UshCha | 15 Dec 2016 10:54 a.m. PST |
We have recently tried a route reconnaissance game using effectively a 900m by 5km board. As a trial it went well. However it raised questions. It seems that both the defender and the "attacker" need a credible brief. Below is a stab at what such a brief (in terms useful in a wargame). The real brief forms require knowledge and detail that is practically beyond my current capability to supply in a useful way. "Wargames" brief topics. As a defender (we have now decided) you may have a series of tasks. 1) Monitor the position and penetration of the enemy through the route. This in itself may split into technically to aspects:- a. Monitoring forces coming down the road which will be unstealthy. b. Stopping forces entering the area by a more stealthy route. These will be at different positions. A unit tasked with a. is unlikely to be in a position to undertake b. and may not have the skill for it either. 2) Remaining hidden so that you can see what is coming up behind the reconnaissance group. As the attacker the options are:- 1) Use this sector to penetrate down the road simply as a means to an end. Which is to get into enemy territory well beyond this section of the route. 2) Find out what is positioned along this report and the suitability of the road for heavy grade use in offensive, engagements only being fought if absolutely necessary. 3) If very likely held, eliminate or drive off enemy along the route to allow either friendly (e.g. returning recon) units to retire through this section safely or allow other friendlies to use the route going through for similar reasons. Can you see any flaws in these briefs? Are there other credible briefs that can be added? It looks like potentially there are two types of forces involved. For Germans as an example in defence. The watch Company/ platoon may do (1) as "disposable" troops whereas the specialist recon vehicles may do (2) using its systems to keep contact while being unobserved, perhaps in some cases recording the demise of Watch positions. Opinions? |
11th ACR | 15 Dec 2016 11:11 a.m. PST |
You may want to use some of the tasks used in real (US Army) Route Recon. I lost count of the number of Route Recon I conducted in my 20 years as a U.S. Army Cavalry Scout. I have conducted them every-way you can think of: Dismounted. M-113, M-901. Gun (M-60 MG)Jeep, TOW Jeep. Gun (M-60 MG) HUMMWV, TOW HUMMWV. M-3 Bradley. All take forever to conduct and you never have the time to do it correct, do to the number of Tasks you have to conduct. ----------------------------------------------------------- Route reconnaissance tasks are as follows: Find, report, and clear within capabilities all enemy forces that can influence movement along the route. Determine the trafficability of the route; can it support the friendly force? Reconnoiter all terrain that the enemy can use to dominate movement along the route, such as choke points, ambush sites, and pickup zones, landing zones, and drop zones. Reconnoiter all built-up areas, contaminated areas, and lateral routes along the route. Evaluate and classify all bridges, defiles, overpasses and underpasses, and culverts along the route. Locate any fords, crossing sites, or bypasses for existing and reinforcing obstacles (including built-up areas) along the route. Locate all obstacles and create lanes as specified in execution orders. Report the above route information to the headquarters initiating the route reconnaissance mission, to include providing a sketch map or a route overlay.
----------------------------------------------------------- And remember all of theses tasks are done hopefully without making contact with the enemy. Yea! Here are a few references for you. link link linklinkOn the other hand who ever is defending the area will most likely be a few OP's/LP's, a counter Recon Screen or the Main Defensive Belt. I hope this will help. Robert Henry |
M C MonkeyDew | 15 Dec 2016 12:19 p.m. PST |
ushChar, thank you for posting this topic. 11th ACR thank you very much for your detailed and illustrated comments! This is the sort of thing I like to include in games although in my case they usually predated the automobile. Cheers Bob |
Saber6 | 15 Dec 2016 1:37 p.m. PST |
Probably best as a player (recon) vs game (defender) type scenario. To go with the never have time, impose a turn limit or use a game end die roll mechanism. |
Legion 4 | 15 Dec 2016 2:38 p.m. PST |
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UshCha | 16 Dec 2016 7:34 a.m. PST |
