Help support TMP


"Review of Miniature Wargames with Battlegames #398" Topic


6 Posts

All members in good standing are free to post here. Opinions expressed here are solely those of the posters, and have not been cleared with nor are they endorsed by The Miniatures Page.

Remember that you can Stifle members so that you don't have to read their posts.

For more information, see the TMP FAQ.


Back to the Magazines and Periodicals Message Board


Areas of Interest

General

Featured Hobby News Article


Featured Link


Featured Ruleset


Featured Showcase Article

The Amazing Worlds of Grenadier

The fascinating history of one of the hobby's major manufacturers.


Featured Workbench Article


Featured Profile Article

Jot Wood Magnet

Personal logo Editor in Chief Bill The Editor of TMP Fezian finds bases at the dollar store!


Current Poll


1,022 hits since 6 Jun 2016
©1994-2024 Bill Armintrout
Comments or corrections?

ubercommando06 Jun 2016 2:48 p.m. PST

The trouble with this time of year is the school holidays and the time I have to spend entertaining my sons whilst they're off school and which means less time writing.

Still, we've been playing a LOT of the Thunderbirds board game which is excellent. Do try it.

And in other news I've now met Wayne Bollands of Wargames Illustrated which means that since I started these reviews I've met senior editorial staff at all 3 major publications….and not been lynched.

and now to this month's topic.

FIRST IMPRESSIONS: A Pike and Shot game (giving a hint to some of the content) played on some lovely terrain boards. As always, the front cover eye candy of MW is of a very high standard.

BRIEFING: There's a recurring theme going on in this month's issue (last issue had WI style eye candy, this month sees a WSS style theme) about what to do to attract new gamers to the hobby. Henry shares some of his thoughts, which get expanded on later in the issue.

WORLD WIDE WARGAMING: I'm becoming a fan of this column, as it often points the reader in the direction of some cool websites for gaming which I'd otherwise not have heard of. There's more ECW rules online and how to use Google hang outs.

FORWARD OBSERVER: Neil Shuck discusses how you can play around with Sharp Practice in 6mm and what attracts people to a game? Personally I find a) is the genre one I'm interested in and b) are there enough figures available for purchase. I find in these debates, as put forward by Messers Shuck and Warwick Kinrade in the most recent WSS (which I lost so that's why I didn't review it), rules are overrated as a deal breaker: Given the plethora of rules out there you're bound to find something appealing. Finally, there's a nice vignette about repurposing a Timpo toy rabbit hutch for a 15mm scale French 20th century garage.

GATES OF AZERA: For something different the Widow builds some sci-fi habitats out of a variety of odds and ends including used e-cigarette vaporisers….ewwwwww!

FANTASY FACTS: John T reviews the aforementioned Thunderbirds game and gives it his own F.A.B. rating. However, I disagree with his recent comments about the new Thunderbirds are Go series…I think it's a very good update of the original and the changes they've made make sense. It is still very consistent with the original; my sons have seen both new and old Thunderbirds and enjoy them both.

I digress; otherwise there's more zombies, some lovely Crooked Dice criminal thugs and the TV cameraman, and some hard SF stuff in 1/300 from Brigade.

THE STALIN LINE: The second in Andrew Rolph's epic re-fight of the entire Great Patriotic War. His stuff is always high quality and although he designs games primarily for the Spearhead rules there's nothing stopping you from easily translating his scenarios for other rules sets.

PUSH OF PIKE AND DINT OF BUTT: A look at tactics in the English Civil War and how to apply them to your games. A lengthy, comprehensive, sometimes opinionated article that is of great use if you're an ECW gamer or would like to start playing the era. Andy Copestake weaves his historical knowledge with reviews of the various rules out there and which ones simulate the various aspects the best. This is definitely cut out and keep if you're into ECW gaming.

EINDECKER PART 3: A sequel rather than a continuation of the previous articles on the subject. Here, you can make your own 1/100th scale Eindecker…my only beef is that the plans aren't really included: There's a couple of photos of plans but no measurements. The results look great but is there a link to a webpage with the plans on them? If not, can we have one?

