rivers3162 | 19 May 2016 5:04 p.m. PST |
Im currently planning on starting a mid empire Roman army using the lovely A&A miniatures range. However I was wondering if armour types would be mixed within the legions at this time? A&A's range includes troops in mail, scale and lorica segmentata, the latter of which I know was phased out due to its cost and difficulty to maintain. Would mail be most common at armour at his time? |
Zargon | 19 May 2016 5:35 p.m. PST |
Yes! And the further away from imperial center and its workshops the more mixed. My units (A&A figures too) are a mixture of all three types for one Legion and a mix of scale and mail for the other. Mix of shields types also as the ovel flat shield was being phased in as the old classical rectangular ones wore out or got destroyed in combat like the armour. |
Diocletian284 | 19 May 2016 5:41 p.m. PST |
From what I have read, it can vary according whether or not the unit is in the east and west, and what part of the Middle Imperial period. Middle Imperial Roman period is a bit broad. -The armies of Septimius Severus and the Severan dynasty (AD 193 to 235) would see mostly lorca segmentata armor. They would more resemble the early imperial Romans with some style differences in the helmets and lorca segmentata. - Low point and "Third Century Crisis" period, you have legions hastily recruited and equipped and thrown into the never ending meat grinder on all fronts. I can see a mix of lorca segmentata, chain mail, and no armor at all. - The reforms started by Gallienus and completed by Diocletian (AD 260 to 305) has the legions equipped with the chain mail armor and oval shields. The Osprey book " Imperial Roman Legionary AD 161-284" by Ross Cowan is a great reference A&A makes great Middle Imperial Romans. I have some myself I have in process behind some Late Imperial Romans I have been working on. |
BigRedBat | 20 May 2016 1:59 a.m. PST |
Yes mix them up. Some of the Aventine Early Imperial Roman cavalry are quite "late" and will work alongside A&A (being by the same sculptor). BTW for anyone at Partizan on Sunday, Phil Hendry is bringing his splendid collection of A&As along, plus we have Harry Sidebottom and a giveaway Ballista miniature, and Adam who sculpted the A&As. link |
GarrisonMiniatures | 20 May 2016 2:12 a.m. PST |
I believe there has been doubt expressed in the past whether lorica segmentata was ever issued to Eastern legions – obviously that wouldn't apply to Western units transferred to the East – but admit I don't know the modern stance on this. So my method would be to have Eastern legions in lorica hamata, Western units in lorica segmentata, leaving lorica squamata to the Praetorians and some cavalry. But that's just a matter of my personal choice. |
BigRedBat | 20 May 2016 3:36 a.m. PST |
I believe there have been finds of lorica segmentata in the East (some at Masada IIRC) so I think all options are available. |
idontbelieveit | 20 May 2016 6:06 a.m. PST |
I hope to post the pics of some more units on my blog. I have more done than this but haven't had a chance to get them posted. I'm using Aventine Sassanid spearmen with Roman shields for eastern auxilia. They look good. link |
Zargon | 20 May 2016 2:40 p.m. PST |
Very nicely done idontbelieveit, which rules are you using? |
rivers3162 | 21 May 2016 10:17 a.m. PST |
Thanks for all the advice chaps – placed my order for some more A&As in various armour and some more exotic auxiliaries (Palestinian clubmen) :) |
BigRedBat | 22 May 2016 12:59 p.m. PST |
They are great minis; nice proportions and great detail. |
Duc de Limbourg | 23 May 2016 5:50 a.m. PST |
Are there differences between a western and an eastern mip army? |
BigRedBat | 23 May 2016 8:24 a.m. PST |
Probably mainly in terms of the allies and auxiliary troops available, rather than the Roman contingent. More archers in the east, as a lot of them came from Syria and Palmyra. A few camelry in the east, too, and more chance of armoured horses I'd imagine. Perhaps better quality legionary auxiliary recruits in the west. |
Lewisgunner | 23 May 2016 9:31 a.m. PST |
I believe that lorica segmentata fittings were found at Dura Europus, ie in the East. Given the legions were moved about it s entirely likely that segmentata, hamata and squamata shirts were worn in most areas. Further, evidence now suggests that sgmentata was being worn even in 300 AD, though likely with more modern shields. The great advantage of an armour such as the segmentata is that bits can be replaced as they wear so the life of such suits could be very prolonged. |
WillieB | 24 May 2016 5:33 a.m. PST |
And if you ant another absolutely a- historical reason. The Aventine figures are too good not to use all of them. |