47Ronin | 18 Dec 2015 5:32 p.m. PST |
Putting aside for a moment all the drama regarding the possible sale of the Lancaster Host, just a reminder that today is the last day to submit games for the Preliminary Events List for Cold Wars 2016. For details, go to the HMGS web page. Think positive. Be optimistic. Spend some time thinking about gaming rather than real estate deals. You'll be glad you did. Hope to see you at Cold Wars, wherever it is. |
capncarp | 18 Dec 2015 7:09 p.m. PST |
Darn! I didn't manage to get my game submitted--"Real Estate Battles of the Early 21st Century". |
evbates | 18 Dec 2015 8:53 p.m. PST |
I was going to list about six games but no knowing were its going to be I'll wait till Historicon. |
rmcaras | 19 Dec 2015 7:57 p.m. PST |
I wonder if the unsettled situation of the convention site will/is suppressing GMs to plan and prepare games given the con might not come off… Are GMs waiting to hear positively that the "show will go on"….regardless of location? While the BoD has started contingency planning, they too are waiting on some signal whether or not to pull the trigger on location B. But in the meantime, time is burning…and everyone is holding their breaths, but are they planning games to host on March 18-19-20, 2016? |
Who asked this joker | 19 Dec 2015 9:31 p.m. PST |
From a previous thread, the seller did not accept any of the bids and the host is still open for business. Development of the property would be really difficult because it is commercially zoned on the part near Rt30 and the rest (about 80%) is zoned for rural. It's a golf course so that is just fine. From my point of view, the Host will live on through CW. |
Charlie 12 | 19 Dec 2015 9:56 p.m. PST |
Yeah, but the seller is still in negotiations with 2 of the bidders. So the seller's intent is as before; to unload the property as quickly as feasible. So, at this point we really don't know what the status of the Host will be come March. And won't know until the process shakes out. That said, the BoD seems to have a "Plan B" in place, so I'd assume CW will go through (although it may not be at the Host). |
historygamer | 20 Dec 2015 6:20 a.m. PST |
I agree. Any way you put it, the owner wants to sell and will put as little money into the place as possible in the mean time. It might be wise for HMGS to cut bait and move CW and FI to another location now, even if just for a year or two. That would give both cons a larger amount of certainty than they enjoy right now, and give potential attendees more time to plan. There is no reason the BOD needs to ride along with the owner's indecision. This is kind of like a girlfriend telling her boyfriend she plans to leave him for another guy. She's just not sure which guy or when, but leave she will. |
Bowman | 21 Dec 2015 1:09 p.m. PST |
I was going to list about six games but no knowing were its going to be I'll wait till Historicon I would have said please still list them. If nothing happens, which is what I think will occur, we will have a normal Cold Wars. If Cold Wars moves to a venue that you can't make, then you can postpone it to Historicon. |
Ottoathome | 22 Dec 2015 5:24 a.m. PST |
There are several moving parts in this. It is not all up to the Host or the buyers. The BOD of HMGS is looking for an alternate venue and they might book one and move the convention even if the host survives. I decided not to put on a game because of the uncertainty. I have to see a facility and find out how difficult loading and unloading will be and how much pain and suffering is involved at the site. If it's Fredericksburg, for example, it's a no-go as the game area is still way too loud. |
edmuel2000 | 22 Dec 2015 8:06 a.m. PST |
I submitted a Cold Wars event about two weeks before the news of the auction broke. If they move the convention, I'll have to re-evaluate, as I'm sure will others who submitted events. They're likely to have some cancellations if the venue changes (who knows how many). On the other hand, I'm sure that, like Otto, there were GMs who were getting around to it, but then did not submit events because of the circumstances. Now the deadline has overcome them. This means that the PEL might be "thin" to begin with (although I can't say for sure). I don't know if has occurred to anyone at HMGS, but they might revisit the event submission deadline for Cold Wars this year. Once they know where the convention is going to be, Lancaster or some other place, they should open another window for event submission.
