Dobber | 19 Apr 2015 10:08 a.m. PST |
I was just wondering if I could get some advice on an opposing army to do for the french. My first thought was the Austrians, cause the helmets are really cool! (I know they didn't wear them long) and I'm not opposed to doing them, but it seems that their big battalions could cause some issues in certain game systems, or at least cause an exception or another rule to need to be used. I don't really want to do the Prussians. The British were on the table, but I was kinda leaning toward the Russians. catch is, I don't know much about them. What kind of flavor does the army have? Is their cavalry decent (always an important consideration for me) do they use huge battalions or just a lot of regular sized ones? ect ect thanks, Joe |
Fredloan | 19 Apr 2015 10:47 a.m. PST |
Russians are a good choice. Covers early period a 1805-06 and again 1812 on. Obviously they modified their uniforms from 1812 and after. Austrians are a good choice as well. They would be my first two choices. |
charles popp | 19 Apr 2015 10:58 a.m. PST |
Combined army Austrians and Russians. Why not Prussians? In 1813+ they give the French a good fight |
Sho Boki | 19 Apr 2015 11:08 a.m. PST |
Russians have the same uniform from 1809 to 1815, Fredloan. |
Cold Steel | 19 Apr 2015 11:11 a.m. PST |
Austrians are always a good start, since they fought the French more than anyone else. You can use the Austrians by themselves or combine them later with Russian or Prussian troops. The Empire was very thrifty, so when a unit replaced their helmets with shakos, all the still-serviceable helmets were given to another unit that hadn't changed yet. The helmet was still in use by some reports as late as 1812. |
War In 15MM | 19 Apr 2015 11:32 a.m. PST |
I did the Austrians in 1809. It's a neat period. You can see my 15s at link |
heavyhorse | 19 Apr 2015 11:51 a.m. PST |
Depends on your time frame..early Prussians 1806 have decent infantry good cav and artillery..command structure sucks..early Russians 1806/07 are good and you can toss in a Prussian corps with them that did not suffer from bad command…Austrians in helmets started in theory in 1798 till 1809/12 and can work with early Russians..or if you really want to be different pick Saxons or Bavarians and play on either French side or later on the allies..just an option |
Marcel1809 | 19 Apr 2015 11:51 a.m. PST |
Russians are certainly worth considering, their battalions were of about the same size of the French ones (often around 500 in real combat strenght) they had lots of artillery (though not always used very efficiently) and in general good cavalry with both the cuirassier shocktroops and the ultra light cossacks the latter give an extra flavour. Personnaly I would not entirely disregard the British. it depends on what you want and also the size of your opposing force. Fort the Austrians and Russians you will need a "big" army. The British in the peninsular fought a lot of smaller actions. Also in purely wargames terms, the British (infantry!) was of very good quality and fought onften on the defensive, so a relavitely small (and therefore not to expensive) army could face off against a larger french force. And it is the "classical "red versus blue" You just consider what options and make your choice, all of the armies mentioned here have their own flaws and strenghts. |
Sebastian Palmer | 19 Apr 2015 11:51 a.m. PST |
Hi Dobber, I'd say either Austrians or Russians, and of the two I personally chose the Russians. Once I've built my armies and gamed my 1812 battles – I'm working towards Maloyaroslavets and Smolensk – I think I'll try some 1809 action. Over the course of the Nap wars as a whole I'd say those were the two nations who packed the biggest punch on the battlefields against the French. Plus, with the Russians you have all the usual cavalry – hussars, dragoons, cuirassiers, lancers ('uhlans'), etc – plus you get the Cossacks, an exciting and exotic world unto themselves. |
Dobber | 19 Apr 2015 11:54 a.m. PST |
"Why not Prussians?" One of the other gamers in my group is big on the Prussians, and I read somewhere their cavalry isn't that great. the 1806 ones would be interesting though… War in 15MM, great stuff, hope my 15's will look half as good. thanks for the help guys. what was your reason for picking the Russians over the Austrians? Marcel: I haven't discounted the Brits, as I am kinda an Anglophile, but i think they will be after i get some French and another opponent playable. *edit* thanks Joe |
Edwulf | 19 Apr 2015 3:52 p.m. PST |
