KSmyth | 27 Aug 2015 2:43 p.m. PST |
Saw a Facebook post this morning about a proposal for a new book, a history of tabletop wargaming, or playing games with toy soldiers. Interesting topic, it's great to promote the hobby and its origins. But when I saw the title "Warmongers," I about came unglued. I immediately posted my objections to the "Warmongers" Facebook page. I have no question the author has the best of intentions. Perhaps this is a British thing vs. my American sensibilities. But there is no way I will lay out my dollars to buy this book and support his endeavors. For those of us of a certain age, the Vietnam era, the term warmonger has extremely negative connotations. Given the recent unsettling disagreements over American involvement in foreign wars, the term was used frequently. Warmonger is a term that was often applied to miniature wargamers during my 45 years in the hobby, and I cannot imagine it is a term of endearment or carries with it positive images of the hobby. How do you feel? Would you buy a book about miniature wargaming called "Warmongers?" How do you feel about applying this term to your game interests? Here is a link so you can decide for yourself: link |
tberry7403 | 27 Aug 2015 2:50 p.m. PST |
Doesn't bother me and I'm a Vietnam Era vet (as is my older brother and my Father was wounded in WWII). Purchasing would have to do more with the contents than the title. Is it a derogatory "hit piece" or is the title just to raise interest (coverage)? |
ironicon | 27 Aug 2015 2:50 p.m. PST |
This word in my experience has a very negative connotation. |
Mako11 | 27 Aug 2015 2:57 p.m. PST |
It doesn't bother me either, since I know I'm not, and that most, if not all of our vets, and wargamers aren't, either. The word does have very strong, negative connotations, though, so does seem to be a rather poor choice for a title, unless as stated, the author is deliberately trying to be provocative to gain media exposure. Seems to be working for some of late, in the news. I guess it worked too, she you're posting about it here. |
The Beast Rampant | 27 Aug 2015 3:03 p.m. PST |
I'm not "mongering" in real war, nor are any of the artifacts of my hobby particularly useful for killing or oppressing anyone. Other than if Lead Mountain falls on me, and my being vexed by sight of all their tiny unpainted forms. More drama and divisiveness. It's what's for dinner nowadays. |
Gonsalvo | 27 Aug 2015 3:07 p.m. PST |
I think that title has to go. I agree that the negative connotations are far too strong for me. It would greatly diminish the odds of my ever purchasing or reading it. There are plenty of other catchy titles one could use. |
Winston Smith | 27 Aug 2015 3:14 p.m. PST |
Someone familiar with marketing should tell the author he will lose a lot of sales with that title. Personally I couldn't give a rat's pa toot what someone else thinks of what I do. |
John Armatys | 27 Aug 2015 3:19 p.m. PST |
I'm on the British side of the Atlantic, and not comfortable with the title. Many years ago I was interviewed show by a reported from the Radio Sheffield at the local wargames who kept referring to "Sheffield Warmongers Society". I'd arranged for him to play in a game, where he managed to massacre some sheep and a civilian. I said "who is the warmonger now?", he look duly sheepish and the interview went better after that. Having said that I'd rather be a warmonger than a fellmonger. |
jpattern2 | 27 Aug 2015 3:22 p.m. PST |
A very stupid and tone-deaf title. |
Cyrus the Great | 27 Aug 2015 4:25 p.m. PST |
He will sell less books with that title, but he says, "The title of #Warmongers is used to tie in with the widely used hashtag on Twitter/Facebook that thousands of gamers use every day to promote their toy soldier hobby by sharing pictures and/or stories of their games and models." Funny, I know none of them! |
Prince Rupert of the Rhine | 27 Aug 2015 4:36 p.m. PST |
ermmmm couldn't care less…though I'm British and wasn't born until the Vietnam war was in it's last days. If it's a book aimed at wargamers then no one else will take any notice anyway. If it's a good book I might buy it but the title will have no impact on me one way or the other. |
MH Dee | 27 Aug 2015 5:17 p.m. PST |
It doesn't hugely bother me,but the line "The title of #Warmongers is used to tie in with the widely used hashtag on Twitter/Facebook that thousands of gamers use every day to promote their toy soldier hobby by sharing pictures and/or stories of their games and models." is weird. I've never heard of it, so I searched on Twitter. It does appear to be a common hashtag amongst gamers after all, but practically all the results are SF/fantasy, mostly Warhammer. So you learn something new every day. |
Winston Smith | 27 Aug 2015 5:43 p.m. PST |
Seriously though it's a label only an idiot would self identify with. Particularly if he wants to make lots of sales. |
Pedrobear | 27 Aug 2015 6:03 p.m. PST |
Doesn't bother me. Seems ridiculous to imply that I have the power to decide whether my nation goes to war or not. |
MH Dee | 27 Aug 2015 6:29 p.m. PST |
Judging by the font (and search results) it seems that it will be heavy on the Warhammer, and that lot like that kind of terminology – probably because they think itmakes them sound more 'Metal', so I'm not sure it'll hurt sales. |