With less time, they may not be able to produce as slick a hardcopy program booklet as usual, but I don't think that would matter to most. Best, Ed M |
greenknight4 | 22 Dec 2015 10:56 a.m. PST |
Well I have scheduled my three games and paid for my two booths. I think if you were going to run games then get them in. If it doesn't end up happening (the show) or the venue changes and you can't make it then cancel it. I think if to many GM's falter that can really impact the show as well. My 2.5 cents :) Chris |
historygamer | 22 Dec 2015 9:37 p.m. PST |
While the Host's intentions are clear (they want to sell), I have to wonder how long HMGS sits tight (not sure why at this point) and doesn't move to create more certainty about CW and FI? If I were HMGS, I'd only wait till after the New Year, but no longer. I just don't see an upside for HMGS waiting any longer or standing by the Host at this point. There is also a lesson here not to put all their eggs in one basket, at least long term. |
avidgamer | 23 Dec 2015 8:20 a.m. PST |
I'd like to go to some sort of Cold Wars as I always do but… I need the dates and location ASAP. I have to submit my vacation time off if I am to change from the original dates. I am required to submit them 6 months in advance so… I can probably switch if the new date is close, assuming there is a change. Who knows about that?! No one but at this point I'm guessing I won't be going, sadly. It's seems likely I will just cancel my vacation dates for CW and figure some other vacation plan. |
47Ronin | 23 Dec 2015 11:30 a.m. PST |
To state what may be obvious to some but not to others, the only deadline that has passed is for the Preliminary Events List. GMs can still submit games for Cold Wars 2016 until March 9th. (For details, go to the Cold Wars web page.) One way or another, we will know more regarding the location of the convention before then. If necessary, GMs can always cancel events later. I'm sure some GMs held off submitting events this year due to the uncertainty regarding the Host, just as I'm sure other GMs sent in events as usual. Somewhere there is a GM or Club thinking about building a scale model of the Host for a "Who Can Demolish The Most Of The Host?" game. If not, perhaps HMGS will have another cake made in the form of the Host if a farewell party becomes necessary. That way we can all have a slice. We'll see. |
Ligniere | 23 Dec 2015 12:53 p.m. PST |
Frank, I suspect the cake would need to be moldy – to be as realistic as possible….. You can have my slice |
TSD101 | 23 Dec 2015 2:23 p.m. PST |
My 1862 Valverde game was submitted via club. I'm sure it'll be at the Host and this is all just gloom and doom. Playtested twice so far for balance, hope to run it 2 or 3 more times before the convention. If there is a ton of people canceling I may run it a second a time and add another session last minute to the events desk. |
cleo liebl | 23 Dec 2015 6:46 p.m. PST |
building a scale model of the Host for a "Who Can Demolish The Most Of The Host?" game Great idea. Sort of like the Amish Rake Wars, but more tacky. |
rmcaras | 23 Dec 2015 10:07 p.m. PST |
Avidgamer, why would you assume the date might move? Its either going to: 1. Not happen at all – so no dates needed. 2. Happen at the Host – on the contracted dates. 3. Happen elsewhere on those same dates. – the BOD has already contacted alternative venues for THOSE SPECIFIC DATES and have first right of refusal if some other party wants those dates. The last thing you change is the event date, because you have attendees already programmed for those dates…like you. |
avidgamer | 24 Dec 2015 5:02 a.m. PST |
rmcaras, It's pretty simple, I have little or no confidence in the East that dates will stay the same regardless about your assurances. I can not afford to lose those vacations days with no good solid plans, this close to March. I can't even predict WHERE it will be if moved and if I can get to that location without driving for hours and hours. That's vacation time too. I'll just put them back in the 'bank' and await another show. Better to NOT take any chances. Vacation scheduling is complicated where I work and trying to pick dates 8 months in advance is horrible. I'll just see what I can do for Fall In. Hopefully in a few months we will have some idea what/where/when. |
historygamer | 24 Dec 2015 8:15 a.m. PST |
If it moves there is no guarantee it would be the same date. The same goes for Fall In. It is facility and schedule dependent. |
rmcaras | 24 Dec 2015 11:23 p.m. PST |
True, nothing is guaranteed. I'd decouple Fall n dates from CW anyway, since this far out FI! has, in the past, not always been firmly known just what weekend it was going to be between late October and November. But if I recall, the HMGS letter indicated some alternative sites were surveyed for the 2016 dates, and were found available, so far, for the existing dates. So, I suspect the free expression desire is to have them with as few variables changing as possible. |
