"What rules are there?" Topic

So, given the recent threads about different rules sets and avoiding marketing capture, I am curious as to the options out there. Generally, what are the alternatives for Bolt Action and Flames of War?

For context:For me an alternative means that I can use forces currently based for that rule set and in that scale of play. And though not completely necessary, I prefer rules that are available in printed form, not something I have to download and print or get via Lulu, etc. The rules should not have a steep learning curve, but more depth and less gamey (since that appears to be the main weakness of the two mainstream games)

The only rules I currently own aside from BA and FOW are blitzkrieg commmander, chain of command, panzergrenadier deluxe, and battlegroup. Of these, I am really liking battlegroup for what it's worth.

So, in my limited awareness, these are the main rules available…

FLAMES OF WAR
Blitzkrieg Commander
Panzer Grenadier Deluxe
Battlegroup Series

BOLT ACTION
Chain of Command
Disposable Heroes
Rules of Engagement
Rate of Fire
Fireball Forward

Where does I ain't been shot mum fit? Is it superceded by Chain of Command?

What else should be considered for purchase?

IABSM is company level. It focuses on fielding infantry forces with back up roles by armor/off table arty/etc. It's very good IMO.

Chain of Command is platoon level. It doesn't supersede IABSM, just plays at a different level and uses different mechanics than IABSM.

You might also consider Poor Bloody Infantry (PBI) from Peter Pig. I've never played it but you can download a quick reference sheet/quick play to give you a general idea. A new edition of PBI is apparently coming out very, very soon.

I agree with Privateer, and I'd throw Crossfire up there under the Flames of War Column. Also, Chain of Command is at the same scale as TFL's 'other' ruleset, Troops, Weapons, and Tactics.

V/R,
Jack

Battlefront WW-II and Command Decision: Test of Battle are a couple more

@Saber6 …. where in the categories do they fit?

For FOW pieces:
A&A Miniatures can readily be played with FoW miniatures. It is my go-to casual WWII game for non-dedicated players. Needs 3" hexes or bigger for FOW stands. 3" is good enough though. One stand will represent one squad. I often up-scale to one stand = one platoon for scenarios. More gamey though.

And, another vote for Crossfire. Very different, demands lots and lots of terrain, but good. Less gamey, but simple rules.

Have only looked at PBI. It is not perfectly suited to FOW pieces because a squad is represented as 3 stands, not two. You would need lots of spare rifle stands to make your force work. But then it ought to work fine.

For Bolt Action pieces:
Operation Squad is a neat act-react game, but you only play a squad vs a squad. They made Operation WWII at same level as BA, but I don't know much about it.

Victory Decision is in many ways similar to Bolt Action.

Command Decision sits under the FoW column, and you can add Rapid Fire in that column as well.

Cheers.
JohnG

Arc of Fire is another great skirmish set – card driven which some like/dislike.
Battleground WWII – excellent web support.
Rapid Fire.

Make sure to put Nuts! on the list. A really good, fast-playing skirmish game (so BA column) which lends itself well to solo playing among many other things.

Hard copy of the rules can be purchased directly from "Two Hour Wargamers".

Command Decision is really a level higher than FOW, units represent platoons. You can use FOW based troops for the game though.

Battlefront would be FoW (stands are Squads)

I watched a video review of command decision. Seems to have a fairly steep learning curve.

So the list is updated to:

FLAMES OF WAR
Blitzkrieg Commander
Panzer Grenadier Deluxe
Battlegroup Series
Rapid Fire
Battlefront WWII
Command Decision – sorta?

BOLT ACTION
Chain of Command
Disposable Heroes
Rules of Engagement
Rate of Fire
Fireball Forward
Nuts!
Arc of Fire
Victory Decision
Operation Squad

Fireball Forward is FOW rather then BA.

You beat me to it, Dynaman! Yep, FBF primarily uses based miniatures where one base equals one squad. And it is definitely a Company level game like FoW. It's the best gam,e of it';s type out there, though I admit to being biased because I helped play test it and illustrated the main rules and all the scenario books!

Crossfire goes in the FOW list, I've played both with the same bases- and, I think, its just been re-released after many years out of print.

