BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 6:21 a.m. PST |
I'm working on command stands with the new Perry Union plastic infantry and I was wondering where exactly should I be putting my drummers to be as close to historically accurate as possible? All of my units are either charging or in a firing line if that helps. I have a handful of Buglers to also put into my units as well if anyone can tell me how best to distribute them. Any help is greatly appreciated. |
JimDuncanUK | 28 Dec 2016 6:37 a.m. PST |
It all depends on how detailed you want your units to be. My 30mm ACW units have one or two drummers with the Colonel as well as two or one ensigns and a Captain or 5 figures in total. I sometimes use buglers instead of drummers. link
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Extrabio1947 | 28 Dec 2016 6:37 a.m. PST |
This won't help you much, but Hardee's Tactics state the field music (drummers, fifers, buglers) should stand 12 paces behind the left center company's file closers when the regiment was in line. Field music was not a part of the color guard. |
BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 6:43 a.m. PST |
JimDuncanUK: Cracking looking zouaves. So you wouldn't use the drummers alongside the buglers? Extrabio1947: It helps a little, sounds like my drummer should be off behind the centre company as a seperate stand, which means i probably wont use them. |
Frederick | 28 Dec 2016 6:43 a.m. PST |
I put a drummer on my command stands along with an officer and the standard bearers – not totally accurate but it looks good |
BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 6:45 a.m. PST |
Frederick: I usually like to do that, I have a bugler in that position right now but I have four regiments that I'm working on and about 6 plastic drummers that arent doing anything of use |
Extrabio1947 | 28 Dec 2016 6:55 a.m. PST |
If you want to include drummers, simply put them in the second rank behind the color guard. Absent sticking them on a separate stand, this would be the most authentic placement. |
BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 7:02 a.m. PST |
I usually put my standard bearers in the second rank behind my main officer and a musician to his left, I'm guessing this isnt accurate either. |
nazrat | 28 Dec 2016 7:32 a.m. PST |
If you believe one particular wag on the Nappies Board they take fifteen years to train so they would always be in school learning how to "properly" drum under combat conditions… 8)= |
JimDuncanUK | 28 Dec 2016 8:05 a.m. PST |
@Saxon Cracking looking zouaves. So you wouldn't use the drummers alongside the buglers? I don't mix drummers and buglers in the same unit, at least I don't think so. I have 16 infantry regiments as well as 4 cavalry regiments in storage and my memory ain't what it used to be. I also have artillery units who don't have musicians at all. |
jowady | 28 Dec 2016 8:48 a.m. PST |
In actual usage, field musicians such as drummers and fifers were detailed to help with the wounded. Commands were generally passed by the buglers, who therefore should be near your commanders. Drummers are, IMO, way overrepresented in ACW command packs. Drummers were often the youngest men in the regiments, many being close to or still in childhood. |
BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 8:54 a.m. PST |
jowady: I saw a discussion about this before about them being overrepresented, when the Perry union command sprue was shown everyone was excited about a bugle arm being in there as it was more common. |
CATenWolde | 28 Dec 2016 9:13 a.m. PST |
I know this isn't what you were looking for, but … I don't put musicians on my units at all. Instead, I use them as game markers, or sometimes grouped together for scenic effect. @Jim – great looking Old School figures! |
Extrabio1947 | 28 Dec 2016 9:18 a.m. PST |
Nazrat, when I was in the Colonial Williamsburg Fifes and Drums, we typically rehearsed and trained 4-6 hours per day, depending on the performance schedule. Subsequently, I've played in an ACW fife and drum corps for about 20 years (typically using Bruce & Emmett as a guide) and once you learned how to control the side drum on uneven ground, it is relatively easy. The commands are simple and easily mastered. |
StoneMtnMinis | 28 Dec 2016 9:51 a.m. PST |
" Drummers were often the youngest men in the regiments, many being close to or still in childhood." On my mothers side of the family her great grandfather was a drummer with Sherman on his march to the sea. He was 13 at the time(he lied about his age). Dave |