114th Pennsylvania | 25 Dec 2015 8:14 a.m. PST |
I know of a couple of Clubs that put in their spreadsheets for Games at Cold Wars- WAMP, MAPHOGS, NYWA, Rogues, and Del-Val. A total of around 24 games, but we have heard nothing from the events director. I assume its because they are busy with the Holiday season. We hope to get a response in the New Year. The Show MUST go on! |
Double G | 25 Dec 2015 9:59 a.m. PST |
Chris, How have you managed to pay for your two tables at this point as the dealer packets to my knowledge have not gone out yet? Just curious is all……………… |
47Ronin | 27 Dec 2015 10:42 a.m. PST |
FYI, according to the "Important Dates" section of the Cold Wars web site, the PEL should be published on Monday. If so, perhaps we will get an idea of whether the proposed sale of the Host had an impact on the number of games submitted this year. Stay tuned. |
greenknight4 | 28 Dec 2015 9:37 a.m. PST |
Double G Did my reply help you? Chris |
Jlundberg | 28 Dec 2015 11:44 a.m. PST |
I would advocate for a loosening of the rule that it must be in by the PEL to get in free due to the uncertainty. I listed two games and will do demo games at the Brigade booth. |
Ottoathome | 28 Dec 2015 2:50 p.m. PST |
"The free entrence never phased me." I pay for an admission even if I was running two or three games at a convention. The HMGS needs the money. |
Moe the Great | 31 Dec 2015 12:53 p.m. PST |
When is the PEL supposed to be published. |
historygamer | 31 Dec 2015 1:42 p.m. PST |
"The HMGS needs the money." They do? For what? I believe they have a rather healthy six figure bank account. |
114th Pennsylvania | 09 Jan 2016 9:09 a.m. PST |
Its Jan 9th….no PEL..no word if they got our clubs games. Bueller Bueller Bueller Um, he's sick. My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Ferris pass out at 31 Flavors last night. I guess it's pretty serious Thank you for a reply |
Rotundo | 09 Jan 2016 9:14 a.m. PST |
Silence is ominus Me thinks. Communication even if it is bad please! |
McKinstry | 09 Jan 2016 10:26 a.m. PST |
Unless and until the Host actually sells and tries to void our contract or a member of the PA bar actually reviews the contract and gives, at a minimum, a more likely than not opinion that we could get out of the contract, nothing will happen relative to HMGS breaking a valid contract in a post-Baltimore environment. Even if the Host sells, given the zoning restrictions, the highest and best use for a new owner may well be to operate the facility assuming a low enough purchase price to justify renovations. Those that have to plan vacation have to reasonably consider risk while those of us with flexibility certainly are in no way harmed by making reservations, planning games etc. that can be voided if the circumstances change. We will not have absolute certainty one way or another until likely 30 days or so prior in that at some point, a sale and accompanying due diligence can't happen that fast. I am concerned as to condition but short of no heat or a ceiling collapse, I'll stay somewhere else and not be terribly affected by gaming in a semi-dump as the last years FI was not so run down as to affect my gaming or the dealer room. |
Rotundo | 09 Jan 2016 12:30 p.m. PST |
McKinstry, I am operating at face value that the Host will be open and a convention is going on …because I was told so. Now, all I want is to know whether we have a club room and if our games are registered. I am not a lawyer and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn last night. I simply would like to know if the HMGS is giving out a Pel and when. I do not expect them to "guarantee"the Host. |
Ottoathome | 09 Jan 2016 12:40 p.m. PST |
history gamer The six figure bank account waxes and wanes like the phases of the moon, all with the need of the moment. So far as I know, NO ONE has ever seen (out of the hallowed towers of the Bod) a statement of how much actually IS in the bank account or for that matter membership size of the HMGS or the convention attendance. A year and a half ago I heard the HMGS was almost busted. Then a year later it had over $200,000 USD in the bank account. Amazing! It has all become a display of mummery and smoke and mirrors at this point. No one believes anything the HMGS BOD has to say and people will go to the conventions as long as they are being given, and when they stop, people will stop going. This has left me largely approximating my own statistics which I glean from more or less one primary source. 