"When is it a miniatures game?" Topic

So I was thinking: What makes something a "miniatures game" ? (as opposed to a wargame).

In which of the following cases would you say its a miniatures game?

Obviously something like Warhammer is a miniatures game.

What about PBI or Square Bashing? (Miniature figures but playing on a grid).

What about a board game like War of the Ring or Warhammer Quest? (Miniature figures but playing on a board)

What if I use something like Roll20 to play Warhammer digitally?

What if I play Warhammer with paper figures?

What about D&D using plastic miniatures?

This obviously has no real import in the world and is subject to significant pedantry, making it a perfect forum discussion so to you: What is a "miniatures game" ?

For me I think once scenery gets involved. My opinion is still out though on gridded tables.

Oh, here we go again with the need to classify things and define them.
I don't really care.
I do remember the "Cry Havoc" boardgame from days of yore. It had card counters on a hex grid map, representing individual men but in various stages of distress, mounted and on foot. Sure seemed like a Miniatures game to me. I even played it with Miniatures.

This is like getting stressed over "Historical" in Historicon or HMGS.

The following are my opinions and my opinions alone.

Anything that uses figures of less than 1:1 scale as pieces in a game. Full stop.

That game could include a board, it might not. (A board is really just a representation of terrain). RPGs are not miniatures games per se, but those that choose to use them in their RPG are in fact playing both an RPG and a miniatures game.

Paper figures to me are miniatures- I have seen some very impressive paper figures used in games. How is that different than the various metal flats I've seen?

If you and friends play 1/16 RC tanks in a game, then that's a miniatures game- just motorized.

I think the scope of what is a miniatures game is pretty wide.

Who is 'stressed?' He asked a general and rhetorical question. That's not stress. Saying 'here we go again' is.

You seem really touchy lately. I honestly wish you well and that you get some nice R&R time soon to recharge. Hopefully GoT picking up again over the summer will improve your mood.

I have played boardgames that were almost like a miniatures game, and I've played battles with miniaures that could have just as easily been a boardgame. As long as we are having fun, it's all OK.

Essentially, a miniatures game is something that is both:

1.) game
2.) involves miniatures as core gaming pieces

Miniature games can then be further divided into sub-categories, such as:

a.) Tabletop miniature games
b.) Miniature boardgames

It is a miniatures game when people call it a miniatures game.

If people call it something else, then it's not a miniatures game.

To me, it comes down to freedom of movement. If you can move and position figures/units any way you like, it's a miniatures game. If you are "restricted" (hex, grid, dot, area, etc.) then its a game with miniatures.

That said, at a low enough level, such as pixels on a screen, they could merge -- the gridded locations so close together that figures/units appear to be unrestricted in movement. For example, in some 1970s boardgames, units "faced" a side of the hex. Later, some designs allowed facing to be either the flat side of the hex or the point (intersection) of the lines, giving 12 facings instead of six.

Great games can use either type of game design.

miniatures game
game with miniatures

Talk about splitting hairs …

Game. Miniatures in any one scale. 3D Terrain. So:

Dioramas are not.
Risk is not, even if you use the tricorne pieces, and Chess is not even if you use wargame figures.
NB is not if you use the cardboard counters in the old box set.
Ogre is not if you play the original microgame.

But Ogre is--if you use miniatures on a hex map with dimensional terrain. Same with NB, except you don't need hexes.

Remember "hard cases make bad law." When I was gearing up for what would have been my last deployment, I had a completely non-metallic miniatures set based on Risk pieces, an Ogre microgame, and sets of cardboard counters meant to look like miniatures seen from above to play Shako on sheets of butcher paper. By my own standard, only one of these three would have been a miniatures game.

WOW! I don't know. I would just call them all games. When I have a "Wargame" I just invite people over for a game. I call it a game. I send out invitations to the "Game". So, I don't know the difference.

I figured since the answer to this question is 100% subjective and has absolutely no relevance to the world at large, it'd be perfect for a discussion :)

Doug – We always used to just say "game", whether we were roleplaying, doing board games or mini's.

Yeah, that's what I figured. I think most people call them "games". Anyway, it's interesting what everyone thinks.

Well, the original post presents an interesting question, and I, for one, am glad you asked it. Many people have wondered about the differences among wargames, board games, miniatures games, role playing games, and craps games. And well they should. All of these games are enjoyed by people of all ages and almost all walks of life, but all are also under threat by killjoys and spoilsports, who cannot abide seeing people enjoying their free time in harmless pursuits. So we must come together to resist intrusions on our right to game. That is my platform, and on it, I shall roll my dice.

Please vote Oberlindes for Imperial Senate.

I am the seneschal to Serge von Oberlindes, and I approve this message.

Winston Smith and John the OFM are always eloquent on these "definition" questions.

Call me crazy for being logical, and stating the obvious here, which might get me DH'd (frequently does, based upon past experience).

Anytime "miniatures" are used for a "game".

Therefore, putting them out for display, cleanup, and painting/prepping doesn't count.

When you use miniatures in your game, it is a miniatures game.

Winston Smith and John the OFM are always eloquent on these "definition" questions.

I disagree. John has indeed an amazing ability to establish the meaning with a perfect economy of words but that other Winston chap hasn't a clue

What if I play Warhammer with paper figures?

You receive a cease and desist letter from GW?

You guys are going to love the follow up question :/

I have no idea. I play simulation wargames with figures and 3D terrain to aid understanding of the complexities being modeled. Flay counters on a flat boatd is a Board game. Personally some figures deteract from the game as they are too detailed and damage prone so are not fit for purpose. The emphasis on Minatures just leaves me noplussed, is it about making 1001 poses for no reasonable wargame reason?

Not a serious post please note. ;-).

You guys are going to love the follow up question :/

Lemme guess … If you have 15/10 vision, does it matter if your figures are painted? :)

UshCha – None of this is serious :-)

I never regarded RPGs as miniature gaming, even if a few are used. Several good cross over games which can be played with cards or minis are out there. Wings of War/Glory is one. Some like Command and Colors were often play tested with minis before becoming a block board game.
So us