| Ned Ludd | 12 Mar 2015 4:07 a.m. PST |
I plan to try the Two Hour Wargames Stalingrad scenarios out in 28mm but my figures are painted as rifle platoon not Panzer Grenadiers. The have pzr grens for the Germans so have to option for Half tracks. What I carnt seem to find out is. Did Heer rifle platoons/grenadiers have access to halftracks? Its not a big deal, I can use the figures as Pzr grenadiers but I just started to wonder about it, as idealy I would like to keep support historical to a normal grenadier platoon in Stalingrad. |
| Martin Rapier | 12 Mar 2015 4:39 a.m. PST |
I think you are confusing two things, all panzergrenadiers were Heer troops (as in, in the army) unless they were SS or Luftwaffe PGRs. If you mean, did normal leg infantry formations have access to armoured halftracks, then no. Can use use normal leg infantry to stand in for motorised infantry? Yes of course, the only uniform difference is the colour of the waffenfarbe, which is hardly noticeable. The only thing to be careful of is that normally halftrack mounted infantry had two MGs per section (three including the permanent mount on the HT), so you might need some more MG34/42 teams. |
| Ned Ludd | 12 Mar 2015 4:47 a.m. PST |
Thanks thats what I wanted to confirm. I have the Nuts Stalingrad campaign booklet. I will use them as Panzer grenadiers. |
 Jeff Ewing  | 12 Mar 2015 6:12 a.m. PST |
did normal leg infantry formations have access to armoured halftracks Not even most panzer grenadiers did, in fact. |
| Martin Rapier | 12 Mar 2015 8:23 a.m. PST |
"Not even most panzer grenadiers did, in fact." Very true, although the PG companies in the panzer recce battalions boost the total a bit. They were often equipped with 251s instead of 250s. The vast majority rode in trucks (or later in the war, rode bicycles or walked:) |
| Pizzagrenadier | 12 Mar 2015 9:38 a.m. PST |
Unless you were lucky enough to be in Panzer Lehr where all the pzgrens had the halftracks to mount in. Except that it made for a nice target for allied air superiority in which case maybe not so lucky… walking or a bike has more appeal then I would imagine. |
| zoneofcontrol | 12 Mar 2015 10:38 a.m. PST |
Carrying on from the above posts…
A regiment may have one battalion of mechanized (halftrack) and one battalion of motorized (whatever trucks they could scrounge up). Generally the support for mechanized units would be mechanized as well. Well that was at least on paper. In reality they would be lucky to steal a skateboard or baby buggy to move around. |
| Simo Hayha | 12 Mar 2015 5:12 p.m. PST |
If you see armored panzergrenadiers that means they had halftracks
if you see motorized panzergrenadier they had trucks
there were also bicycle and motorcycle mounted units. |
| hagenthedwarf | 12 Mar 2015 5:24 p.m. PST |
As I recall the rule of thumb for half-tracks in a Pz Div is:
39 Poland – 1 platoon
40 France – 1 company
41 Russia – 1 battalion |
| Lion in the Stars | 12 Mar 2015 5:50 p.m. PST |
The difference between "generic German Riflemen" and Panzergrenadiers is a second MG in the squad and pink waffenfarbe instead of white. But as everyone else has noted, the majority of Panzergrenadiers rode in trucks. |
| Pizzagrenadier | 12 Mar 2015 6:32 p.m. PST |
Panzgren waffenfarb is actually grass green, not pink ;) (for Heer units. I think SS was white). |
| Weasel | 12 Mar 2015 6:36 p.m. PST |
I imagine in Stalingrad, they'd spend plenty of their time on foot.
Did Panzergrenadier have 2 MG per squad early in the war? |
| uglyfatbloke | 13 Mar 2015 3:10 a.m. PST |
In practice, how common was it to have 2 MGs per squad? |
| Pizzagrenadier | 13 Mar 2015 6:35 a.m. PST |
It was standard practice from early in the war with motorized units then panzergrenadier. Yes, they really did pack two MGs. |
| Martin Rapier | 13 Mar 2015 8:35 a.m. PST |
However motorised infantry units in seperate divisonal organisations (like 29th Mot Id) were just infantry units in lorries, and only had one LMG. Until they converted to being 'proper' motorised infantry divisions and later panzergrenadiers, then they got two LMGs. Schutzen battalions in panzer divisions had two LMGs right from the start, in the main, and the chaps riding halftracks definately had three all along (one was a permanent vehicle mount but showed up in the strength returns as three LMGs per section). Yes, Waffen-SS panzergrenadiers had white waffenfarbe, Heer were grass green, unless they were in DAK in which case it was very, very complicated…. Later in the war some divisons were lucky enough to boast two battalions in halftracks (didn't 21st Panzer have all four in HTs as well in 1944?) It was also pretty common to use the panzergrenadier element of the recce battalion as an additional PG battalion or core of an armoured KG while the two armoured car companies went off an did their recce thing. |
