"2/24th (2nd Warwickshire Regiment) Foot - Howard's Greens" Topic
13 Posts
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carojon | 20 Dec 2014 6:46 a.m. PST |
Hi all, Just finished the 2/24th Foot, one of the second battalions shipped out to bolster Wellesley's forces after the losses suffered in Sir John Moore's Corunna Campaign.
These chaps were a "straight of the boat" green unit when they appeared at Talavera, but their battle performance left them as a hard core fighting second battalion of veterans. It turned out that only their facings were green. If you would like to know more, then follow the link to JJ's link Jonathan |
Texas Jack | 20 Dec 2014 6:53 a.m. PST |
Those are beautiful figures, flags included, and a damn fine write up about them as well! |
IronDuke596 | 20 Dec 2014 8:03 a.m. PST |
It is hard to believe that they are 18mm….well painted. I always look forward to your reports. Many thanks foe sharing them. |
von Winterfeldt | 20 Dec 2014 9:37 a.m. PST |
well painted unit, it looks impressive How did you make the cords and tassels at the colours? |
carojon | 20 Dec 2014 10:12 a.m. PST |
Cheers Guys, glad you like them. vW the chords are simply fuse wire twisted together with a blob of general purpose glue on the end. |
Maldini1966 | 20 Dec 2014 10:17 a.m. PST |
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razuse | 21 Dec 2014 6:41 a.m. PST |
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Double G | 21 Dec 2014 8:53 a.m. PST |
Yet another well painted unit from you, thanks for sharing, you do excellent work….. |
carojon | 21 Dec 2014 2:36 p.m. PST |
Thanks Guys, appreciate the comments |
seneffe | 21 Dec 2014 2:48 p.m. PST |
Super figures. The story about 'Howard's Greens' for the 24th quoted in your blog is completely new on me. The version I have read many times in different places is somewhat different and applies instead to the also green faced 19th Foot. This unit had a colonel called Howard in the 1730s, as did the 3rd Foot (Buffs). In the version I have it was the 19th dubbed unofficially by George II the 'Green Howards' to distinguish it from the 'Buff Howards'. The 'Green Howards' name lasted with the 19th and its successor units, eventually officially, into the 1990s. |
carojon | 21 Dec 2014 4:50 p.m. PST |
Hi seneffe, Thank you. The reference I am using comes from John Cook and Robert Burnham on the Napoleon Series site. napoleon-series.org You are quite right about the 19th Foot having the nickname The Green Howard's after their Colonel, listed as being used from 1740 according to the above. The 24th also had a Colonel Howard commanding and thus were given the title in reverse. You are also correct about the Buffs needing to differentiate themselves being commanded by a Colonel Thomas Howard, see my post on the Buffs link This helps illustrate the need for the early British army to move from regiments named after their colonels to one based on a numbering system according to seniority, but the nicknames stuck You mention the latter career of the Green Howard's and likewise the 24th became better known as the South Wales Borderers, of Zulu and Rorkes Drift fame. Now part of the heritage of the Royal Welsh since March 1st 2006 |
seneffe | 22 Dec 2014 3:57 p.m. PST |
Hi Carojon. Interesting theory. I don't think the story about the 24th getting the 'Howard's Greens' title in reverse to the 19th can be correct though. The Howard who was Colonel of the 24th till 1737 is actually exactly the same chap (Thomas) who then became Colonel of the 3rd Buffs in the same year. So there weren't three different Colonel Howards (of the 3rd, 19th and 24th) in the late 1730s- early 1740s- but only two. Also, the 19th didn't gain its Colonel (Charles) Howard till 1738, so there were not two green faced 'Howard's' regiments in existence at the same time in this period. It's unlikely that the Howard's Greens nickname came about in the way suggested- if it was actually used at all. Just to be confusing Thomas' son George Howard also served in the 3rd during throughout this period and did eventually become its Colonel in 1749- but that is the next generation of Howards!! It was common practise in the C18 for Colonels to move to more senior (or sometimes just more fashionable) regiments when vacancies arose. This succession of the same men as Colonels of different regiments can easily trip up researchers. JSAHR did an excellent succession of Colonels booklet from the 1660s to the 1970s- well worth picking up a copy if you're interested in this kind of stuff. The Howard's Greens nickname seems at best to have been a rather ephermeral one for the 24th. I haven't come across a contemp ref for it myself, although I confess I don't have access to a good regimental history. Not sure if Richard Cannon did a volume on the 24th. Thomas Mante who used to post here would surely have this at his fingertips… Still- super figures! |
carojon | 22 Dec 2014 4:48 p.m. PST |
Hi seneffe, You might be right, but at the moment the only certain references I have are the ones I have used from the Napoleon Series, "Nicknames of British Units during the Napoleonic Wars" who to be fair make the point that some of these references are not as clear cut as we would like them to be. I find them to be a useful resource, and they welcome new data, so if you can provide them with contrary sources I am sure they would be very pleased to have them and make the necessary amendments to their information. The regimental History for the Buffs as linked in my post for the Buffs shows them commanded by Lt Gen Thomas Howard and state they received their title, the Buffs, during the campaign in the Low Countries in 1744. At the same time the 19th were commanded by the honourable Sir Charles Howard gaining their title the Green Howard's The reference from the Napoleon Series has the 24th as getting their nickname Howard's Greens in 1737, the 19th in 1740 and the Buffs at some time in the 18th century. This explains my reluctance to deal in absolutes when quoting these references, but I am happy to go with them until confirmation to the contrary. |
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