WITH A FIBleeped textL OF FIGURES: Ideas for skirmish games other than the usual "two sides pitch up at the same time and have a fight". Not a comprehensive list of scenarios, but more set ups, ideas and references to movies and books. Despite it's brevity and condensed format, it's packed with good ideas.

THE LOOK OF THE THING: OK, this is the hot button topic on TMP of late so here's my take on it. You should paint to the level that satisfies you. There is much to what Arthur Harman says about freeing yourself up from the tyranny of 3 layer schemes, shading, outlining, painting eyes and patterns and such like but if that's what you like then fine. I don't know any games club that excludes people on the basis that their figure painting is mediocre so I don't get the idea of the "tyranny of detail". I do think his point about the way soldiers were depicted in contemporary art wasn't exactly realistic is one to take on board, but let's not overstate the case that we're all bogged down trying to be like Kevin Dallimore.

HEX ENCOUNTER: Now first off I'm going to call out Brad Harmer Barnes on yet another swipe at ASL in his column. Pretty soon, Brad, I'll have my article written about my love…or at least respect and awe…of ASL and it will hopefully redress the balance. That aside, here we have a look at the myriad of pulp themed board games from yet more zombies, to Star Wars X wing and the continuing efforts of game designers to turn HP Lovecraft's Cthulhu mythos into a camp joke. Does anyone remember when Call of Cthulhu was scary? It's been a while….

FURTHER THOUGHTS ON INSPIRATION: A different take on the issue of attracting new gamers; this time by appealing to and working with those in other creative hobbies; notably scale modellers, model railway enthusiasts and such like. It all makes sense but I think the key is friendliness; people will want to play games if they think they're going to have fun doing so.

SEND THREE AND FOURPENCE: A common sense article from Conrad Kinch about how to get a full game session in when time is limited. He provides his top tips.

SALUTE 2016: Neil Shuck's take on this years show which chimes with my view on it: A huge success, a sign of a healthy hobby and good socialising but let down by the lack of outstanding games this year. Nice photos accompany the text.

RECCE: The medal of excellence goes to the new Living on the Frontline set of modern English civil war rules, Shadows over Normandie and Modern War Struggle for Kandahar board games, a couple of Napoleonic books and an AWI set of miniatures from Fife and Drum.

OVERALL: Very readable with the usual mix of opinions throughout which have already prompted debate. There are a number of practical articles; namely the Eastern Front WW2 and ECW ones, which are definite keepers, and it succeeds in drawing the reader in, whether you agree with the columnist or not.

arthur181507 Jun 2016 3:08 a.m. PST

Ubercommando,
Thank you for a fair summary of my article.

However, you state 'There is much to what Arthur Harman says about freeing yourself up from the tyranny of 3 layer schemes, shading, outlining, painting eyes and patterns and such' and then apparently contradict yourself by saying, 'I don't get the idea of the "tyranny of detail".' when you had just summarized it rather well.

Nowhere did I suggest that 'any games club…excludes people on the basis that their figure painting is mediocre' – so I don't see where you got that from.

What I was referring to as 'tyranny of detail' is the self-imposed/inflicted belief of some wargamers – stimulated, I believe, by the constant presentation of expertly painted figures and modelled terrain in wargame books, magazines and many blogs – that a such high quality workmanship is necessary to engage in figure wargaming.

Which, of course, is not to say that people who enjoy creating such diorama standard games should not do so.

ubercommando07 Jun 2016 5:11 a.m. PST

I have never heard it said by anyone that high quality painting is necessary to engage in wargaming. Judging by the comments your article has generated on various blogs, I think most people feel you've overstated that case.

I can see why you would think that I'm apparently contradicting myself with my comments on the tyranny of detail. I was being more nuanced than that. There's much to be said in taking the attitude that at times it might be better to just basically paint your figures, shove them in miracle dip and get them into gaming condition. But if there is any tyranny it must be self-imposed and I don't see people being put off by a barrier of painting quality. There are painting services, pre-painted armies, second hand figures all abounding so I go along with you that sometimes it's good to just do a decent but not detailed job of painting but I don't think it's a barrier to entry into the hobby.

