"Large bases for ACW / Napoleonic" Topic

I am considering moving to a larger base for my 10mm / 12mm stuff. So one base would equal 1 unit, a bit like Impetus.

I will obviously lose some flexibility in ability to change formation.

i was considering having some generic bases done for units marching on a road, but other things such as square or assault column would need markers.

has anyone travelled this route and found success / regret?

I will likely be doing these on hexed terrain, so the bases will be fitting wishing a 4" cell. i have 3 MDF options in front of me. 60mm x 30mm. 80mm x 30mm and 60mm x 40mm with a view to some micro dice holders being added to the rear of the 40mm deep base.

You could just use a rules set that abstractly assumes that the unit is in the best formation for the tactical situation, whether it be line or column doesn't matter. If they form square, put a square formation marker beside them.

I've done this for Napoleonics (Blucher rules)and I'm thinking about it for ACW.

I'll miss the ability to put units in a recognisable formation a bit, but I NEVER FOUGHT A BATTLE using 1:20 rules, either for not enough figures or not enough space.

Now I can, and still hand the dining room table back to my wife in a couple of days. So mostly "win" from making the switch.

Hello normsmith!

We made the switch in 6mm about 15 years ago after using smaller bases for about 25 years. Were a hard core Napoleonic club (Napoleonic Miniature Wargames Society of Toronto), now 50 years old. Nobody misses changing formation and we really don't even bother with it very much. Units are always assumed to be in the proper formation for the situation at hand. A common rule in most single unit rule sets.

We have now based all our H&M periods on these bases.

The main reason we made the change was to save time. Players waste a ton of time dwelling on formation changes and moving all the little stands around, every turn. It cut our playing time in half. Setting things up, taking them down, storing and transportation are all faster, easier and safer.

In 6mm the 60mm x 30mm is popular because it is the basic base for Polemos. That's a complete system where you use the 60x30 for a unit of formed infantry (I also use it for skirmish or light infantry), regiment of cavalry, artillery limbers and other wagons etc. It's little brother base 30mm x 30mm is used for artillery guns and crew and officers. Only two base sizes for your entire collection. You can also put two of the 60x30 bases back to front for a 60mm square which allows you to play all of the brigade games Marechal d'Empire, Grand Armie, Volley and Bayonet, Blucher, etc. You can of course still just use the single base if you want.

In games where you do need elements you just consider the 60x30 base as two 30x30 elements that are attached. If your going really down in scale some people use the entire base as a single element.

The other thing to keep in mind is the smaller you can make your base the bigger your table will be. So if the 60x30 fits your own criteria it's a no brainer. If by chance it does not then keep the dimensions balanced, i.e. 70x35 or 80x40 to maximize your flexibility.

An added bonus for you is that if you do use the 60x30 base then you can probably hook up with some 6mm players as well.

I know that dice holders are the in thing today, but using a roster or using casualty markers works just as well, and removes the dice from every stand.

Best regards,

Glenn

So if the 60x30 fits your own criteria it's a no brainer.

60x30 is too small for a 4in hex.

An added bonus for you is that if you do use the 60x30 base then you can probably hook up with some 6mm players as well.

??? He said his figures are 10/12mm.

Hello MajorB!

"60x30 is too small for a 4in hex"

Not according to normsmith.

"??? He said his figures are 10/12mm"

You can't mix scales?

Best regards,

Glenn

"60x30 is too small for a 4in hex"

Not according to normsmith.

My comment was aimed at normsmithh as well as you. A 60x30 base in a 4in hex will look a little lost.

"??? He said his figures are 10/12mm"

You can't mix scales?

Well, anyone can do anything, I suppose, but there are an awful lot of things that one won't do for aesthetic reasons. I for one would certainly not mix 6mm figures with 10 or 12mm figures. You might be quite happy doing so, but not me. I can't speak for normsmith.

60 x 30 is too small in a 4" hex ……. agreed, I have made up a 10mm napoleonic and 12mm ACW and it doesn't look right in the hex, plus the gap is too big between itself and the next unit.

80 x 30 is closer to what I use now with a pair of 40 x 20 bases, but gives a bit more depth for a better look.

80 x 40 starts to impact on other in hex terrain, but does look nice and can take a dice box.

My ACW are 12mm Kallistra, which remind me very much of old 15's, so not a good match with 6mm.

Hello normsmith!

Well let me try and think outside the hex for a bit.

