"British Cold War Recce Regiments 70s/80s" Topic

I thought I'd start a new thread as some sort of bug seems to be affecting the last one (the topic isn't bumping up the forum when new posts are made).

Medium Recce Regiments:

The two Recce Regiments posted to West Germany during the 1980s each had four Medium Recce Squadrons organised as:

Sqn HQ in CVR(T) Sultan
3x Recce Troops with 4x CVR(T) Scimitar
1x Assault Troop (infantry platoon) with 4x CVR(T) Spartan
1x Guided Weapons Troop with 4x CVR(T) Striker

(If you're interested, Belgian recce organisation was exactly the same, except they had 3x Striker in the GW Troop)

The UK-based Recce Regiments (including the two slated as reinforcements for 1st Armoured Division and I (Br) Corps in BAOR) were organised slightly differently:

1. All the GW Troops were massed into a single GW Squadron of 4x GW Troops.

2. There were then only 3x Medium Recce Squadrons.

3. Each Recce Troop had a split of 2x CVR(T) Scimitar and 2x CVR(T) Scorpion.

In the Household Cavalry, one Medium Recce Squadron was equipped with CVR(W) Fox.

Nearly, formation Recce in BAOR had 2 x Medium Recce Sqns, CVR(T) Scorpion and 1 close recce Sqn CVR(T) Scimitar until the mid 80s when they went to 4 Sqns of Scimitar,

Tally Ho!

Hi Nick,

I was getting to that… ;)

(Sorry, I had to take my dad to Cardiff airport in mid-flow)

Yes, during the 1978-1982 experiment with Armoured 'Task Forces' instead of Brigades, the Close Recce Platoons of Mech Infantry Battalions and the Close Recce Troops of Armoured Regiments were massed within the Recce Regiments.

The Medium Recce Squadrons at this time had:
4x Recce Troops, each with 4x CVR(T) Scorpion
1x Assault Troop (infantry platoon) with CVR(T) Spartan.

The Close Recce Squadron had:
10x Close Recce Troops, each with 4x CVR(T) Scimitar
1x Assault Troop with CVR(T) Spartan

The Guided Weapons Troops were at this time part of the divisional Guided Weapons Batteries RHA.

The two Yeomanry (TA) Mechanised Recce Regiments were organised with 3x Squadrons, each with:

HQ with Ferret & Saracen
5x Recce Troops, each with 4x CVR(W) Fox
1x Assault Troop, mounted in Saracen

The HQ elements and Assault Troops replaced their Saracens in the mid-1980s with CVR(T) variants – Sultan and Spartan respectively.

For 1972, were the Assault Troops in a platoon of 4 Spartans?

What sort of HQ did the medium and close recce sqdrns have?

Assault Troop or surveillance troop, the Spartans were equipped with the ZB-298 ground surveillance radar.

Tally Ho!

Mako,

Re 1972: I'm not sure if they even had CVR(T) by then. Probably still knocking around in Saracen, while the rest of the squadron had Saladin and Ferret. As far as I'm aware, the Assault Troop was originally 4x Saracen, then converting to 4x CVR(T) Spartan with the general conversion to CVR(T).

Nick,

Our mutual friend was incredulous when I stuck the GSR in my lists! He and his mate (who served in the Assault Troop) never saw such things in the QDGs (though their Spartans did get fitted with TOGS in the late 80s). However, some units certainly did have GSR in the Assault Troop, as you say.

For those who are interested:

Belgian Recce Regiments were exactly the same as the first organisation described above, though with only 3x Striker per Squadron.

Re Recce Regt HQs:

Regt Tac HQ was 3x CVR(T) Sultan, 4x Ferret and a gaggle of Land Rovers.

Sqn HQ was 2x CVR(T) Sultan, 1x Ferret and a pair of Land Rovers.

Re the regimental organisation:

Nick, do you know what the organisation was before 1978? The organisation with the Close Recce Squadron came in during 1978 as part of the major reorg. I think that the 'late' post-1982 organisation might be a reversion to the original, pre-1978 organisation?

Thanks, v. useful info. My BAOR is organised for 1981 (as I was always slightly fascinated by the TF concept).

My lucky TA guys have got Scimitars instead of Fox though, oops.

They've obviously got the Corps Recce in support… ;)

Other Recce:

Armoured Regiment Close Support Troop (before 1978 and after 1982):

8x CVR(T) Scorpion

Mech (& Armoured) Infantry Battalion Close Support Troop (before 1978 and after 1982):

8x CVR(T) Scimitar

Type A Mech (Wheeled) Infantry Battalion Close Support Platoon (from 1985):

8x CVR(W) Fox

(Fox was only adopted by those battalions that converted to Saxon in 1985. All other battalions before and after this date used Land Rover)

Interesting, the 16/5 had them on exercise in Norway 82 – I remember our brief as we joined the troop – Do not stand in front of them if you want babies!!!

Tally Ho!

Yeah, I remember them in 1990 with a unit we worked next to, though the QDGs are adamant (I work with two more ex-QDGs – both Striker Troop guys – who also don't remember them). Weird.

I have KORBRs Mech Wh conversion commencing in 1984 thats either from Janes or from another thread can't remember but can check, I think fox role out went with the conversion to Saxon. Any idea what the source is for a 1985 first conversion to mech Wh?

also interested in the source for the light role type A battalions with LR recce, which I currently have as an assumption with no evidence

do you have any example task orbs for recce regiment deployments?

Fascinating discussion – thanks all!

Good questions and I could well be wrong. I'm going from memory – I did the bulk of the research some five years ago, so I'll have to dig out my notes.

The ex-QDG 'mutual friend' has a fair bit of task group information from BAOR exercises that he probably shouldn't still have, so I'll ask him…

Anything pertaining to BAOR exercises will be downgraded by now, bring it along to Bovvy if you want, and we can pass our expert eye over it. Bearing in min d the book looking down the corridors has stuff that was classified in the 70s/80s and 90s in it,

Tally Ho!

my stuff around Mech wheel units is largely in these three posts

BAOR Reinforcement Units
link

Mech Wh Brigades and their task Org
link
Mech Wh Bns
link

one of the interesting anomalies on the recce front were the AMF(L) components and 1 Infantry Brigade in the UKMF role

Nick,

That nice to hear… ;)

Sadly I won't be at Bovvy again this year. The Gods of Rostering have cursed me and I'm stuck in a rut of having to work Day shifts whenever Bovvy is on. :(

Cheers Andy, excellent stuff! Far better than my meagre offerings!

Shame, just seen the phots of the BAT-M, very nice!!

Tally Ho!

I thought you'd like it. :)

The BAT-M is here, based and ready to go, superb bit of work looking forwards to it's debut at Bovington,

Tally Ho!

Outstanding! :)

Of course as a new, shiny piece of kit, it's doomed…