ACR, Thanks for that! Can you give some examples of what a Recon Screen might consist of a the lower end. If you were posted for time and it was a rural route how long would you need to cover what would be a lightly held route 5km long. A wide range is acceptable. If the resistance was light and you were required to drive it off would you use the initial force or have a second command to do the mopping up (Item two of your first post). how long would it take and how would you check a small built up area on the route. Say 10 dwellings and a couple of barns. Thanks in advance. I will in the end try and set up a scenario or two for folk to look at. Not sure how rules independent some of it will be but it may help. |
Darkest Star Games | 16 Dec 2016 9:45 a.m. PST |
Wow, that's incredible! I've never seen a report like that, a real eye opener. Thanks 11th ACR! |
CavScout8thCav | 16 Dec 2016 11:06 a.m. PST |
Rubs temples at the headaches route recons could provide. |
Legion 4 | 16 Dec 2016 12:01 p.m. PST |
Indeed … |
11th ACR | 16 Dec 2016 12:24 p.m. PST |
Time, Time, Time, and we NEVER had the time to conduct a proper Route Recon. On just a normal Route Recon during an evaluation of lets say 20km's long we would be given perhaps 10 hrs. to conduct it. And you hope you do not make contact with the enemy. To many things to check (Route reconnaissance tasks) from above. As a Scout Plt we would normally be divided in to three sections. With two vehicles per section. One section (Plt Ldr "Lt") and Plt Sgt "(SFC)"is on the rout clearing it and classifying it. The other two sections are on either side of the rout clearing terrain and enemy forces that can influence movement along the route. If one of the sections makes contact with the enemy the other two can action on the enemy. Also in most cases you have back up from other Plt's that can take on the enemy so you can continue your mission or take over the mission if you are heavily engaged. Your question of: "If you were posted for time and it was a rural route how long would you need to cover what would be a lightly held route 5km long. A wide range is acceptable." To conduct 5km's correctly, I would say 10 hrs. That's checking everything that is on the list and hopefully you do not have contact with the enemy or mine fields etc. "If the resistance was light and you were required to drive it off would you use the initial force or have a second command to do the mopping up (Item two of your first post).' If "resistance was light" OP's LP's you could most likely handle it at your level. But once yo run it two any thing heavy, T""TANK'S"" call for support. "How long would it take and how would you check a small built up area on the route. Say 10 dwellings and a couple of barns." We as scouts hated clearing Built-up areas. "Let the Grunts do it. But lets just say "10 dwellings and a couple of barns." I would say a hasty Recon of one hr. a good dedicated of Recon of three-four hr's. Doing a Built-up area of "10 dwellings and a couple of barns." you may just want to use your thermal sights scan the place and look for any tell-tail signs of the enemy and hand if off to a follow on unit. A Build up are such as this may need an "Area Recon" conducted. Remember that your Recon unit in most cases belongs to a larger unit. So if it were a Scout Plt from an Inf Bn. you could had off that clearing operation to the Inf co following you. Also most Recon units are not large in number's. Example a U.S Scout Plt 1980-2000 was only 30 total personnel. Two other types of Recon you may want to try are: ZONE RECON: link link AREA RECON: link link If you or others have questions fill free to ask. I have been out since 2000 so some info is rusty but the stuff we did is still in the memory vault. Robert Henry |
UshCha | 17 Dec 2016 2:21 a.m. PST |
ACR, WHAT HAVE YOU DONE ;-). I have now had to post a thread on terrian asking for line art of a tree lined road. This is to make laser cut Flats of the trees so I can have tree lined roads. If they are a significant factor then ALL my games must have that terrain type available. For those wouldering, they have to be flats so as no to take up too much board. I guess vehicles even behind such a row may be harder to spot and I assume if there are lots of tree lined roads its difficault time consuming to look in detail down them all. |
11th ACR | 17 Dec 2016 11:48 a.m. PST |
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Legion 4 | 17 Dec 2016 3:31 p.m. PST |
Time, Time, Time, and we NEVER had the time to conduct a proper Route Recon. Yes, that generally was the situation. We'd run a quick dismounted patrol once we disembarked. And sometime … that is the best you could do. "Let the Grunts do it. " Yes, I know … When I joined in '79. The Recon Patrols were Area and Point, IIRC. But the newer terms came about later while I was on active duty. But basically it's the same thing. I guess vehicles even behind such a row may be harder to spot and I assume if there are lots of tree lined roads its difficault time consuming to look in detail down them all.
