have no desire to discuss theology here but religion plays a part in life & perhaps should play a part in wargaming? As I'm working on the Mahdist Revolt at the moment (a conflict disturbingly like contemporary troubles with ISIS), it's been on my mind. I feel I don't give enough credence to religion in any of my games. Undoubtedly Fantasy gamers do: magic after all takes a role in such games. But where are the motivations of strong, even fanatical beliefs in any of my games? There's surely room for Divine Rulers in my Bronze Age gaming, divination in Punics. My Dark Age warriors seem devoid of superstition, and my Covenators seem to have never had a thought about Salvation. And, as noted above, where is religion in my Colonial games? Do any of your games take heed of religion & how? |
Grignotage | 03 Apr 2017 4:01 p.m. PST |
Well, I suppose it fits into morale in many games---true believers having higher morale, a willingness to suffer losses, etc. I played in a Medieval game ages ago where each side had faith dice they could use as rerolls. Warhammer 40k had a clever faith mechanism for Sisters of Battle. Historical games could feature objectives and victory points that factor in religious beliefs or concerns. |
robert piepenbrink | 03 Apr 2017 6:26 p.m. PST |
My feeling is that religion, like politics and economics, mostly takes place "off-table." As Grignotage points out, objectives and possibly morale can be affected by religion, but fighting over a shrine isn't inherently different from fighting over a political symbol or--most of the time--an economic objective. In fact, I think I could make a pretty good case that most of the time religious faith, like political conviction, isn't a factor in battlefield morale. A belief in a righteous cause may cause people to enlist and not to desert but it (mostly) won't keep them in ranks under heavy fire. Training and discipline do that, though some units motivated by religion are well-trained and strictly disciplined. I think generally, the lower the level of the game the more the religion of the forces should show up on the tabletop--more in a skirmish than in a massed battle, and more in an RPG than in a "proper" skirmish. (Mind you, if we're talking a colonial campaign, that might be quite different. What I'm talking about here is the tabletop.) The thing about fantasy games is that they have regular miracles of a sort barely distinguishable from artillery fire--in fact often a little more reliable than artillery support. As G.K. Chesterton points out, authentic suspensions of natural law are rare, and the truly religious man is more likely to detect the fakes. Omens are another matter. But Omens have to be interpreted, and so are more a reflection of leadership than faith. Hope this helps. |
Ed Mohrmann | 03 Apr 2017 6:44 p.m. PST |
Our game 'Temperance Tantrum' (skirmish level, but no soldiers involved !) pits the women of Millersville, Iowa, against the 'papist idolater' who dared open a saloon in their town ! Urged on by Euphegenia Spatchcock, wife of the Rev. Dr. Hiram James Spatchcock, the ladies are bound and determined to re-establish morality and virtue in their town (getting rid of the – ah – 'ceiling inspectors' who work upstairs in the saloon will be a welcome by product….) This is an RPG/historical miniatures game developed locally as a way to get more women involved in conflict gaming and it is a hoot every time we've run it. Carrie Nation and Nellie Bly are featured in the game. Religion of a sort…. |
Henry Martini | 03 Apr 2017 7:57 p.m. PST |
Chris Peers' 'In the Heart of Africa' allows for the presence and morale effect of witch doctors, and Dan Mersey's Dux Bellorum has an optional 'monks' rule, and 'The Pikemen's Lament', which he co-wrote, includes a rule for priests. |
Fat Wally | 04 Apr 2017 6:07 a.m. PST |
Baroque has rules for ECW Preachers |
ITALWARS | 04 Apr 2017 6:37 a.m. PST |
of course it cannot be let outside …the association to a toy army with a particular religion it's important in the games i share with some game friends..same as politics..some difficulties (solved by a dice trow) on forcing somebody among us to play with Dervishes,Desert ennemies of FL, NWF tribesmen ecc…while, on the other hand, everybody , including me of course, is happy to game with Vendéens or Pontifical Army… |
daler240D | 04 Apr 2017 7:44 a.m. PST |
yeah I think fanaticism, berserkers etc is dealt with pretty commonly in many rules. On the specific point of religion though I think Maurice had a preacher character card giving a morale bonus to troops. |
vtsaogames | 04 Apr 2017 9:46 a.m. PST |
The thing about fantasy games is that they have regular miracles of a sort barely distinguishable from artillery fire--in fact often a little more reliable than artillery support. Hear, hear! |
Buff Orpington | 04 Apr 2017 10:02 a.m. PST |
+2 for being British, a clear example of Divine Will. |
War Artisan | 04 Apr 2017 10:13 a.m. PST |
Having a game include supernatural events is fantasy. Having a game include the effect of the units'/characters' belief in supernatural events is a different thing entirely. If the effects of such beliefs on their behavior accords with the historical record, then that would be historical. |
Great War Ace | 04 Apr 2017 5:22 p.m. PST |
This how we handle it in our medieval rules: ALL TROOPS BEGIN AS FANATIC "A" MORALE. If any unit fails morale for any reason, all units which can "see" this happen revert to normal rolled up morale. Further, routed units are unrecoverable (the "abandoned by God" rule). The above excerpt is for "Arab Jihad Armies 650 A. D. to 800 A. D." But it would apply to any jihad period. |
ochoin | 04 Apr 2017 9:10 p.m. PST |
a clear example of Divine Will.
Well, handsome enough, I guess, but I'd draw the line at describing him as "divine" (though my daughter thinks brother Harry is).
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Bunkermeister | 04 Apr 2017 11:11 p.m. PST |
I include the proper chaplain figures in my units and they have an effect on morale similar to that of an officer. It helps restore broken morale and helps maintain morale as average. Mike Bunkermeister Creek Bunker Talk blog |
ITALWARS | 05 Apr 2017 1:26 a.m. PST |
of course is "divine" ..in stealing taxpayers |
ochoin | 05 Apr 2017 1:34 a.m. PST |
of course is "divine" ..in stealing taxpayers I put this in Google translator. "naturalmente, è "divino" ..nel contribuenti rubare" Either way, I don't get your drift. |
ITALWARS | 05 Apr 2017 1:45 a.m. PST |
..try this |