"Fusilier Sergeant Major" Topic

Does anyone know if high ranking fusilier NCO's ever wore epaulettes instead of shoulder straps??

Which army are you interested in? Who knows the answer to British uniforms, after Thursday's referendum, if Scotland goes it alone?

Oh, Sorry. French Line Infantry.

I just looked into the Cent Jours site for the 100 days campaign – in French – and they show two sergeant majors with muskets flanking the tricolor bearer. They have no brush epaulettes – just blue shoulder flap edged scarlet – and two gold stripes on each sleeve, edged scarlet. They carried short swords and bayonets.

I can't find anything for earlier periods. Perhaps another contributor?

GdeP

Assuming we are talking about plain regular line infantry, following the regulations, then the only non-commissioned fusilier epaulette wearers were ….

…. adjudants sous-officiers (2 par bataillon) : on the left shoulder an epaulette and on the right a contre-epaulette (i.e., an epaulette without fringes), the field of red silk with 2 thin galons of gold running lengthwise (I.e., from the button at the neck toward the arm), the fringe thin like junior officers and made of a 50/50 mix of red wool and gold metal, the base (underside) of red felted wool.

…. from 1809, the gardes-aigle (2e porte-aigle & 3e porte-aigle) have epaulettes with yellow brass scales on the upper side and red wool fringes, again on a red felted wool base – in addition to their normal sleeve chevrons per their grade.

Side-note : for the légère, the same but with silver metalwork

- Sasha

"…. adjudants sous-officiers (2 par bataillon) : on the left shoulder an epaulette and on the right a contre-epaulette (i.e., an epaulette without fringes), the field of red silk with 2 thin galons of gold running lengthwise (I.e., from the button at the neck toward the arm), the fringe thin like junior officers and made of a 50/50 mix of red wool and gold metal, the base (underside) of red felted wool."

From what time period, I was under the impression that it was one Adjudant Sous officier per battalion who commanded the left wing of a battalion

As I understand it, the adjutant Sous-officier was part of the battalion command. If you are talking about the fusilier companies then the senior NCOs in the companies (sergeant-major downwards) would have worn the plain blue epaulette piped red of the rest of the rank and file.

you mean the shoulder strap

Is there a difference? I thought an epaulette was just a shoulder strap. It may be fringed as in flankers and occifers, but even without it is still an epaulette (I think……..hesitate to contradict the expert mind you!)

von Winterfeldt,

Actually, the "2 par bataillon" was from just now looking at the organization of the young guard in 1815 to answer a different question. It as indeed one per battalion in army units. Sorry.

As far as I know, the "commanded the left wing" was the officier adjudant-major (almost always a capitaine). The adjudant-sous-officier (I think called also "aide-major" during the Revolution) did have some rôle in organizing movement and evolutions but I would have to look it up. His primary rôle was to act as the senior NCO of the battalion and provide supervision, essentially administrative supervision, to all the duties of the other NCO's.

And yes, they were attached to the regimental état-major. But they formed with the battalions. So, while not exactly "fusilier" NCO's , they were not too different and …. they *did* have epaulettes.
:-)

By the way, in the French Colonial/Marine service and in the Légion, the adjudants have these semi-officer distinctions in modern times. I do not know about the Armée itself. When I first saw them, I mistook them for senior "technical" specialists, like American warrant officers. Not exactly correct, and a little embarrassing for me.

- Sasha

Throughout the Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars, the adjudant-major (an officer) supervised the right wing, the adjudant (= adjudant sous-officer) supervised the left wing:

link

Commands were given only be the chef de bataillon and the chefs de peloton.

Oli

Thanks, Guys. I think the simple shoulder strap is the way to go for fusilier NCOs

Regards,

John

yes supervising is the right word, still on a feu de demi batailon – who would give the command?
I find it quite interesting that an NCO is on the supervision on the left demi bataillon while the Adjutant is doing that for the right demi bataillon.
As for the epaulettes – I also was under the impression that both had fringes at least up to Bardin regulations for the Adjutant sous officier.
Yes – his uniform was very officer like, carried a hat, a officer sabre or sword without officers port – epée, did wear boots and a stick, in light infantry – a coat with long coat tails as for officers.

The feu de demi-bataillon will be commanded by the chef de bataillon, alternatively for the right and left wing:

link

Oliver & Hans-Karl,

There is an American idiom "to know just enough of something to be dangerous". The implication is that the person has some knowledge, be not perfect mastery of the topic and could make mistakes.

Thanks for the help, dear Colleagues!
:-)

- Sasha