I see your present bases don't fill your hex either. You have a two base unit that is only 80mm wide using a 100mm hex. So presently your losing 25% of your table space. That's a lot of wasted space. If you changed to a single 60mm base you will gain 25% just from the base size alone. Overall you could increase your table size by 40-50%. That's a very big number.

To get that gain you have a couple of choices. You can put two bases in a hex. The extra 20mm is nothing to worry about. We used that system when we used hexs. Even in a long line of bases it all works out. You just have the odd hex that can only hold one base. All you have to do is modify your combat system to be base to base, not hex to hex.

Another similar option is you just use the hexs for movement and ranges. You can also just ignore the hexs and use conventional rules.

The hardest thing to come to grips with is if your going to rebase (a wargamers nightmare) then you only want to do it once and never again. So presently your only looking at ways that are compatible with you hex system which is limiting your options. What happens if you should want to use a different concept or conventional rules in the future? Will you be rebasing again?

Today some 6mm figures are very big and not that different from some 10mm figures. However, my comments were never intended to be a permanent situation. It's just that if you did use a base that is popular with 6mm players then you could play games together. It simply removed a barrier that could allow you to play together. I know of one fellow who uses 15mm figures for his front line troops and 6mm figures for the ones in the rear.

Anyway your obviously still thinking on which way to go. Let us know what you decide.

Best regards,

Glenn

If you changed to a single 60mm base you will gain 25% just from the base size alone. Overall you could increase your table size by 40-50%. That's a very big number.

No. The playable table space is constrained by the size of the hexes, not what you put in them.

Hello MajorB!

Not exactly, if your hex is bigger then what you put in it the difference is lost table space. You can only get that space back by putting more in it or ignoring the hexes, or both.

Best regards,

Glenn

My feeling at the moment is that 80mm x 30mm is the better option, as it makes a unit look more linear when using 1 base to 1 unit. I would be having the hex representing 250 – 300 yards, so that the unit frontage is making it regimental and so that frontage also needs to better fill the hex width – in a way that 60mm doesn't.

Though by having 1 base instead of 2, I have found that I need an extra couple of figures on there to keep the impression of closed ranks. (i.e. I need a frontage of 9 figures on a single big base rather than the previous 8 spread over 2 bases)

The extra depth of the base will help because Kallistra 12mm are fairly big and having them crammed onto a 20mm depth is making my line look a bit too thin for the size of figure.

I don't particularly want to start spreading units across more than 1 hex, as I am using the hexes to regulate the game – so a unit would need to fully exist in just 1 hex cell or (and not as desirable) fully in two, but small overlaps are not very forgiving in a hex based system.

If I were using 28mm scale, I think I would base with a view to spreading fully across two hexes. (either 4 x 40mm, 3 x 50mm or 3 x 60mm ……… all at 40 mm depth), but of course that in effect just instantly halves the width of my game table).

Hello normsmith!

Sounds like you got your base, good stuff. Now the tedious part begins, rebasing and adding figures. I started my last rebasing some ten years ago and still have lots to transfer.

Best regards,

Glenn

80mm x 30mm is not that far off the size of a credit card (85mm x 54mm). I found a use for all my old video rental, library, credit, license, etc. cards when I started basing my 15mm figures for Blucher.

Check out the Thule Gamers, "Our Brutal Rules."

I did this with my FPW 15mm stuff -90 x 40mm
link

I've gone for 60 x 35mm for ACW in 15mm

Thanks, they look really effective.

We use 6 x 2 inch bases with anythingh from 12 to 20-odd figures (28mm) for the Thule Gamers 'Brutal' rules.

I recently (well, a few months ago…) switched from big brigade bases with my 3mm to 20mm x 10mm strips and battalions as the maneuver element. I would caution against going with big bases. I spent a lot of time trying to figure out the best way to do this and I found that in the end all combat was tactical no matter how big the maneuver unit is. Especially in the ACW brigade bases simply don't work. My classic example is the Wheatfield on the 2d Day of Gettysburg. If you have a 3" brigade base the Wheatfield could fit entirely underneath it. Yet over 1 dozen brigades and over ten thousand men fought back and forth across it. Not to mention the artillery issue. To get back to Napoleonics, there's this idea that they are less tactical… but why exactly?
I know what Sam went for, and I love FPGA personally, but I have issues with the single base thing. I started out on single bases and only experimentation with 3mm figs brought me around. Anyways, good luck. If you want to see all my tortured thoughts on this subject check out my blog, 1809in3mm.blogspot.com.