Flashman14 | 27 Aug 2015 6:47 p.m. PST |
I accept the author's explanation that it's meant to be ironic. |
zoneofcontrol | 27 Aug 2015 6:48 p.m. PST |
The author is probably just using the title to fulfill his needs as a media-*. * = a term I use with great respect and admiration. |
Parzival | 27 Aug 2015 7:50 p.m. PST |
I'm a "wargamesmonger," and proud of it! I'm not particularly offended by "warmonger." Seems a bit archaic to be offended about, especially in context. But, given the reaction here, maybe he should change the title to something more apropo. How about "grumpyoldfartmonger"? |
nazrat | 27 Aug 2015 7:57 p.m. PST |
One big, fat "meh". Lots of sound and fury signifying nothing here. |
Pictors Studio | 27 Aug 2015 8:10 p.m. PST |
Yeah. People calling me names doesn't really bother me. Warmonger is kind of a catching title and, while not true in the greater sense, is true in another sense. |
raylev3 | 27 Aug 2015 8:23 p.m. PST |
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Doctor X | 27 Aug 2015 8:43 p.m. PST |
Warmonger is a common term among wargamers? Can't say I've ever heard that. |
Dan 055 | 27 Aug 2015 8:51 p.m. PST |
I don't take well to being insulted, specially by people who know nothing about me. |
BobGrognard | 27 Aug 2015 10:21 p.m. PST |
Stupid title and one which can only harm the public perception of the hobby. As for the hashtag warmonger, I've certainly never come across it. |
Martin Rapier | 28 Aug 2015 12:00 a.m. PST |
As above, perhaps it is a WH40k thing, and what would we know about that? Personally I couldn't give a rat's arse what the book is called. Shall we object to Harry Persons "Achtung Schweinhund!" too? After all, it might offend the Germans… |
Dark Knights And Bloody Dawns | 28 Aug 2015 3:38 a.m. PST |
Warmonger – One who advocates or attempts to stir up war. That's about as far as you can get from describing wargaming using just one word. If I was the author I'd have a rethink… |
Brownbear | 28 Aug 2015 4:06 a.m. PST |
stupid and incorrect title |
skinkmasterreturns | 28 Aug 2015 4:59 a.m. PST |
Well you know it matters what others think-after all,we only busy ourselves with books,research,artistic skills and hopefully flexing our mental muscles when we game.Not at all as productive as doing drugs and alcohol. |
KSmyth | 28 Aug 2015 5:52 a.m. PST |
"One who advocates or attempts to stir up war." Yup, that's what I was thinking too. Words have meaning, and as I said in my initial post, it is an untrue characterization of the hobby I've tried to rectify whenever possible. That's why I don't understand why someone would label themselves such on Twitter or in a book. Interesting mix of responses. Thanks for sharing yours. |
Rrobbyrobot | 28 Aug 2015 7:33 a.m. PST |
I think the problem some have with the term has much to do with one's life experiences. I enlisted in 1977. Many of my class mates used that term to describe me. So I will most definitely not be buying this publication. Perhaps the author is rather young. Or hasn't been paying attention to the real world around them for the past ten years, or so… |
Jemima Fawr | 28 Aug 2015 8:03 a.m. PST |
A stupid and negative title that panders to those with an ignorant and hostile view of our hobby. |
Big Red | 28 Aug 2015 9:04 a.m. PST |
As Mako11 said: "The word does have very strong, negative connotations, though, so does seem to be a rather poor choice for a title, unless as stated, the author is deliberately trying to be provocative to gain media exposure." Or is insensitive, oblivious or appealing to a very select type of gamer. |
Howler | 28 Aug 2015 11:17 a.m. PST |
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49mountain | 28 Aug 2015 1:53 p.m. PST |
People who use the term "Warmonger" in reference to Historical War gaming only display their own ignorance. |
Trebian | 28 Aug 2015 2:16 p.m. PST |
It's a history of large scale 28mm skirmish games, focussing on fantasy games. Not my hobby. He can call himself what he likes. He refers to GW as the Granddaddy of the Hobby. Well that told Neville Dickinson & Peter Hinchcliffe, didn't it? |
zippyfusenet | 28 Aug 2015 6:31 p.m. PST |
Warmonger doesn't bother me. Wormburger, on the other hand, makes me squirm. |
Clays Russians | 29 Aug 2015 7:14 p.m. PST |
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Gennorm | 01 Sep 2015 11:58 p.m. PST |
I reckon the title will go into the 'Sounded a good idea at the time' category. |
Weasel | 02 Sep 2015 2:40 p.m. PST |
I mean, it's not worse than plenty of other titles we have for gaming stuff and history books. How many books at the ww2 section are called "Hitlers" something or other? In the end, if you want to sell something, it's gotta catch your attention. |
Private Matter | 04 Sep 2015 7:13 a.m. PST |
A very unfortunate title choice. I will not buy a book on our hobby with that title. |
capncarp | 14 Sep 2015 10:46 a.m. PST |
I'm with Parzival from the hobby aspect. From the reenacting aspect, I have often told members of the public that I don't reenact to glorify, war--quite the opposite. I reenact to remind people of the sacrifice that war demands of all involved. And that war is "the most un-fun thing you can be doing". |