"Napoleonic bands" Topic

Regarding the Perry ranges, @deadhead once remarked:

"You are releasing the most obscure infantry and ignoring some of the most iconic units of that era."

Very true.

What about military bands?

As far as I am concerned, the only thing that could tempt me to buy Perrys again in large numbers would be full and historically accurate (in terms of lineup, instruments, and uniforms) Napoleonic bands.

They've made 1806 Nassauers – who cares for 1806 Nassauers? Now make what's just a must.

Bands were omnipresent those days and very important in many ways. Just read the memoirs. Unmusical boneheads such as Bardin were the exception even among the military (that's why he's constantly running down the role of bands in the army). And today, when easy access to all kind of media is the most natural thing in the world, people just can't imagine any longer how important the role of military bands was at the time, not only within the military, for raising the morale of the troops or recreation, but also for the interrelation and communication between the military and the civilian population, both friendly and enemy. Open air band music probably was the easiest and most efficient way to reach the people's hearts and minds, a lot more efficient than literature, theatre, or papers. It was a psychological weapon but ingratiating at the same time. Reviews and parades with bands playing were held to impress, intimidate, or enthuse those who were destined or forced to listen. Band music was classical music according to our present day understanding but, at the time, it was just popular music. The repertoire was made up not only of marches and military pieces, but also of arrangements of popular opera tunes, folksongs, dances, etc. Anyway, that marked separation between military and non military band music, musical styles and repertoire evolved in the later 19th century only, and it was most natural for even the greatest composers to casually compose some marches or military symphonies – just as it was most natural for even the most ordinary military band masters to arrange popular tunes or new works by eminent composers according to the capabilities of their bands. Some well known composers and music professors were even band masters themselves. I could go on and go on…

In my opinion, multipose hard plastic box sets would be the best format for bands – and bands can be done. Preiser have done it (they've made a number of H0 modern era military bands), and Historex have done it (French Napoleonic bands in 1/30=60mm). So it should really be possible to make decent full bands (not just single figures or half-baked ugly gnomes) in 28mm (and 1/72, BTW). Where there's a will there's a way.

Yeah, right!…..

A friend of mine used a 25mm Minifigs French band converted for his Spanish army. It looked great. He had the band represent a battalion.

I don't collect Perry Napoleonics but I'd love to see AB create a Napoleonic band or two. I'd definitely buy them – a chance for some lively coloured uniforms I expect.

There are lots of things we all think the Perrys should do as there are some frustrating gaps in their ranges. All we can do is hope they feel like doing those missing figures one day. Double edge sword when they bring out a new range as there's excitement in seeing a new period but for me a realisation that it means the chance of the gaps being plugged reduce yet further.

There is no greater fan of the Perrys than moi. They have contributed so much that they can afford to indulge themselves…….but there are gaps in the range. Marvellous as their latest "obscure" Napoleonic figures are, this is a suggestion that would probably outsell even their new, limited, diorama range (A Hard Contest, Seize the Colour etc)

Both foot and mounted bands would make marvellous display pieces, but I do wonder about their worth to wargamers alas. The small Mamleuke Band from Gringo40s has me convinced.

A single mounted figure or a single marching foot figure…..with both arms separate (Like the plastic dragoons on foot). Pairs of arms, holding everything from cymbals, to a trombone, to kettle drums, could then be adapted to many a regiment. Drum majors might be more challenging but the final effect would be superb.

How nice would a kettledrummer of carabiniers be? The band of Garde Dragons, or Grenadiers a Cheval, or Cuirassiers…..same arms for all!

We can dream.

Did someone mention drum majors

franznap.jigsy.com

Oh my, us 1/72 boys are spoilt sometimes

Some fifers and non kilt wearing pipers wouldn't go amiss in their Brit range. With say a bandmaster and maybe am exoticly dressed negro musician.

However inaccurate it may be, as wargamers we all love to place a drummer in the leading rank of our command stands, next to the colors or officer.

I've started placing mine in the second rank, but even that's not really appropriate.

But how much better would it be to have a separate stand, or two, that represent a drum major and a corps of drums. I would have thought that on the battlefield that would be far more representative than a band. My point is that bands are great for dioramas but have limited use on the wargames table.
Drummers are very accessible, and Front Rank have dismounted drum majors:
link
Maybe Perry's can add some variety to the drum majors available.

Please let's distinguish bandsmen from company drummers, fifer, hornists, and drum majors. I'm only concerning myself about the former. Of the latter you can find quite a number of figures from various manufacturers and you just have to buy as many as you want to create your complete drum and fife corps. Bandsmen are a different pair of shoes. They are a coherent body of musicians playing all sorts of instruments, many of which are uncommon in our time.

