"Can we have a "Victorian Colonial" or "Imperialism" Board?" Topic

Like I said in the surprisingly quickly acted on request for a War of 1812 Board, if a period or war has a dedicated Board, many more threads or topics are started on it.
Also, formally, if the suggestion makes it to an actual Poll, it takes 40 to state that they will "support" such a Board. "Support" is left vague, perhaps intentionally, but I take it to mean that you will start, contribute to or read these topics. Whatever.

It has been suggested that we need a "Colonial" Board. I think we do, but that title is rather vague. I think that either "Victorian Colonial" or "Imperialism" would fit the need for a Board dedicated to the European land grab of defenseless third world… Well, you know what I mean.
The period 1837-1901 covers a lot of colonial conquest and small wars.

I should also like to say that I think that the board for The Sword and the Flame should NOT be simply subsumed into this. They are two different things. TSATF is a rules set. Victorian Colonialism or Imperialism is a historical period. Crosspost if you like, but they should be different Boards. IMNSHO.

I don't care what the Board is called. I would support either name. But I do think we need a separate Board.

Would you "support" such a Board?

And if you want to have a Mexican Wars Board, I would support that, but this thread is about Victorian Colonial or Imperialism. Start your own Poll suggestion for that.

I think an Imperialism Board would cover the Mex-Am War and Maximilian in Mexico, don't you?

Yes, I would support such a board.

Yes, of course. I'm very interested in these wars. The Schleswig-Holstein issue, much less so.

I would like it
Clif

I support it.

Amicalement
Armand

Enthusiastic support from me!!!

Yes. "19th Century" seems far too vague to me, and 'Colonialism / Imperialism' laps into the early 20th Century in any case: Boer War, French Foreign Legion etc.

I like "Victorian Colonial" but I'll support the board regardless of the name.

Sure, why not.

Wouldn't an Imperialism Board start to take over the rest of TMP? I mean, it's in its nature.

Yes

Do we cover the Plains Wars and the Mexican American war here as well then? :)

More support.

Sigh how has the plains wars ever been classed as Victorian colonialism?

Its wars of European colonialism, always has been in wargames terms.

As Winston Smith supported my desire for a War of 1812 board, so shall I support his for a Victorian Colonial board…

Aye!

Eric

I will support it John OFM but I think the date parameter is a bit narrow start date is good but it should stretch East to late 1930s at least,Imperialism and Victorian conquests did continue long after a few Republics of Europe came into being and Her Majestys' passin Gawd Bless er.
Just saying it brings in a lot more fun to the 'period' board.
What say you Sir?
Cheers all

I'm surprised there isn't one already.

The reason we (humanity, not us gamers specifically)had The Great War, sometimes known as World War I, was to officially end the period known to gamers as "The Colonial Period". The Great War was also brought about because so many fun loving native peoples would not let go of the Victorian era, despite the good Queen's death. So clearly, the Victorian/Colonial Board, or whatever name it might take should specifically end sometime after 1901, and prior to The Great War.

Unless you want to consider that many of the colonial powers were lead by political and military men who were the product of, and perpetuated the philosophy of the Victorian era (otherwise known as the Colonial Period to most gamers) (that would be historical gamers and some other gamers yet to be classified/labeled/identified). Considering this, maybe we (gamers, not that portion of humanity that brought about The Great War)should include the 1930s and maybe World War II as well.

You know, the French were squabbling over colonies in far East Asia (less far to those living particularly east) well into the 1950s, so maybe we should extend the Victorian era up to about 1960ish.

And Africa well into the 1970s.

Is Crimea a colony now?

Okay, I'm done.

I would support such a board too. I suspect there are many more Colonial players than those who game War of 1812, for example.

As to what time period it covers then I think some flexibility is needed. Post WW1 actions by the British in Waziristan are definitely more "colonial" in nature than "interwar", for example. So I think we don't need the "Victorian" prefix even though I understand what you are getting at.

Yeah, I would support it. How 1812 got a board before Colonials is mystifying.

Thanks,

John

I would support separate boards no matter the name but based on the content of colonialism and or imperialism. The dates and names can be some what flexible depending on content and intent. I do how ever strongly believe that the current TSATF board should not be incorporated into any other boards and should stay its own entity for various reasons.
Cheers,
JB

yes

I'm on board.

Through 1914 please. Inter-war colonialism can stay on the inter-war boards…

I see no need to "bicker" about time limits. It will mean what we want it to mean.

As for why the War of 1812 got it before Colonialism (or whatever name it goes by), my dear friend Winston asked, expecting a long drawn out process. Someone wondered on a separate thread why there was no such Board, and Winston started the thread.
Dear Editor in Chief was in a good mode, and noticed the swell of support.
Hopefully the same thing will happen here, and I would not be averse to a Poll seeking support.
I would not mind separate Polls to first set up the Board, and then choose a name. Time restraints? Colonial gaming is more of an attitude then about any time limit. French in Indochina in 1948 might be a bit of a stretch, though.
If we do get it, posters should not feel bound by any restrictions. If you think the 3rd Afghan War in 1919 belongs in Imperialism rather than Inter War, by all means start a thread there. Or better yet, crosspost.
A +/-20 years would not be out of line. Or even 30 to include Shirley Temple documentaries.