Yes, you try to get everything under cover and/or concealment. You don't want to be seen at all. You'll survive longer … AND get the mission done. |
badger22 | 18 Dec 2016 6:25 a.m. PST |
11th ACR and Legion 4, Did you guys coordinate with the Artty for on call Tgts for a recon? We always got a long list of TgTs, but rarely did we get a break down of what they where for. We used to shoot something for the rangers on Ft Lewis that they called a walk and shoot. They where usualy even worse than regular grunts about telling us what was involved, but it seem like a recon just to find targets to shoot. Is that part of a normal recon, or is it just something those people did? Owen |
Legion 4 | 18 Dec 2016 8:36 a.m. PST |
Yes, we did that as all part of the planning for any mission. Patrolling or otherwise. And that is not only taught in places like the US ARMY RANGER School but in all Infantry training, etc. With preplanned targets as well as just the standard "Call for Fire". We were all trained to do that. And we usually had a Fire Support Tm from the FA unit in DS of our Bn, etc., … Sometimes they'd come along on the patrol. But certainly on a larger mission. As many times Patrols may only be in Squad sized strength. On the DMZ in the ROK. Our patrols would recon sites during the day to set up night ambush positions later. Which included Fire Support planning. Again that was the norm in any event. And part of Ambush Patrol Planning was to call-in supporting fires on routes into the ambush site, etc. And even on the ambush site/Kill Zone as you withdraw. On many missions whether you have a Squad sized or even a Platoon sized Patrol. You would halt the Patrol and set up a hasty 360. Near the Objective. Sometimes called the Objective Rally Point(ORP) Then the Leader, RTO, etc. goes forward and does "a Leaders Recon" with 3-4 troops. To observe the Objective to see any changes, etc. If things went "bad" sometimes calling-in FA would help you break contact, etc., … Or even if you have no other option but to call-in FA or CAS on the Objective. And get the Hell out of Dodge ! FA would be plotted along your planned Patrol Route. As well as on alternates if possible, time permits, etc. Plus you always had your FIST Tm or yourself/troops to call-in supporting fires as needed. Sometimes things moved fast enough that you can't preplan support. But again, you always have the ability to call-in FA regardless. but rarely did we get a break down of what they where for. Sometimes time wouldn't permit detail. But when you'd call-in pre-plotted fires. Sometimes you wouldn't know what was at that location just that you unit would be in the area. At future time. And you might need the support because of the situation, etc., The caller would say the preplanned fire designation, like AB1001, followed by a quick description. Like enemy Infantry in woods. Or Armor Plt in the open, etc., … |
11th ACR | 18 Dec 2016 11:57 a.m. PST |
"badger22" Yes we would normally receive a list of TRP's (Target Reference Point's) that our FIST had were registered with both our 4.2 Mortars and our direct support Art. Plus we would normally give them a load of TRP's of locations we expect to make contact or just in case of. The most TRP's I ever had on one set of Graphics was 100. Yea, TRP A-01 through TRP A-100. One of the nice things about being a Scout was Calling our own fire missions and air strikes. Not having to go threw the FIST. Yes the FIST was out there but he was working his own fire mission. That dose not mean we got ours every time but do to us being forward of the FIST and in a more dangers position to the enemy we would have priority of fires. Also some time we would send up the mission and the FIST would pass it to a higher level of support so we would get our mission. |
Legion 4 | 18 Dec 2016 1:49 p.m. PST |
That's it TRP ! … I'm getting old … Yes, and like I said, sometimes we'd go thru the FIST … other situations we'd could call it in on our own. From NCO on up we were trained to call in a Fire Mission. At Bn level in both Infantry and Armor there was a 4.2 inch Mortar Plt as well. IIRC, 3 M106s [M113 w/4.2 mounted in troop compartment] and an M577 FDC. |
11th ACR | 18 Dec 2016 2:10 p.m. PST |
And then the great part of being in an ACR, each Sqdn has it's own How Battery. |
Legion 4 | 18 Dec 2016 4:05 p.m. PST |
Everybody like the Big Guns ! |
badger22 | 18 Dec 2016 6:13 p.m. PST |
11th ACR for desert storm my BN was "attached" to the 2nd squadron How bat, so you had a 32 gun how bat. 2nd ACR instead of 11th though. They seemed to appreciate the added fire power. We would take missions from anybody, as long as we knew they where a legit source, and we could figure out what they wanted. Some maneuver guys were good at calling for fire, some were not. my favorites were when REMFs called fire, they usually were pretty clueless. My favorites were calling for fire on flying choppers, and calling for fire on "the bridge. the one by the Church" In Germany where there is a bridge and Church about every 500 meters. |
11th ACR | 18 Dec 2016 11:52 p.m. PST |
Yea you sometimes you get some real winner's call for fire some times. One of our Scout Plts was doing a movement to contact, and they called in a 4.2" fire mission. But moved forward before the rounds were fired. Yea, on the next phase line just as they moved in to position the rounds started following. The phase line was the location they called for the mission. Everyone in that Plt wanted to kill the guy who called the mission, and there Lt for telling everyone to move to that phase line. (I watch from a few kl to the right of them with ammeasment as I saw it all come together and there was nothing I could do.