Jingling Johnnies have no place in a Napoleonic drum and fife corps, BTW. The same is true of bass drums. They belong to the band.

The Front Rank figure holding a Jingling Johnny is nice but makes no sense if the rest of the band is lacking.

@ Timmo uk

I'm familiar with the 25mm Minifigs bands and count them among the "gnomes" (Bicorne is worse, though). They had an S-range variety = 1/72 of the French guard band which was better. However, both came with deplorable errors, e.g. the way the serpent was held. It was not held perpendicular to the body, not like a saxophon (as Minifigs has it), but parallel (either vertically, diagonally or horizontally). This is not rectifiable without destroying the figure.

I'm talking about 35 years ago when Minifigs were prevalent. The bands we had weren't S range though.

Times change and we can buy nicer figures today although MF remain very popular. I still have a collection of MF ECW figures and got my micrometer out to compare them to Perry ECW – it might surprise you to learn that many of the MF were better proportioned, in terms of how many heads would go into the height of the figure, than the Perry figures. There are some really, really strange fingers on Perry figures due to the over thick muskets. Take a look in the ECW dragoons pack and there's a figure with nine inch fingers with an extra knuckle joint. Add in the over short weapons and are they really that much better overall? Without a doubt nicer renderings of clothing, far more imaginative poses, better detail but no better proportionally, often poorly cast and they take a lot longer to do justice. Fortunately both are available and Perrys are cheaper!

The only Perry figures I collect are from the Sudan range but again the head into figure proportion is no better than Minifigs. If you look at the Sudan British this will be apparent as the effect is made more apparent by the pith helmets. I still love the figures though.

I share your opinions on the Perrys (actually, I don't care who'll make Napoleonic band figures. The important thing is that they are experts and take it seriously).

It's not only their occasionally strange choices they make in the field of Napoleonics…

Personally, I was quite disappointed with their very lousy latest release of Burgundian Wars Swiss troops (command with bear and handler, or so). Sorry to say so but that was just in every respect (both in terms of historical accuracy and quality of sculpting). But this is a topic I'd better complain about on the Medieval message board…

it is apprently easy to bash the Perrys.

I say, we all paint about 1000 miniatures of them and then we can whine about missing figures.

For me they have set the standart in output, quality and historical research – I can speak however only about the Napoleonic period.

It seems that the most best selling figures are those which are not produced, in the pipe line or to be released.

Oh wow, that is profound and philosophical…..

"the most best selling figures are those which are not produced, in the pipe line or to be released."

Shakespearean almost, in its phrasing…….. I could almost see Hamlet, maybe Macbeth, ask this…….No…… Lear.

Actually, the more I think about it, the better that gets.

That merits a title as a new topic alone……….

Truly thought provoking. How I wish I had come up with that wording. Is von W a "native" English speaker or just extraordinarily gifted? (I am deadly serious here…not taking the p)

Perrys. Thanks be to God for them. Their work is amazing. They are allowed to go slightly mad every so often.

Timmo is right, as above, many of their figures (most actually) has one too many metacarpal interphalangeal joints (ie too many joints in their fingers…I did anatomy for years and it proved of absolutely no real use in the absolutely real world when I was in a casualty unit in 1977)…

But let me whine. Their plastic carabiniers are absolute rubbish..there is no alternative in their range. No one else comes near mind you in 28mm….

Front Rank I love, if carefully selected. But their carabiniers, however good the sculpting and casting….are truly ridiculous in the posing!

von W …you are good at this…….

Just opened Marc the Plastic Fan's posting…..

Makes any devotee of the One True Scale retch.

How does it come to pass that 15/18mm figures are better proportioned than….and 1/72 better cast, detailed and animated than……..?

Oh forget it…..

Some of us are too far into that Dark Side thing to change now……..

But if I chucked dice and moved rows of figures across a board, these days, instead of just sticking my work on a shelf ……I know where my money would be going

Indeed. When I came back to the hobby and to Napoleonics I knew it was going to be 15mm. Then I saw AB and knew I need not look any further.

Right, must crack on, I've got another 675 Perrys to paint to hit that magic 1,000.

Glad you liked them Liam. Francesco is a true artist along with Mr Barton. But the Perry twins have "panache" in their sculpting as well, which means that their figures have a certain je n'sais quoi (sp?) about them, so carry on delighting us with your Mamelukes et al. When I buy the drum majors let me know if you'd like one to try 🙃

I have just placed a large order with Franznap for his Badeners. I normally am a plastics fan but am not adverse to brilliant sculpts in metal. See, there is hope for me…