"Turkish tanks face ISIL near Syria border " Topic

"Turkish tanks have been sent to hills overlooking the Syrian border town of Ain al-Arab besieged by ISIL, while a US-led coalition intensified its bombing of the group in northern and eastern Syria.

Their deployment of Monday came after ISIL fired shells near a refugee camp on Turkish soil. At least 15 tanks were positioned, some with their guns pointing towards Syrian territory.

Al Jazeera's Stefanie Dekker, reporting from the Turkish border town of Suruc, said that three shells fell in Turkey, "very close to a refugee camp, security forces and a number of protesters who had gathered to express anger at what they say was limited support provided to Kuridsh fighters battling ISIL"…"
Full article here
link

Amicalement
Armand

Some Turkish/ISIL scenarios would certainly be something fresh on the wargames table.

Looks like Daesh is about to over run Kobani, that border town in Syria. They tried to take last week. That being said, I'd think a Turk and/or Saudi force going after Daesh would be an interesting game … And even more interesting in reality … What MBTs/AFVs are the Turks using now ? US M48s, M60s, M113s, etc. ?

In the photo it looks like M60A3s with German style smoke grenade launchers.

Damon.

Main Turkish tank is M60 in a whole heap of different variants including indigenous mods.

Leopard 1 and 2s also serve in considerable numbers.

M48s appear to be kept in reserve.

IFV are mainly orientated around M113 based AIFV series.

The administration in Kobane believes the Turks have their own agenda:

link

No surprises. Erdogan is pushing this whole situation to benefit his Islamicisation of Turkey and reestablishment of Turkey as an Islamic power (a real pivot to East),

The War Against The Islamic State Is Expanding With Turkey And Iran Preparing To Become Involved

"U.S. warplanes attacked Islamic State targets in Syria overnight, in raids that a group monitoring the war said killed civilians as well as jihadist fighters.

The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said the strikes hit mills and grain storage areas in the northern Syrian town of Manbij, in an area controlled by Islamic State, killing at least two civilian workers.

Strikes on a building on a road leading out of the town also killed a number of Islamic State fighters, said Rami Abdulrahman, who runs the Observatory which gathers information from sources in Syria…"
Full article here
link

Amicalement
Armand

That was quick! I called my representative a few days ago to tell them to tell the Turks to police their border.

"The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said the strikes hit mills and grain storage areas in the northern Syrian town of Manbij, in an area controlled by Islamic State, killing at least two civilian workers."

That organisation is just one bloke in a house in the Midlands (UK). I wonder how much $$$$ he is making. He gets quoted quite often.

Decades ago I saw an article in a military procurement magazine which stated the Turks were looking for 1,000 MBT. They must have a huge army.

They must have a huge army.

Well trained, well maintained and effective, from what I hear. In spite of all differences, the Izzies just completed a contract to upgrade a big batch of Turkish M-60s. The Turkish army is partly committed in Northern Cyprus and keeps a close eye on all the borders: Russian, Greek and Iraqi are none very friendly. But they have a strategic maneuver force they can use if they want to.

It will be verrrry interestink if the Turks blitz through Syria and wind up on the Israeli border.

The Turks have the 2d largest army in NATO behind the US. From my reseach:

At present, the primary main battle tanks of the Turkish Army are the Leopard 2A4 and the M60T. There are also around 400 Leopard 1 and 750 M60 Patton variants in service (excluding the M60T which were upgraded with the 120 mm MG253 guns), but the Turkish Army retains a large number of older vehicles. More than 2,800 M48 Pattons are still in service (upgraded with the 105 mm M68 guns) though only around 1,300 of these are stored as reserve MBTs, while the rest are mostly transformed into other types of military vehicles (such as cranes, MBT recovery vehicles and logistical support vehicles) or used as spare parts resources.

Turkey plans to build a total of 1,000 new Otokar Altay MBTs, in four separate batches of 250 units, with the MİTÜP Turkish National Tank Project. The tanks will be produced by the Turkish firm Otokar, and share some of the systems that are used in the K2 Black Panther main battle tank of South Korea.

So yes, they have numbers to combat Daesh, if they'd like to. But it appears, they value their islamic roots more than being allies to the West. Or to assist their moslem brothers in Iraq. IIRC, the Turks are primarily Sunni where the Iraqis are around 60% Shia'. The Turks seem to have their own agenda … Like everyone else involved in or in the region of the Daesh threat … And just to add, IIRC, didn't the Saudis recently purchase some 450 Leo A4s ? And before one of the local "military experts" chimes in to remind me/us about combined arms forces and Infantry being more useful than AFVs in COIN ops, etc. … I'm well aware of all that. I was using AFVs as an example. As we all know all armies have more Grunts/Gropos than Treadheads … Been there … done that … got the T-shirt …

Spain is using 6-wheeled IFVs/Scout vehicles on a peninsula in North Africa, where apparently they are very worried about ISIS taking a ferry ride across the sea into Spain.

Apparently, they arrested a Jihadi with links to ISIS recently there, amidst tons of refugees trying to flee the conflict in Syria/Middle East/Africa.

And just to add, IIRC, didn't the Saudis recently purchase some 450 Leo A4s ?

Leopard 2 purchase seems to be close to cancellation due to political opposition in Germany.

Saudis do have a huge military:

- Personnel numbers are more than UK

- About 800 tanks including 300 M1, 400 M60 and 100+ AMX30

- Massive aiforces – About 300 F-15/Tornado/Eurofighter with additional Eurofighters (c.50) and F-15s (84) on order, dozens of AH-64A/D/E and force multipliers ala E-3 AWACS, KE-3 tankers and large tactical transport fleet centred on C-130.

Thanks for the update Thomas … in the long run, it does not appear to matter. Since the Saudis seems to generally want to stay out of the fight on the ground with Daesh … I also saw today on CNN. The Turks have positioned M60 MBTs, M113 with ACAV turrets along the Turk – Syrian border. And saw the Turks patrolling in what look like French VABs also … Yes the Saudis do have a big army. Certainly one of the largest in the region. The Turks beside having the 2nd largests NATO Army, they have the 6th largest on the planet … But again, if neither gets involved …

It will be verrrry interestink if the Turks blitz through Syria and wind up on the Israeli border.

Yeah, in the Chinese sense of the word.

Though I suspect that the Turks would have very clear instructions to stop well short of the Israeli border, and/or an agreement like the Israelis have with Egypt: If we're in hot pursuit of militants, we'll run them to ground and then leave as quickly and safely as possible, and you get equal hot pursuit right going our direction.

It's apparently dramatically reduced the amount of troublemakers outside Gaza on the Israeli-Egyptian border.