No casualty's, but some TA-50 strapped to the outside of those Bradly's had holes in them. |
11th ACR | 18 Dec 2016 11:58 p.m. PST |
"UshCha" What you may want to do is, use an OPORD. Issue one to both players and go from there. I'm sure that if you look around the internet you can fine ones for different country's. I'm sure there are little changes from one country to the next. OPORD [sequential order number and fiscal year] [code name] – [issuing headquarters] (place the overall security classification and an abbreviated title at the top of the second and any following pages.) 1. SITUATION. a. Area of Interest. b. Area of Operations. (1) Terrain. (2) Weather. c. Enemy Forces. (1) Composition, Disposition, and Strength. (2) Recent Activities. (3) Locations and Capabilities. (4) Enemy COAs (Courses of Action). d. Friendly Forces. (1) Higher HQ Mission and Intent. (2) Mission of Adjacent Units. e. Attachments and Detachments. 2. MISSION. A concise statement that includes the Who, What, Where, When, and Why of the operation to be conducted. 3. EXECUTION. a. Commander's Intent b. Concept of operations. (1) Maneuver. (2) Fires. (3) Reconnaissance and Surveillance. (4) Intelligence. (5) Engineer. (6) Air Defense. (7) Information Operations. c. Scheme of Movement and Maneuver. d. Scheme of Fires. e. Casualty Evacuation. f. Tasks to Subordinate Units g. Tasks to Combat Support. (1) Intelligence. (2) Engineer. (3) Fire Support. (4) Air Defense. (5) Signal. (6) CBRNE (Chemical, Biological, Radiological, Nuclear, and Explosive weapons) (7) Provost Marshal. (8) MISO (Military Information Support Operations, formerly Psychological Operations or PSYOP) (9) Civil Military. h. Coordinating Instructions. (1) Time or condition when the plan or order becomes effective. (2) CCIR (Commander's Critical Information Requirements) (3) EEFI (Essential Elements of Friendly Information) (4) Risk Reduction Control Measures. (5) Rules of Engagement. (6) Environmental Considerations. (7) Force Protection. 4. SUSTAINMENT. a. Logistics. (1) Sustainment Overlay. (2) Maintenance. (3) Transportation. (4) Supply. (5) Field Services. b. Personnel Services Support. (1) Method of marking and handling EPWs. (2) Religious Services. c. Army Health System Support. (1) Medical Command and Control. (2) Medical Treatment. (3) Medical Evacuation. (4) Preventive Medicine. 5. COMMAND AND CONTROL. a. Command. (1) Location of Commander. (2) Succession of Command. b. Control. (1) Command Posts. (2) Reports. c. Signal. (1) SOI index in effect. (2) Methods of communication by priority. (3) Pyrotechnics and Signals. (4) Code Words. (5) Challenge and Password. (6) Number Combination. (7) Running Password. (8) Recognition Signals. link link |
Legion 4 | 19 Dec 2016 8:45 a.m. PST |
favorites were calling for fire on flying choppers, and calling for fire on "the bridge. the one by the Church" Without coordinates or TRPs … that would be next to worthless ! What you may want to do is, use an OPORD. Ah yes … fond memories ! |
11th ACR | 19 Dec 2016 9:00 a.m. PST |
Granted, on the OPORD you could fine tune it with not as much detail. But still get the point across. |
badger22 | 19 Dec 2016 9:17 a.m. PST |
The hard part was always staying awake through all the crap that had nothing to do with you, waiting for those parts that were absolutely vital to know. Actually a lot of it was stuff i needed to know, but the gun bunnys didnt think they needed to know hardly any of it. |
Lion in the Stars | 19 Dec 2016 11:30 a.m. PST |
@11thACR: How often did opposing recon elements bump into each other? |
Legion 4 | 19 Dec 2016 3:44 p.m. PST |
I know our recon patrols on the DMZ were assigned Patrol Sectors. Within the US TAOR. But it happened occasionally at night. One of our patrols strayed into the ROK sector. Fortunately the Bn Asst 2 and Scout PL were on that patrol. But there were few tense moments. |
Lion in the Stars | 19 Dec 2016 7:36 p.m. PST |
At least that was still on the South side of the border, L4. Things could have been really ugly, otherwise! I was thinking in terms of the classic Meeting Engagement, where two maneuvering armies bump into each other, not the recon into defended territory like what 11thACR seems to be talking about. |
Legion 4 | 20 Dec 2016 7:58 a.m. PST |
You got the right ! That border has been there since '53 … And interestingly an old term for Meeting Engagement was called a "Recon in Force". But either way borders probably wouldn't matter, if at all. Basically you are not only looking for the enemy but to, as some of my NCOs used to say, "find'm, fix'm and F'm Up !
