"ISIS - An "Apocalyptic Cult"?" Topic

You can't defeat an enemy when you don't truly understand its motivations, goals or identify, so I found this a bit interesting:

"al-Mahdi is 'the rightly-guided one' who, according to Islamic Hadiths (traditions), will come before the end of time to make the entire world Muslim … Now in 2014 Mahdism is active in Syria, as the jihadist opposition group Jabhat al-Nusra claims to be fighting to prepare the way for his coming; and in the new "Islamic State/caliphate" spanning Syrian and Iraqi territory, as its leadership promotes the upcoming apocalyptic battle with the West at Dabiq, Syria."
link

Another analysis here:
link
bbc.com/news/uk-30409764

The GREEN print here I think is what matters, since they are supposed to be actual excerpts from the Koran on the subject – the rest is just one person's odd interpretation:
link

In this page the RED print are the actual quotes from the Koran:
islamhelpline.net/node/4642

A few additional quotes here, between lots of commentaries:
link

But that can't be all there is. What scriptural source is there for a Jihadist group to believe that they can forcibly bring about the Islamic End of Days.

So what else have you heard or read of ISIS' actual doctrines to accelerate the arrival of a Jihadist Apocalypse (and that of other similar "Mahdist" groups, like Jabhat al-Nusra)? According to Islamic teachings, how and when would the Apocalypse come?

Thanks,

Dan
TMP link

I've heard that reported, a number of times … So IMO, the Arabs and Persians should do everything they can to bring about Daesh's End of Days …

I was thinking the same … initially.

But, if those nuts are taking all of this literally, the fire from the sky reference when the enemies meet to fight against them could mean they may have already acquired one of several missing Russian nukes, perhaps via their Chechen friends.

Their "Caliph" may have already gotten it during the early stages of the movement. And he seems crazy enough that he may simply be waiting for a large enough enemy force to concentrate in one area to use it, and together go out with a bang. That martyrdom via a nuke might really be the fast track to heaven he has promised his followers. And that would be the signal for Boko Haram and other Jihadist subsidiaries (even sleeper cells back home) to go all out cleansing their areas of infidels and heretics.

Our lack of any real intelligence on the ground is what worries me most.

How's that for a scenario*? Thoughts?

Dan
* Yes, my paranoia knows no bounds. Reminds me a little of "The almighty bomb and the holy fallout" prayer, and the Alpha and Omega bomb scenario the POTA2 mutants were waiting for when the apes attacked. If anyone had suggested there was going to be a Jonestown mass suicide event back then, they would have put that person in a padded cell, right?

But, if those nuts are taking all of this literally, the fire from the sky reference when the enemies meet to fight against them could mean they may have already acquired one of several missing Russian nukes, perhaps via their Chechen friends.

That is always the nightmare scenario. islamic terrorists types getting hold of a nuc or two … Really Don't think it has happened … yet … But if they used a nuc in any way, shape or form. All bets are off … and I think they know it. So they would be circumspect to only use them when they were sure it would lead to their [warped] endagame as you noted.

The Jonestown, Heaven's Gate and Waco events didn't lead to a wide revolution of any kind in other areas of the world.

However ISIS has been accepting allegiance from subsidiary groups and social media lone wolf recruits everywhere, who could potentially escalate activities immediately after their Caliph's suicidal fiery end. That could be the signal they are waiting for, and why we haven't had too many incidents here yet.

Jim Jones, "David Koresh", Marshall Applewhite, ISIS' self-appointed "Caliph". Crazies are crazies, regardless the brand, and have no problem taking down many of their own at their moment of martyrdom.

And, knowing what that Jihadist movement does and still plans to do with all heretics and infidels around the world, I wouldn't be surprised if the grand fiery end of the Caliph and the coordinated and brutal worldwide violence afterwards results in mass "conversions" of non-radical Muslims, simply afraid of being labeled and killed as heretics. They might not all become active participants in the final worldwide "cleansing", but they might cover for those who do participate. At the very least, the new ISIS converts might simply stand by and let the fanatics continue to do their thing unopposed.

That's my paranoid theory so far, based on the limited information I've found so far on their apocalyptic beliefs. But so far the information has been sufficient to make me see the ISIS Caliph as worse than the other insane religious leaders I mentioned above.

Dan

By the way, have any of you seen this woman?

Guys,

Believe it or not that's the picture media has posted today of a Seattle journalism student that turns out was a "primary" social media ISIS recruiter. Authorities are asking the public to report any sightings of her.

link

So please be on the lookout!!!! :)

Dan

It's better than her driver's license photo.