Austrians are a good call. They are easy to paint. (Stock up on grey and white). Infantry are fairly good. Elite grenadiers. Hungarians for some variation. Jagers for some rifle troops. Excellent cavalry arm. Best regular light cavalry I think. Britain. Is my personal favorite. Small but highly competent infantry. Solid artillery. Colorful if unreliable cavalry. Get to use them with allies like Austrians, Portuguese, Spanish, Dutch-Belgian, Russians. Some don't like painting the lace though. Russia has a good army. Possibly the least easy to research but others might say other wise. Upside is Cossacks. Pretty cool exotic unit other armies don't get. Prussia. My least favorite. I just find their uniform so dull. Even their hussars can only manage Browns and dark greens (post 1809 I mean). Britain tried to help them by giving them some snazzy Portuguese uniforms but they hated them incase their allies and enemies mistook them for having some character and style. Sad as they or one of you big players. Spain. Often maligned. Often beaten. But some of the best uniformed troops in the wars. When they got their uniforms at least. Yellow cavalry! Grenadiers with the coolest bearskins. Green light troops. All the colours of the rainbow. If you lose you don't feel bad. If you win.. You can mock your opponent for years. Can also be used against the british for some 1805-7 actions. |
nsolomon99 | 19 Apr 2015 4:16 p.m. PST |
I've been wargaming the Revolutionary & Napoleonic periods for 30 years now and have all the armies and I would comment that in your position I would go either Austrian or Russian for my first-up opposing force. The Austrians fought the French throughout the whole period, more than any other army and are therefore good opponents for any timeframe. What is often overlooked is that are actually one of the most colourful armies with infantry in white, brown, grey, blue and all manner of facing colours. The Austrian cavalry is also amongst the most colourful with tremendous variety. They are a consistently average force who almost always fought hard and put in a solid performance. The Russian Army of 1806-1807 in East Prussia was the toughest army the French, AT THEIR PEAK, ever encountered. They would be my second choice. The early Russians, from Suvorov's men against the Revolutionary French and the 1805 uniformed forces of Austerlitz and then East Prussia are also an exotic looking army with some Grenadiers in Mitre, Musketeers in Bicorne, then early Shako, lots of cavalry variety and loads of artillery. The Prussians, well the 1806 Army looks spectacular. The British Army is mainly an infantry force and limited to the Peninsula – this campaign is long and interesting but, not typical of the Napoleonic wars and tends to yield a shewed view of the period if played exclusively. Cant go wrong with either Austrians or Russians first up really. Then add the others later. Nick |
Dobber | 19 Apr 2015 4:40 p.m. PST |
many thanks to all who responded |
War In 15MM | 19 Apr 2015 6:27 p.m. PST |
Dobber, thanks for the kind words. Good luck with your project. Richard |
Fredloan | 19 Apr 2015 7:31 p.m. PST |
"Russians have the same uniform from 1809 to 1815, Fredloan" Yes you are correct Sho Boki, I was just referring to the early shako v Kiwer and the narrower crest of the cavalry and horse artillery helmets |
Glengarry5 | 19 Apr 2015 10:46 p.m. PST |
The thing about the British is they rarely fielded an all-British army. It seems to me it wouldn't quite be proper to field a British force without Spanish & Portuguese on the one hand or Dutch/Belgian & assorted Germans on the other! |
Markconz | 19 Apr 2015 11:38 p.m. PST |
When faced with same choice I went for Austrians, though I'm also going to do Russians, and later on a smaller Prussian force. Austrians were the most frequent opponent of the French and their army looks stunning IMHO. White looks awesome but they also have much more colour than many people realise with multicoloured facings, Grenz, Hussars and so on. |
christot | 20 Apr 2015 2:24 a.m. PST |
Accept its a slippery slope….whichever you go for first, be it Austrians, Prussians, Russians in the end you will do all of them. |
badger22 | 20 Apr 2015 3:56 a.m. PST |
Aint that the truth. be happy if you only do all of them in one scale, I have 15mm, 1/72nd and 28mm napoleonoics. And am still collecting them all. owen |
Saber6 | 20 Apr 2015 12:11 p.m. PST |
Christot has the Right of it. Now I have 3+ (5+ for the Austrians) Corps of "Enemies of France" |
Marc at work | 20 Apr 2015 12:29 p.m. PST |
Badger – there's some nice 54mm figures out there you know… |
Dobber | 22 Apr 2015 5:46 a.m. PST |
"Accept its a slippery slope….whichever you go for first, be it Austrians, Prussians, Russians in the end you will do all of them." Probably true… and thats not counting the obligatory 29 regiments of curiassers for the Froggies!! (i suppose an infantry battalion or 2 wouldn't hurt…) "Aint that the truth. be happy if you only do all of them in one scale, I have 15mm, 1/72nd and 28mm napoleonoics. And am still collecting them all." ACK! the man knows me! I already have 28mm Austrians and Brits, now I'm starting 15mm! hopefully it won't end up like my ACW collection, which i have in 3, 6, 15, and 28… and am considering that 10 was the way to go all along… arrgh! Joe |
Murvihill | 22 Apr 2015 9:20 a.m. PST |
Swedes. The uniform is unique and none of your friends will have any. |
Royal Marine | 22 Apr 2015 9:31 a.m. PST |
I would have said an army of vegetables but would be silly. |