"Quite possibly a dumb question.." Topic

Quite possibly a dumb question, but did Carthaginian spearmen use greaves? I'm painting a 6mm Carthaginian army at the moment, and I'm not sure whether the Libyan spearmen should be wearing greaves or not. The pictures in Heath's Armies of the Macedonian and Punic Wars shows a figure without, although the veterans do have greaves. Connolly doesn't really address the question. Some manufacturers produce spearmen with greaves, but I don't know on what basis. There's nothing inherently unlikely about it, but I don't know of any evidence for it. Please help.

Flock the bases with tall grass and nobody will know.

If they didn't at the beginning of the Punic Wars, they certainly picked up enough Roman ones to wear.

I would guess that some did, some didn't. Ancient ideas about uniform were rather different to ours!

Uniforms weren't uniform?

There's one relief of a trophy of arms, rather crude, which includes greaves – though they could just be captured gear. Otherwise we're guessing. Direct evidence on Carthie equipment is not abundant.

The only dumb question is the one you already know the answer to. Not, as is popularly promoted, the unasked question.

Given their history of repeated military encounters with Greek and Italians, I find very realistic to consider greaves on the heavy Carthaginian infantry.

I think at least a single greave on the shield arm leg.

GurKhan: Which monument? I've got a couple of pics of the Chemtou reliefs, but they don't show greaves.

Armies of the Carthaginian Wars, 265-146 BC by Osprey, p18 BR to TL;
"The Iberians do not seem to have worn greaves, but Strabo says that the Celt-Iberians did, and a number of reliefs show Infantrymen wearing greaves and short boots. These may have been metal or leather, but the ordinary soldier probably had graves of felt; no examples have yet been found. the cavalrymen wore long boots which helped protect their legs, and had plain spurs attached."

wikipedia (yuck, but referenced)
"With their elite status, members of the Sacred Band received the best equipment in the Carthaginian army. Their weapons and training were similar to those of the Greek hoplites: heavy spear, sword, hoplon shield, and bronze greaves, helmet, and breastplate. The hoplites also fought in a phalanx formation. The unit numbered around 2,500 soldiers according to Diodorus.[9]"
9. Diodorus, Historical Library xvi.80.4-5.

Not sure if helpful? I'm not greatly knowledgeable on them
~Joe

Thanks Dobber. I don't have access to the Osprey (The inter library loans system in Japan is not great, especially for non-Japanese texts), and the info on the Sacred Band links in with Heath. I think I'm going to take John the OFM's advice and just put lots of high grass on the bases!

That actually sounds like the best idea!

Grigori – not Chemtou, the really cartoony stele with the conical helmet and the cross-hatched cuirass, in C Picard "Les représentations de sacrifice Molk sur les stèles de Carthage", and elsewhere – can't find an image on the web, sorry.

Also bottom of p.33 at link – I'd forgotten that one.

GurKhan: many thanks. Interesting about the possibility of using pilos type helmets too. I'd always thought they would be the Phoenician/Assyrian type.

Thanks for all responses.

The pilos was definitely used, it's quite common on some probably 5th/4th century seals from Carthage (along with some hoplite shields, and no non-Greek military equipment at all) – there are photos in a big German archaeological hardback that I don't have a reference to offhand, but is sitting at home somewhere. Also see the heads from Kerkouane – link – though these might possibly be the original felt cap style rather than helmets; some of the seal examples look more definitely military.

I suspect conical Near Eastern styles were in use as well, though – that's what I am still inclined to see the Numidian es-Soumaa helmet as.

In fact, Berges, D, W Erhardt, A Laidlaw, and F Rakob, "Karthago, Band II: Die Deutschen Ausgrabungen in Karthago" (von Zabern, Mainz, 1997).