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Apache 6 | 20 Dec 2016 10:44 a.m. PST |
Back to the original posters question: In current US doctrine the defender would likely be a security force operating in the security zone (on the "enemy side" of the forward edge of battle area). The defender would likely be tasked to surveille, screen, guard or cover modern The defender could b security force—The detachment deployed between the main body and the enemy (to the front, flanks, or rear of the main body) tasked with the protection of the main body. The security force may be assigned a screening, guard, or covering mission. screen—1. A security element whose primary task is to observe, identify, and report information, and only fight in self-protection. 2. A form of security operation that primarily provides early warning to the protected force. covering force—A self-contained maneuver force that operates beyond the range of friendly artillery positioned with the main force. A covering force may task-organize to include aviation, artillery, tank, reconnaissance, and combat service support, to operate independently. Unlike a screening or guarding force, the covering force is a self- contained force capable of operating independently of the main body. Guard: A security task to protect the main force by fighting to gain time while also observing and reporting information and preventing enemy ground observation of and direct fire against the main body. Units conducting a guard mission cannot operate independently because they rely upon fires, logistics, and intelligence support from the main body. |
11th ACR | 20 Dec 2016 2:04 p.m. PST |
Lion in the Stars "How often did opposing recon elements bump into each other?" As Recon, most of the time your sneaking and peaking. If both sides Recon unit are doing there job the should never see each other, and if they do it's like two ships in the night passing each other. As a U.S. Cavalry Scout over the years we very seldom ran in to enemy recon units. If it was a close contact you tried to eliminate them before they could notify there higher HQ that we were there. If we saw them at long distance we reported it (SPOT REPORT) and moved on with the mission.In most cases if the enemy recon was stationary we would try to drop indirect on them. In the Defense you try to hand there Recon off to the Counter Recon Screen, or the main defensive belt. A few time we ran in to there DDR patrols on the East west German Boarder. If we saw them first we would call it in (SPOT REPORT)and continue to observe until someone else picked up obsevation or we ould lose visuale with them. We did our best not to cross the Grenz. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I spent 5+ years at NTC as OPFOR Recon. On a BRDM-2 most of that time a few months on a BMP-1. But in both case once you got in a hide you went dismounted. We stayed with Soviet doctrine 99% of the time. On the Deference you try to hand there Recon off to the Counter Recon Screen, or the main defensive belt. Or you may set a Counter Recon Ambush. Try not to get engaged with there recon if at all possible. On the Offence we would try our best to get were we needed to get to get eyes on enemy locations or objectives. Same thing try not to get engaged with there recon, counter recon screen or defensive belt. If at all possible. Hope this helps. |
11th ACR | 20 Dec 2016 2:13 p.m. PST |
For those not knowing what a "SPOT REPORT" is. SPOT REPORT [SPOTREP] Use to send information to provide timely intelligence or status regarding events that could have an immediate and significant effect on current planning and operations. Reference: FM 17-15, FM 17-98, and FM 7-7. LINE 1 -- DATE AND TIME______________________________(DTG) LINE 2 -- UNIT________________________________________(Unit Making Report) LINE 3 -- SIZE_________________________________________(Size of Enemy Unit) LINE 4 -- ACTIVITY____________________________________(Enemy Activity at DTG of Report) LINE 5 -- LOCATION___________________________________(UTM or Six-Digit Grid Coordinate With MGRS Grid Zone Designator) of Enemy Activity or Event Observed) LINE 6 -- UNIT________________________________________(Enemy Unit) LINE 7 -- TIME ________________________________________(DTG of Observation) LINE 8 -- EQUIPMENT__________________________________(Equipment of Unit Observed) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Some units have gone to an abbreviated version. They use L.A.S.T. LINE 1 -- LOCATION___________________________________(UTM or Six-Digit Grid Coordinate With MGRS Grid Zone Designator) of Enemy Activity or Event Observed) LINE 2 -- ACTIVITY____________________________________(Enemy Activity at DTG of Report) LINE 3 -- SIZE_________________________________________(Size of Enemy Unit) LINE 4 -- TIME ________________________________________(DTG of Observation) |
Legion 4 | 20 Dec 2016 2:32 p.m. PST |
We used to call that a SALUTE Report : Size Activity Location Unit Time Equipment |
capt jimmi | 20 Dec 2016 8:44 p.m. PST |
Good info 11ACR and Gents. the 'SMEAC' format is an ideal way to present a scenario. |