| Tango01 | 16 Dec 2014 12:26 p.m. PST |
"Afghanistan – In a valley south of Kabul, U.S. Special Forces are trying to work themselves out of a job. Camp Morehead is a small U.S. outpost surrounded by a large Afghan training facility known as Camp Commando. That's where the elite forces of the Afghan army are trained. The commandos and other, newer forces are the key to the country's future, U.S. officials say…"
Full article here
link Amicalement
Armand |
| Generalstoner49 | 16 Dec 2014 12:29 p.m. PST |
Elite Afghan Commandos… How oxymoronic. |
| Lion in the Stars | 16 Dec 2014 12:41 p.m. PST |
I would not sneer at the fighting abilities of any Afghan. Afghans (and Iranians/Iraqis/Syrians/etc) know how to fight. They don't understand the Western reasoning of why to fight. All the Afghans my friend associated with during his tour there could not imagine any social structure larger than the tribe. Hell, there's not even a word in Pashtu for "nation"! I think the word he finally ended up using translates to "tribe-of-tribes". For almost all Middle Easterners, their 'nation' is their tribe. The Egyptians and the Israelis are the two exceptions, and I think the only reason the Egyptians have that idea is that they were ruled by the French and English for a couple hundred years. Add to that a culture founded on the control of information and knowledge, and you get a complete disaster in teaching Western fighting methods. The Russians had a little better luck, but still never managed to teach the idea of taking care of your weapons and equipment. Maintenance is seen as something you have servants do. |
| cwlinsj | 16 Dec 2014 2:35 p.m. PST |
Elite units are almost always drawn from fighters from the same tribe/province and officered by tribal leaders. I have no doubt that these units are well trained & motivated. There are just too few of them and they typically end-up being used as palace guards and garrison troops to hold key cities. |
 Legion 4   | 16 Dec 2014 2:45 p.m. PST |
The term "Elite" has no place in many ME, African and SW Asian forces … in comparison to the West … |
| Rakkasan | 16 Dec 2014 11:52 p.m. PST |
There are elite forces in Afghanistan, the Middle East, Africa, and South West Asia. I have been working with them and those that train and fight with them for almost 20 years. They have good kit, excellent training, and greater loyalty to their unit rather than a tribe or faction. Their tactical leadership is usually very good as well.
Where they fall short is in air support, logistics, real time signals and imagery intel and fusion of that intel. The higher leadership and staffs and the units that have to hold the space or support these elite forces are less capable.
There are at least 4 different words for nation in Pastu. I will concede that the concept of loyalty to a nation is weak in some areas of Afghanistan and Iraq. |
| Bangorstu | 17 Dec 2014 5:45 a.m. PST |
Legion – Remember, the Zero can't be a good aircraft because it was built by yellow people… Hubris is a dangerous thing. |
| Legion 4 | 17 Dec 2014 8:28 a.m. PST |
Good intel Rakkasan ! BTW I was with 3/187 in '80-'83 …  Note stu, he was there, he's been on the ground, you, my friend, just read about or saw it on the news. Rakkasan is a very reliable source … Compared to him … you … not so much … Just say'n … |
| Legion 4 | 17 Dec 2014 8:42 a.m. PST |
Legion – Remember, the Zero can't be a good aircraft because it was built by yellow people…Hubris is a dangerous thing.
stu … don't talk down to me … again … I'm well aware of the concept first made popular by Sun Tzu [a "yellow people" as you say, Chinese not Nippon however … regardless ], about never underestimate your enemy. But I'm also familiar with, an Army of rabbits lead by lions is better that an army of lions lead by rabbits …  And yes, in 1940 the US undestimated the IJF. 6 months after at Midway, the Japanese were generally on the defensive in the PTO. Save for the Imphal-Khohima offensive in '44. Which they too lost with very high losses. Hubris … this is what I call hubris. Some US soldiers did not surrender to the "Nips" and suffer on the Baatan Death March, etc. … They fell back into the jungles and mountians of the PI. And along with the locals fought a guerilla war. Killing many "Japs" until over 2 years later the US Forces returned … Now .. That is hubris … |
| Ucalegos | 17 Dec 2014 10:54 p.m. PST |
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| Rakkasan | 17 Dec 2014 11:20 p.m. PST |
Legion 4 – was in 1/187 from 88-91. Spent a lot of time in the field but it was my best 3 years in the Army. |
| Legion 4 | 18 Dec 2014 3:22 a.m. PST |
Ucalegos
It's … Really …. Not ….
Explain ? The definition – Hubris means extreme pride or self-confidence … In its modern usage, "hubris denotes overconfident pride and arrogance. Hubris is often associated with a lack of humility, though not always with the lack of knowledge." The classic definition > Hubris is extreme pride and arrogance shown by a character that ultimately brings about his downfall. Seems like there was some self-confidence, pride and maybe even arrogance among those soldiers to take on the the "Japs" with their PI local allies … Along with their will to survive and get payback … I tend to go with the modern usage …. But we can discuss semantics if you like … |
| Legion 4 | 18 Dec 2014 3:24 a.m. PST |
Rakkasan
Legion 4 – was in 1/187 from 88-91. Spent a lot of time in the field but it was my best 3 years in the Army.
Nice to hear from another Rakassan. Yes, my years with the 187 were very memorable.  |
takes inspiration from Doctor Who.
