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"How many Cannons, 24 man units?" Topic


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Vayasen13 Apr 2015 12:57 p.m. PST

Hi all.

As permy other thread in the gallery, I am new to Napoleonics and I have nearly now finished a Brigade of Infantry (another Brigade to go as I am making up the 1st Corps, 1st division).

Question, as my battalions have 24 men each, how many cannons should I have for the first division.

TheOrderof battle shows the 1st division as having :


20e Companie 6e d'Artillerie a Pied Capitaine Hamelin 85 6x6lb guns & 2x5.5in howitzers

So I presume in game terms (I will be buying black powder) I need 1 battery, but of how many guns (not fussed bout the howitzers tbh)

ciaphas13 Apr 2015 1:15 p.m. PST

If your doing black powder batteries are two guns.

Jon

MajorB13 Apr 2015 2:18 p.m. PST

Actually, if you're doing Black Powder then the rules actually say a battery can be represented by a single gun model and crew (See Size of Units on p.9). However, BP is not prescriptive and as long as your battery frontage does not exceed the frontage of a normal sized infantry unit you should be fine.

Personal logo Artilleryman Supporting Member of TMP13 Apr 2015 2:51 p.m. PST

I usually have one gun to represent two which means you can represent the howitzers as well. The fire power still depends on the rules being used.

ciaphas13 Apr 2015 4:22 p.m. PST

In the Napoleonic expansions they class a full battery as two guns and a half battery as a solo gun.

Jon

MajorB14 Apr 2015 3:51 a.m. PST

In the Napoleonic expansions they class a full battery as two guns and a half battery as a solo gun.

The OP did not mention anything about the Napoleonic expansions. It should be borne in mind that that is only ONE interpretation of how to play BP.

Marcel180923 Apr 2015 12:35 p.m. PST

two gun batteries look right to me, a single gun (that's what we used before) just does not look right and has not enough frontages.Four gun batteries look right on their own but really are so huge compared to a 24 man battalion. So I'd stick to two guns, with every second battery having a howitser.

4th Cuirassier24 Apr 2015 7:03 a.m. PST

It's not exactly a direct response to the question asked but it is perhaps worth noting that guns per 1,000 men is a commonly used measure of artillery strength in Napoleonic armies.

Most armies would have had, on the battlefield, between 1 and 4 guns per 1,000 men, with something around the 2 per 1,000 level being probably commonest.

So Wellie at Waterloo had 2.3 and Napoleon had 3.4 guns per 1,000 men. At Austerlitz Napoleon had 2.1 and the allies had 3.7. At Eylau Napoleon had 2.7 per 1,000, the Russians unusually had 6.

A French brigade was typically two regiments of two battalions totalling 2,000 to 2,500 effectives at campaign strength. A division was usually two such brigades so would therefore be 5,000 or so. At a typical French guns per 000 men ratio, there would therefore have been between 10 and 18 guns on the field per such 5,000-man division.

It is your call and your rules' to what extent if any you observe this sort of detail. Two French foot batteries, though, would have totalled 16 guns, so in your shoes I'd be looking to represent that many guns for a force of divisional strength.

A foot battery would have between ten and twenty metres between pieces so a footprint between 80 and 160 metres wide. For comparison a 600-man battalion in line three deep would have been 200 men wide and about 120 metres' frontage. So the frontage of a battery and of a battalion would have been about the same. You could probably fit two model guns into that space, I would say.

If it were me I would also model a parked limber and ammunition wagon and place them behind the unlimbered battery on the table, as this is what was done and it significantly congested the area in a deployed battery's rear.

Widowson25 Apr 2015 2:37 p.m. PST

A typical French division of 2 brigades had a battery associated with it. But if you are using 24-figures per battalion, I'd use two guns to represent the battery.

Maxshadow25 Apr 2015 4:22 p.m. PST

Amazingly useful post for anyone building their first Napoleonic army 4th Cuirassier!

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