At least someone on this planet is intelligent enough to understand the Vulcan proverb "that the needs of the many outweighs the need of the few or the one", and has the will and fortitude to put that in practice:

link

link

Modern Western countries, however, believe that the rights of the individual are paramount, despite the damage and cost to the rest of society.

That's probably why the Vulcans will ignore us Westeners when they finally make first contact with Earth.

Dan

And, knowing what that Jihadist movement does and still plans to do with all heretics and infidels around the world, I wouldn't be surprised if the grand fiery end of the Caliph and the coordinated and brutal worldwide violence afterwards results in mass "conversions" of non-radical Muslims, simply afraid of being labeled and killed as heretics. They might not all become active participants in the final worldwide "cleansing", but they might cover for those who do participate. At the very least, the new ISIS converts might simply stand by and let the fanatics continue to do their thing unopposed.

Interesting theory … But based on what we see now … I don't think we have anything to worry about. Many of them don't get along on any given day, any way. And that woman(?!) in the pic. I've got some new neighbors. And the female looks like that …

Well, what are you waiting for? Pick up the phone and call it in!!!

And I noticed your question mark after the word "woman". Well, I don't think there's any question about who is what in this group of Houthi "women". Just check out the fully covered giant up front, leading the demonstration and chants, and holding the AK:

Dan

I'd post something Don, but you have me stifled … So …

Kyote,

I hear you but, I'm sure I don't have to tell you that open battle is but a tiny aspect of warfare, if you believe Sun Tzu, Machiavelli and the rest.

Knowing what drives the enemy in the first place is about the most important factor to figure out, so you can anticipate their next moves. So discussing motivation, strategy and their supply and recruitment methods is vital when trying to accomplish any victory.

It's like creating a personality and psychological profile on a serial killer, so that you can eventually stop them.

In the meantime, it could help you come up with all sorts of interesting gaming scenarios. From espionage activities in an RPG, to commando raids to retrieve a nuke from a heavily fortified position, to rescue operations of a captive population in a large camp setting and, of course, all the open battles your imagination can come up with. Or even a combination of all the above as part of a comprehensive campaign strategy to prevent the enemy's ultimate objectives. And, in this particular case, one based on a real live threat.

Dan

""al-Mahdi is 'the rightly-guided one' who, …"

That name, al-Mahdi (familiar to anyone who's played Gordon at Khartoum) was the inspiration for Muad-dib in Frank Herbert's novel Dune.

He copied from the Arab world for all the themes in the novel; substitute "oil" for "spice" to understand the novel.

Sorry about the tangent…

Tuscaloosa,

Well, that definitely opens up a whole new world of possibilities, if all the information above is simply used in a SF setting!

It could make the whole idea of a desert tribe apocalyptic cult enemy with a doomsday device into a more palatable setting for the PC types. I can see Rebel Minis' Sahadeen in that fanatical Jihadist/Thuggee role, with a semi-terraformed Mars as the contested territory. Perhaps they originate from a cluster of colonies "forgotten" by the major powers, in favor of colonies with more profit potential.

Their goal? To cleanse the planet Mars, either by the "sword" or by fire (doomsday bomb).

Dan

Yes, now that you mention it tusacloosa … I see that …

The Sahadeen could have a large sacred cave, with a podium and a large bomb right behind it:

YouTube link

YouTube link

Dan

My experience in the US ARMY and in the Infantry … we were generally not really a religious lot …

I haven't read the links and am responding to the topic title. You do realise Christianity was one of the early and remains an eschatological religion too, right? And that there were news stories about 10 to 12 or so years ago, IIRC, about evangelical Christian leadership in the US military who held some beliefs about their being a part of that?

Thank you Tim!

That was my first thought when I saw the topic but wasn't sure if I should point that out.

Many early Christians were convinced that the second coming would be within their lifetimes. By today's standards they would have been classified as a Doomsday Cult and there are certainly elements of that today. It's one reason there's so much support for Israel among evangelicals: for the second coming to happen Israel needs to be in the hands of the Israelites.

ISIS shares other characteristics with certain strains of U.S. Christianity but that way lies Blue Fez territory! (Or maybe not given the direction of the modern boards.)

So it's not the 70's band?

I think they banned music. Which may explain their sour outlook on life! :-)

Well there are a lot of people who believe this Mahai is in fact the anti-Christ the bible speaks of.

Stealth…are you refering to muslims, christians, or both?

"Mahdi". Whether or not you think he's the Antichrist (snicker), you should know how to write the name.

I remember Charlton Heston played "Chinese" Gordon in the movie … link Albeit, it lacked some of the historical accuracy, that Hollywood is famous for …

Like with aliens, Big Foot, Nessie, ghosts, demons, etc., etc., I'll believe totally when I see it. Which does not mean I don't believe or do believe necessarily … Some things I have have doubts … more than others …