If anyone wants a Board for Plains Wars, or Wars in Mexico, step up to the plate and do a Poll Suggestion like this one. I WOULD "support" such Boards, by the way, if it encourages more threads/topics/etc.
Or "Bismarckian Wars of Prussian Aggression" or "Some Damn Fool Thing in the Balkans" Boards too!

Enthusiastic Support!!!!!!!

"If anyone wants a Board for Plains Wars, or Wars in Mexico, step up to the plate and do a Poll Suggestion like this one"

Would they need separate boards? This proposed one would fit them just fine

"Need" is in the minds of the users. Run it up a flagpole (flagpoll?) and see who salutes it.
I would not clump the Mexican American War and the Zulu Wars together, although some might. Both are on the far too generic 19th Century Boards right now. We have separated out both Napoleonics and American Civil War. I do not see further fragmentation as a bad thing.
YMMV.

I have also read of the Suez Crisis and the Falklands War being called "Imperial Wars". ;-)

I would support such a board as well.
I also think a "Some Damn Fool Thing in the Balkans" board is needed! :-D

sounds good, count me in please!!!

Count me as a yes vote!

Cannot be more favorably inclined to have a distinct (if still uncertainly named) board that covers the era of Imperialism/Colonization, arbitrarily say 1800-1913.

A helpful distinction between era might be to consider the period of land/colony GRABBING from that of land/colony CONSOLIDATION. By 1913, most of the available lands/peoples had already been grabbed up by the colonizing powers. Anything after that (3rd Afghan War, French Indochina, Suez Crisis of '56, France all over North West Africa today) is about keeping what they had, or keeping a hand in for "Old time's sake."

Maybe a bit inelegant, but perhaps calling the board something very like "Age of Colonialism/Imperialism" covers clearly enough?

In any event, I would enthusiastically support a poll or series of polls to set this up to the majority's satisfaction, and tomorrow is none too soon!

And, regarding the ultimate home of the TSATF Board, I would be willing to see it subsumed into the new board while keeping its separate identity, or remain very prominently independent, depending on the majority view, though I would never want it to be done away with.

My conjoined drachmae.

TVAG

Colonial Wars as a board woud need to be reined in a bit, otherwise too far reaching. Realistically, it would cover everything except the major conflicts over several hundred years! – From Spain in the Americas to modern day … well, whatever.Even during the major wars colonial conflicts went on – Japan v China during WW2 was more of a Colonial War in many ways, possibly so was Vietnam really. Colonial Wars could be big.

I am in support of a Colonial Gaming board, which should by definition include TSATF as a sub-board.

Several of the posters commenting on how long the Colonial period lasted have a pretty valid point.

I mean, the Third Anglo-Afghan War was in 1919, and the Second Sino-Japanese War was an acknowledged by the Japanese themselves as a war of colonialism.

The Spanish conquest of the New World was also pretty major colonialism, so as early as the 1500s…

In any case, I think that the 'Colonial Wars' board should cover up through China Station gunboats. I'm not sure where the starting point should be.

Personally, I prefer to operate on the Northwest Frontier, late 1800s and into the early 1900s. After the Lee-Enfield was deployed, for the most part, but I wouldn't turn down the old Martinis in English hands, either. If I go into the 1900s, I can get away with including one Charles Xavier Gordon on either the English or the Afghan side, depending.

Yes.

It goes without saying that we should have a new board, but perhaps it should be called "Needs More Imperialism"?

Although I really do believe the users would "self define" the period, I also believe that when we talk about colonial wars most would agree it's primarily about the expansion and maintenance of European imperialism with a dose of the USA in the Philippines.

"Age of Imperialism"?

I would support the creation of such a board which I suggest calling "Colonial Wars". I would also agree that it be "self-defining". I largely agree with Raylev3's definition although I might add the Plains Wars.

Yes 👍

I do have French Foreign Legion, Senegalese Tirailleurs and assorted Arabs, so yes.

I'm in. Just call it Colonial Wars. We know what that means, don't over elaborate.

John the OFM wisely said:

"I should also like to say that I think that the board for The Sword and the Flame should NOT be simply subsumed into this. They are two different things. TSATF is a rules set. Victorian Colonialism or Imperialism is a historical period. Crosspost if you like, but they should be different Boards. IMNSHO."

I couldn't agree more. TSATF includes many more periods than just British Colonial (which is all I had in mind in 1999). Let the board stand as is.

Larry Brom

(My first post to TMP since returning home from physical therapy rehab and now I'm going to take a nap before my afternoon PT session!)

As above, call it Colonial Wars or Colonialism.

Imperialism would require date brackets to seperate it from the Imperialism which has been going on for several thousand years and continues to do so.