You COULD, play Spearhead with FOW basing, but its 1 stand = 1 pltn so might be out, also, its been OOP for years…

Rapid Fire is higher level game than FoW. Units are Companies grouped into battalions. FoW units are squads grouped into companies. CD and Spear head are also more like Rapid Fire in scale. So is Look Sarge No Charts. Based on your constraints, Rapid Fire, Command Decision and Spearhead do not belong in either category. Crossfire belongs in the FoW category.

Joker is right, albeit tecnically….CD, and Rapid Fire are ostensibly aimed at a higher level but the bottom line is you still end up with the same amount of toys doing similar things as you do in the rule sets which represent squads rather than platoons…the major differences tend to be simply of nomanclecture.
Spearhead probably IS a bit different.

Blitzkrieg Commander actually states it has a variable scale, units might be squads, pltns or even coys, its whatever level the player is comfortable with representing.
CD and RF are the same, except the writers don't state it.

I'll also add two rules from the past that are not as 'current' but still available. Both would fall under BA's category:

Battleground World War II (Easy Eight Enterprises) – This is the very first set of rules available for 28mm and many people still play it. Easy Eight Enterprises is now Victory Force Miniatures. VFM does not sell BGWWII but it's available from Neo-Forge.

Overation Overlord (Alzo Zero/Italeri) – This is Italeri model's rules to support its line of 1/72 plastic figures. Comes as a boxset, a Paratrooper expansion (Paratrooper Attack) and vehicle expansion (Upgrade Vehicle).

With the new contract with LnL Publishing, NUTS will soon have more retail exposure and distribution as well as higher production value.

TMP link

I've never played Battleground WW2 but have heard good things about it. Here's a link to Neo-Forge.

neo-forge.com/rules1.html

Flames of War is a tad odd ball usI g 1:1 figure representation but with lots of attachments on table more suited to a Platoon level game

Other rules are
Skirmish types -
Rules of Engagement
Overlord – OOP
Grey Storm Red a steel – OOP
Rate of Fire
Storming the Reich
Battle.- OOP
Operation Warboard – OOP
Panzer Miniatures rules

Higher level -
Kampfgruppe Commander III
Field Of Battlw WW2
Piquet Point Of Attack (includes skirmish level)
WRG 1925-50
Combined Arms – OOP
Firefly – OOP

I wish you could edit posts after more than an hour, so I didn't have to start a new response, but ah well.

Out of Print and more "archaic" rules, in my view, would not be alternatives. I am enough of a sheep () to work that hard hunting down old rules.

So the list is updated to:

FLAMES OF WAR
Blitzkrieg Commander
Panzer Grenadier Deluxe
Battlegroup Series
Battlefront WWII
Fireball Forward
Crossfire

BOLT ACTION
Chain of Command
Disposable Heroes
Rules of Engagement
Rate of Fire
Nuts!
Arc of Fire
Victory Decision
Operation Squad

Rules partially viable with some basing changes?
Command Decision
Rapid Fire

This looks like a decent list to begin researching and doing some ordering. I own some of these rules already, so just need to pick up a few more … at least, the more readily accessible ones.

Thanks! Hopefully, this list will be useful to others as well.

Hi

I think Crossfire are also OOP ?

Good lot of OOP stuff often available on EBay (well the UK version)

Baaaaaa Baaaaaa :-)

There is us:-

link

They are only pdf. They are 1 to 1 but are for platoon to Company level.

Its a less gamey game and abouyt fire and maneover not overly wepons factor orientated. Load the free stuff for a look.

BOLT ACTION
Chain of Command
Disposable Heroes
Rules of Engagement
Rate of Fire
Nuts!
Arc of Fire
Victory Decision
Operation Squad

Operation Squad is a squad level game. For platoon level we have Assault Platoon that use the same mechanics…

link

Bye
Valentino

Yes, Crossfire is definitely available again.

Robert

At our club we have used out FoW based figures as is to play
Blitzkrieg Commander (and theoretically CWC I guess and FWC as archaic forces) but BKC is the WWII variant
Crossfire
PBI

All have worked well – BKC was the least popular of the three. Crossfire and PBI each have their own adherents within the club with a reasonable crossover.