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"Your Thoughts on "Warr Without an Enemie" rules ???" Topic


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Jeff of SaxeBearstein25 Apr 2015 3:28 p.m. PST

While we will be using the "For God, King and Country" rules for our large ECW games, we also need a different set of rules for smaller games.

My regular opponent is in the process of reading a number of rule sets and so far one that he has expressed an interest in is Nick Dorrell's "Warr Without an Enemie":

wfgamers.org.uk/WWAE.htm

What has your experience been with these rules? What are the positives? What are the negatives?

There are lots of things that I like about them from a quick glance through . . . but I am concerned about the number of factors involved because ever since my six months of chemotherapy, my poor "chemobrain" is not nearly as perceptive as it once was.

So please help me out by sharing your experiences with WWAE. Also kindly resist diverting this thread to discussing other rule sets . . . my gaming buddy still has a number of them to read through (and he will be the primary decision maker).


-- Jeff

davbenbak26 Apr 2015 8:13 a.m. PST

I haven't had a chance to give them a try but I am intrigued by their method of expressing different ratios of pike to shot in firing and melee. I'm still building my ECW armies with the intent of using "Carnage & Glory" computer moderated rules because of the ease of presenting them at conventions. Then maybe "Black Powder" as neither of them require base removal. I guess if you are already based for FOG-R you have a head start. I'm also waiting for more work on the TYW supplement.

steamingdave4726 Apr 2015 8:51 a.m. PST

Declaration of interest first. I am a member of the Wyre Forest Club. The rules were put together by a group of our gamers over a period of several years and Nick tidied them up so we could make a few quid for club funds. I was not in the original development group, so my experience of playing was like any other newbie. I found them easy to pick up. Don't be put off by the factors- the game can be played pretty well from a QRS.
IMHO. It gives a better game than Pike and Shotte, it encourages use of "proper" tactics rather than some of the "gamesmanship" possible with P+S. It is a game for a relatively small number of units- probably 5 or 6 per player is ideal. The ability to represent different fighting capabilities of the different ratios of pike: shot is a nice feature I.e. higher shot ratio gives better firing, but watch out if you are forced into hand to hand with a pike heavy unit. I also like the uncertainty of movement- in my first game I had three infantry units following each other- the first one stalled and it caused chaos to the following units.
I think they are well worth a try. ( but then I would say that, wouldn't I ?)

Lord Hollier26 Apr 2015 11:07 a.m. PST

steamingdave47,
Can you talk about:
a) the sequence of play, and how unit/brigade activation is handled,
b) how disorder works, how a unit's quality affects it, and what happens when "disorder adversely effects a unit's abilities and after the limit is reached will lead to losses of bases" (more disorder causes further base losses? until what point?)
c) is there brigade morale (i.e, does the brigade fail at some point or does it fight to the last unit)?
d) is there an army break point?

Thanks

John H.

WFGamers26 Apr 2015 6:13 p.m. PST

Jeff: I am also not a neutral here so I won't comment and hope others will. But also ask on the yahoo group if you want a (totally biased) answer on this.

Lord Hollier:

a: I am not sure what you are after here on the play sequence? The sequence is fairly conventional for the most part. You declare charges, fire, move, melee, morale. There is no card activation or similar. Everyone who can fire and has a target fires in the same phase & doesn't need activation.

At the start of the turn the commanders generate 'command points' which they use to perform various actions. This includes issuing orders to units/brigades, which is a kind of activation. But in theory once a unit has some orders it could continue with this for the rest of the game without further orders. Better commanders get more command points but also some commanders are good at doing certain things – so if a commander is aggressive he can issue charge orders cheaply.

Has this answered you?

b: You get disorder (varying numbers of 'disorder points') from terrain/movement, friends running/retreating nearby and combat.

You can get rid of the disorder by having commanders spend command points but there are never enough of these to go round. So a key advantage of high quality units is that they can get rid of these themselves and/or get rid of more of them – obviously under certain circumstances. Higher quality units also have higher saving rolls from getting some sources of disorder and other benefits. For example units get less disorder from a friendly unit running near them if they are higher quality. So generally the higher quality units also get less disorder.

Unit quality is very important because of the above.

Having disorder points reduces you fighting ability in many ways. Shooting is done by one dice per base with the score you need to hit varying depending on the musket/pike ratio. Units vary considerably in size but 5 or 6 bases is perhaps typical. So a 6 base unit would roll 6 dice to hit normally but it loses 1 dice for each disorder. So if it has 4 disorder it will roll just 2 dice for firing. Disorder similarly gives a negative minus in charges (they are treated as a kind of combat), meleeing, etc.

So the disorder has a big impact on any kind of fighting but even worse if you have 5 any more you get mean you lose bases. This is the way you get losses – so if the unit above with 4 disorder gets 2 more then it goes to 5 disorder and loses 1 base.

Disorder is a key concept and comes from a set of rules for the AWI. These are online on the clubs website here – link The details in these rules are different in WWAE but the general idea is the same.

c and d: Yes of course but remember that these rules are very much for smaller actions. So your 'army' might actually be just a brigade.

I hope this helps.

Jeff of SaxeBearstein29 Apr 2015 1:38 p.m. PST

WFGamers,

Just to correct your link to Callan's "Loose Files and American Scramble" rules:

link

(Your link had a terminal period that resulted in a '404' message.)


-- Jeff

Lord Hollier30 Apr 2015 3:17 p.m. PST

WFGamers,
Thanks for the detailed response, and yes it seems you answered all of my questions, but it did raise one more.. :-)

You said:
"At the start of the turn the commanders generate 'command points' which they use to perform various actions. This includes issuing orders to units/brigades, which is a kind of activation. But in theory once a unit has some orders it could continue with this for the rest of the game without further orders."

My problem with most 'command point' systems I've played is that you end up with formations that move in a start/stop/start manner from turn to turn, based on the command point allocation.

I infer from your (quoted) comment that you may have avoided that problem. Am I right?

John H.

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