1. For the money in the bank-- dead reckoning from the last time I saw a fiscal report, corrected now and then by averaging what figure is given to me by three sources of generally reliable nature. This comes out to about $168,000. USD 2. For membership in the HMGS, the election results which I recon by taking the total number of persons voted and adding on 20% who do not vote for sloth or forgetfulness. This is about 300 people. 3. For attendance at the convention I count the people at Dealers area (including dealers), the number of people in the Dystlefynk and other ballrooms playing games, and in the tournament flea- market area at 10 am 4 pm and 10 pm and average. For cold wars this year that came out to about 2,000 and for all in abut 1500. Don't do Historicon as I have not had the urge to go. The last time at Valley forge I figured about 2800. I may just skip Cold Wars this year and go to "Huzzah" and to "The Seven Years War Convention" instead. Or I might still go, but I will be bringing my wife and will spend only a few hours at the con, and go shopping with her and two other couples who come out because they like the flea-markets, antique stores, and cutesy shops in the Lancaster area. Sad tis. |
thomalley | 09 Jan 2016 3:24 p.m. PST |
I would expect 20% is the percent of the membership that voted, if the members are anything like the general public. |
zoneofcontrol | 09 Jan 2016 4:42 p.m. PST |
Even more telling than the missing PEL is the fact that pre-registration for attendees is set to open on Monday 01/11. With no PEL, will people sign-up? |
114th Pennsylvania | 10 Jan 2016 8:25 a.m. PST |
Thank you Cold Wars Events Coordinator! I just heard from her and she asked for some edits from me. It sounds like PEL will be up this week at some point. The Show must go on even if the curtain come down on me, at least I can say our team did our best to keep things going. If 300 was the number that voted and we got the standard 20% reply back, then Membership is around 1500. (which sounds about right from Membership meetings numbers announced) |
47Ronin | 11 Jan 2016 8:55 a.m. PST |
FYI, the Cold Wars 2016 PEL is now on line. Many thanks to those staff members who made it available and to the GMs who submitted events. Enjoy the games. Hope to see you there. |
ViscountEric | 11 Jan 2016 12:08 p.m. PST |
Despite all the caterwauling here, I see a larege percentage of regulars took a look at the Host drama and said, "Damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead!" PDF link The event listing makes me cringe… due to the fact that there's so many awesome events and I'm on the other end of the state for that weekend. My crew that's attending better take lots of pictures. |
Moe the Great | 11 Jan 2016 1:59 p.m. PST |
Looks like a good amount of games to me. |
ViscountEric | 11 Jan 2016 8:38 p.m. PST |
And since HMGS sent out an email today that did say: " As such, the Host is still operating and we are told that even if a sale agreement is reached between now and Cold Wars, the convention will not be affected. " Have fun storming the castle, defending the trench, taking the beachhead, and subduing the purple ape of gratz'nar. Hope everyone has a grand time. |
capncarp | 11 Jan 2016 8:57 p.m. PST |
Aw, c'mon Eric, play hookey for once. |
TSD101 | 11 Jan 2016 10:08 p.m. PST |
I'm guessing Club games are listed differently, because I don't see any of our games in the PEL. |
Duncan Adams | 12 Jan 2016 3:32 a.m. PST |
I'm guessing Club games are listed differently, That is a bad guess -- you are screwed. Duncan |
TSD101 | 12 Jan 2016 8:39 a.m. PST |
That is a bad guess -- you are screwed. Was told there was a clerical snafu that is going to be resolved for an update. Its not me who would be screwed, its the con goers missing out on a bunch of actual playtested scenarios. |
TRUgamer | 12 Jan 2016 9:40 a.m. PST |
The reason your games are not listed may be because the person compiling the PEL lives in New Jersey. TRU |
47Ronin | 12 Jan 2016 2:56 p.m. PST |
Just when I stopped laughing from Duncan's one liner, I started laughing all over again after reading TRU's comment. They should bring back the comedy club at the Host. You guys could team up and do stand up during the convention. HMGS has certainly provided enough material over the years. On a (slightly) more serious note, by my count there are 245 games in the PEL (with more to come). Not bad given all the uncertainty regarding the Host. Enjoy the games. Hope to see you there. |
TRUgamer | 12 Jan 2016 5:39 p.m. PST |
That's one way to shutter the doors faster! :) TRU |
greenknight4 | 13 Jan 2016 7:24 a.m. PST |
My three games made it in – thank you |
Moe the Great | 13 Jan 2016 8:39 a.m. PST |
All 6 of the WNPG games are in. WooHoo!! Stop by our table and enjoy some good games. For those who spoke to me at Fall in! about dropping off Toys for Tots donation for this years event, you can drop them off at our table. We have 2 games on Friday and 4 on Saturday. Moe |