"French Guard Lancers converted to Russian Uhlans" Topic

G'Day Gents

Is it possible to convert Guard Lancers to Russian Uhlans:

Into this regiment:

МУНДИРЫ ПОЛКОВ РОССИЙСКОГО ОПОЛЧЕНИЯ, 1806—1815 гг.

8. Конный воин Нижегородского ополчения. 1813—1814
8. Horse warrior Novgorod militia. 1813-1814

Need to scroll down to find the drawing

link

Best Regards
Art

Art,

Check out my answer here : TMP link
Here I mention
9. Воин конного полка Костромского ополчения. 1813—1814
Which would be Kostroma Horse

In addition,
8. Конный воин Нижегородского ополчения. 1813—1814
is not correctly translated as Novgorod Horse. It would Nizhney Novgorod (literally "Lesser Novgorod"). That is not the same place as Novgorod. This confusion is not your fault – it is wrong on the page you linked.

This was not the original uniform of the Nizhney Novgorod Horse. But like the Kostroma horse, it is quite possible that made up something stylishly à la Polonaise during the campaign of 1812.

- Sasha

Correction … should be, at the end, "campaign of 1813".

Can't spell. Also can't type.

Maybe I should explain …
Нижегородского / Nizhegorodskogo

The ending "sk…." means "of", "from" or "like" or "ish" : it shows origin.

Putting on the "ogo" ending makes it an adjective form : "skogo". If this were a subject, it might end "skiy". These word endings actually also change for a bunch of other uses, and for gender. But if you get the ending wrong, most Russians will still understand you. My wife will pretend she does not, however. She will then petulantly ask you to speak English or French.

If you look at texts before the bolshevik spelling change, it will be Нижегородскаго / Nizhegorodskago. Search engines, especially the Google and Russian State Library book search functions, may skip the Нижегородскаго results if you are searching old titles for Нижегородского. But modern Russians, even when discussing historical topics on forums, always use modernized spelling.

Now for the "Nizhegorod" part – it is a contraction of "Nizhney" and "Novgorod". It has nothing to do with the other city, the original or greater Novgorod – or no more than New York has to do with York.

- Sasha

G'Day Alexandre.

At least you are lucky…my wife says I speak like a barbarian in both French and English ;-)

Best Regards
Art

First reaction is……..tricky. These seem to have no coat tails/turnbacks, waist length jacket only. In metal that would be tricky to convert. You'll destroy many a grinder on your Dremel.

So you want waist length jacket but with the plastron front of a "Polish" lancer. I'd be inclined to wait for the plastic light dragoons from Perry. Unusually, "British" LDs did adopt something more like the Kurtka than the usual heavy dragoons' coat. Plastic, so easily adapted. The heads will have to come from Guard lancers, but not full dress (front plate etc all wrong). Murawski's range might be well worth a look?

Oh, apologies! I now see that Sasha has already given a far better answer above…………….teach me to read all the links first!

Interestingly – or not I just tried (I dread to say this) the Google translation of the caption
Конный воин Нижегородского ополчения

and it comes up with
Hobbler Nizhny Novgorod militia

Which uses a term for the Horse warrior bit rather like the 'Hobilar' (pronounced same), medieval English lightly armoured/semi-irregular cavalry.

Maybe worth punching in the translation to check captions.

Humbly your servant

John FoA

A hobbler or hobelar (the light cavalryman) is usually referred to in Russian as легковооружённый конный воин (legkovooruzhyonnyy konnyy voin) – literally "lightly-equipped horse warrior". Google translate is pattern matching the end part and guessing. Only someone with such a breadth of knowledge of military history as John would have realized that the Google tranlation was indeed referencing a cavalryman of some sort, and was not just flat out wrong.

I would translate конный воин Нижегородского ополчения (konnyy voin Nizhegorodskogo opolchenieya) as – "mounted fighter of the Nizhney Novgorod militia levy".

The use of воин (voin) or ратник (ratnik) indicates we are talking about opolchenie, militia, partizans, temporary volunteers, etc. – and not regulars.

For the unit itself, not the cavalryman, it would be Конный Нижегородского ополчения полк / Konnyy Nizhegorodskogo opolcheniya polk / Nizhney Novgorod militia cavalry regiment.

- Sasha

G'Day Liam

I have introduced Napoleonic wargaming to my two boys. One decided to go British, while the other Russian. I gave them both my old 25mm Russians and British, which in turn they bought new 28mm Perry.

I have 48 unpainted 25mm Hinchcliffe French Guard cavalry, that shall never be used.

With a little shaving here and there…it should work.

Best Regards
Art

My two younger lads (20 next month on St Patrick's Day!) introduced me to some folk called the Perrys. They both painted these Riders of Rohan and Wargs and Knights of Gondor etc in hard plastic, so well cast that dry brushing alone was enough to see a face. I thought "If only someone would make Napoleonic soldiers to this standard"

Russian Uhlans do seem to have adopted a unique uniform, modifying what I always think of as a Polish look (that may be heresy!)

G'Day Liam

So you are saying that certain Russian Uhlans do not resemble French Guard Lancers????

Best Regards
Art

Let me immediately announce a disclaimer. I have not the slightest idea what a Russian Uhlan should look like beyond the pictures above….and very smart they do look.

However the two countries feel about each other, I suspected a Polish look to them. I have since tried to learn via Google….

There seems to have been a very fetching and well fitting waist length jacket. Some did have tails with conventional turnbacks. I have found none with Polish turnbacks (as for Guard or even British Light Dragoons). The difference is that most turnbacks are wider at the base, narrowing at the apex. The Polish style is the reverse (and looks far better).

Then, is the shoulder decoration problem. Guard lancers fringed epaulette on the right, intricate aigulettes on the left (murder to remove in metal). Yer Russians seem not to have sported such…..The Guard Czapka has an N in a sunburst plate. Good luck trying to remove that.

I have not even thought about shabraques

Forgive my total ignorance on this subject. I can only say, if I was starting out on Russian Uhlans, I would look at real Poles……..?Murawski?

But then there is an owld Irish saying about asking for directions (it is half serious). "Ah sure, I can help you so, but, if I was you, I would not be starting from here, Lord Bless us and Shave us"

In other words hang on a month or two and some one will do them…..everytime I do a conversion, that is the end result. Gendarmes, lancers in cloaks, Ponsonby, Ewart……

"In other words hang on a month or two and some one will do them…..everytime I do a conversion, that is the end result. Gendarmes, lancers in cloaks, Ponsonby, Ewart……"

I wish that was true ;-))

I did convert French Imperial cuirassiers into those of 1796 and I am just painting some of them, I am quite firm that nobody will do them

Seriously, I would love to see even a poor photo of them unfinished. I love to see conversions……..

What a great idea!