Which brings me to another point about the articles on encouraging newcomers, both in this issue and in other ones in all the titles. Everyone has shared good ideas, but not quite hit the target in terms of what will encourage people.

I understand Neil Shuck's point that skirmish gaming and small scales are a good way to introduce people to the hobby. But that's not what's going to do it.

I take on board what Brad Harmer-Barnes said about VHS gaming and tapping into the fandom of TV, movies, sci-fi and fantasy. That will appeal to some, but like a lot of marketing buzz concepts, it probably won't be sustainable.

Cross-pollination with other hobbies is a good idea and worth trying, but in itself its usefulness is limited. Likewise introductory games such as Airfix Battles, or shows consisting of solely participation games, or skirmish warband gaming, or simple painting styles, easy to learn rules and even rebranding wargaming as tabletop gaming or 3D gaming, etc…all of them are like tools in a toolbox but they won't solve the issue of attracting people to wargaming.

The two things that will attract people are entertainment and friendliness. A boring sci-fi skirmish game run by people with poor social skills will not attract newcomers. But if you had a 15mm English Civil War game run by friendly gamers and which put a new gamer of any age right into the action I guarantee you that will do more to encourage people than the other suggestions on their own.

Potential gamers aren't put off by masses of historical figures, they're put off by feeling that those games are run by cliques who demand in-depth knowledge from all participants. I strongly suspect that the reason sci-fi, horror and fantasy skirmish games do so well with young people is that those games pitch new players right into the action and there's more bonhomie and less prejudice amongst those who design and run those games.

Mollinary07 Jun 2016 6:53 a.m. PST

I think, on consideration, I am with you Uber. The figures featured on the front cover are my AIM/Minifig 10-12mm figures, largely painted by me about 15 years ago (as the basing gives away!). I am no great painter, and these do not have any highlights, shades, or washes. What I decided to do to create an impression, was bright colours on obvious figures (colour bearers with big flags) and to vary the colours on the other figures. So a red regiment would have two thirds-three quarters in red jackets, the rest in other colours. There would possibly be three or four different types of red in a base, but only one on each figure. I think with this scale figure the effect is pretty good, but it doesn't require any great skill painting an individual casting. And I certainly fall into the camp of being inspired, not put off, by great painting.

Mollinary

normsmith07 Jun 2016 9:53 p.m. PST

I like to paint to a respectable standard, but I am a Wargamer first, not a collector or modeller and so it is probably the case that we are all on a different point of the line drawn between detail and practicality.

Why the point seems to matter more these days is that the public spotlight can fall on our figures when we post to the Internet, especially as 1. The camera with it super sharp imagery can be cruel (when things look softer to the naked eye) and 2. The Internet is place where superb painters can showcase their lovely work and we fall into the trap of seeing that as the standard rather than as a demonstration of excellence.

These days I make a point of blogging about my stuff, warts an' all, just to add to a real world perspective, in fact a blog article I am working on now has a paragraph about 28mm that essentially says, just do it, don't be over-awed by the fine examples seen on the screen …. Paint for yourself.

So there you are, I am no help at all, I agree with both Arthur and Uber.

It is another nice issue, though more enjoyable if you are an ECW fan, as it is a along article.

ubercommando08 Jun 2016 4:33 a.m. PST

I've never encountered anyone who has been put off getting into wargaming because of what they see as high painting standards. I see people getting put off more by expense and time pressures; even painting to a basic standard is still time consuming. Frankly, gamers who don't trust their painting skills but who like gaming with miniatures often engage a painting service or else buy second hand or pre-painted figures. The ones who choose RPGs over wargames mostly have the attitude of can't paint, won't paint and they like the conversational and arbitrary style of role playing.

Sorry - only verified members can post on the forums.