robert piepenbrink | 28 Dec 2016 10:35 a.m. PST |
Great-grandfather Piepenbrink was a musician with an Indiana regiment--79th, if I remember correctly. But he was in his twenties. (And if I have to be carried on a stretcher, I want full-grown men carrying it, thank you!) I'm completely ahistorical on drummer placement, by the way. Drummers in reversed colors get the center of the front tank. So do drummers with lots of lace in 28mm and higher. But if there's nothing to show off, they get shuffled back to the rear ranks. |
jowady | 28 Dec 2016 12:26 p.m. PST |
On my mothers side of the family her great grandfather was a drummer with Sherman on his march to the sea. He was 13 at the time(he lied about his age).Dave
I have read accounts where young teen signed up to be drummers, their mothers were told that they would be safe because, as drummers they wouldn't be in the battlelines, kind of hard to do if you're standing next to the commanding officer or the color guard. There were exceptions, Custer had his band play the Michigan Brigade into combat but then again that was Custer and they didn't charge with the Brigades. The bugle is a much more effective instrument than the drum for giving commands in battle. It's a line from a song for another war but it seems apropos for the situation; "Do what the buglers command They're in the Army and not in a Band". |
ScottWashburn | 28 Dec 2016 12:27 p.m. PST |
Contrary to myth, regimental drummers and fifers were NOT sent off to help with the wounded. There were two different types of musicians in the army. There was the Field Music which had the drummers and fifers and buglers. These had an important function in battle and would not be detached. Early in the war a regiment would also have a band (later you rarely found these below brigade level). These musicians were strictly for entertainment and THESE are the ones who might be sent off to help with the wounded. But as noted, the field music was formed as a separate body behind the line of battle. |
NCC1717 | 28 Dec 2016 1:55 p.m. PST |
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BeefForDinner | 28 Dec 2016 2:06 p.m. PST |
@ScottWashburn do you know how they would have been formed up during the battle? I wouldn't mind having a whole base made up of drummers for this purpose |
Extrabio1947 | 28 Dec 2016 6:51 p.m. PST |
They were formed in four ranks, again 12 paces behind the file closers. Since the regulation distance between ranks was 13 inches, measured from the back of the knapsack of the front soldier to the chest of the rear soldier, drummers were typically in the first rank of this formation, with fifers and buglers in ranks two through four. |
KeithRK | 29 Dec 2016 7:57 a.m. PST |
This is the diagram of an Infantry Regiment in Order of Battle from Hardee's. The Field Music is at position X.
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Extrabio1947 | 29 Dec 2016 8:33 a.m. PST |
F is the regimental band, if there was one. |
donlowry | 29 Dec 2016 9:35 a.m. PST |
Cracking looking zouaves. Yeah, but the buglers and color-bearer are out of step! |
JimDuncanUK | 29 Dec 2016 10:07 a.m. PST |
Yeah, but the buglers and color-bearer are out of step!
If you look closely at any large group of marching men you will always find a few out of step. When I was a pre-teen I learned to march in an organisation called the Life Boys. Second thing you were taught was a little skip-step to turn your out-of-step mode into step. Some guys just never got it. |
Trajanus | 29 Dec 2016 12:36 p.m. PST |
I love those old Drill Book prints. Always leave me wondering where the Regiments got the Circus horses from! Well apart from Circuses, obviously! |
Trajanus | 29 Dec 2016 12:39 p.m. PST |
Second thing you were taught was a little skip-step to turn your out-of-step mode into step. They all do it Jim. Trust me, I have seen Regulars do it on, many, many, occasions. Sometimes they were stone cold sober too! |
Old Glory | 29 Dec 2016 10:29 p.m. PST |
"Gone to graveyards everyone, when will they ever learn, when will they ever learn ::::: " |
BeefForDinner | 30 Dec 2016 2:34 p.m. PST |
thanks for the picture KeithRK, i definitely know what I'm doing with them now, many thanks gents! |
Musketier | 01 Jan 2017 2:33 p.m. PST |
Coming late to the party, but since drummers were stationed behind the line, I like to use them as markers for the unit's strength or cohesion (depending on the rules). |