kallman | 30 Aug 2014 11:29 a.m. PST |
Much of modern fantasy settings are derivative of J.R.R.Tolkien and Lord of the Rings which was derivative of a more or less European centric Medieval setting. Yes there have been books and such that used Asian and Middle Eastern influences as their background. But has anyone really done anything that was set earlier as in stone age or bronze age? I would think that would make for some interesting re-thinking of the fantasy tropes. Armor would be next to non existent, metal weapons would of course be truly rare if available at all. Supernatural/magical creatures would be almost like gods and of course so would wizards(shamans) be as powerful or more so? |
napthyme | 30 Aug 2014 12:06 p.m. PST |
The only thing that comes to mind are the Bran Mak Morn Howard stories for something closer to bronze age. |
Delta Vee | 30 Aug 2014 12:28 p.m. PST |
dark sun, is sort of ( the 2nd / 3rd ed version at least, the 4th ed not so much) |
Cyrus the Great | 30 Aug 2014 12:39 p.m. PST |
Armor would be next to non existent It depends on your setting. Furs or stiffened cloaks would offer protection against a slashing blow. Salt stiffened cotton armor as used by the Aztecs could offer protection against weak bows or slings as well as slashing blows. Shield or armor could be made of wood or woven cane strips. What about fantastic animals? Armor or shields made of dragon scale. Carved bone armor or lamellar armor made of bone, horn or horses hooves. Stone weapons provide concussive force. Wooden weapons with shark's teeth or bits of obsidian like macuahuitls require no metal at all. Slings, bows or javelins including the atlatl are all known and there could be magical weapons or poisons from flowers or herbs. This is just off the top of my head. |
kallman | 30 Aug 2014 12:44 p.m. PST |
Oh some nice ideas there Cyrus. |
The Gray Ghost | 30 Aug 2014 1:55 p.m. PST |
outside of a lost world setting I have only gone as far back as the Greeks |
PatrickWR | 30 Aug 2014 2:00 p.m. PST |
I'm guessing part of the reason you're having a hard time finding this sort of thing is because it contains little in the way of commonplace fantasy tropes, and is thus less appealing to traditional fantasy fans. |
GonerGonerGoner | 30 Aug 2014 2:09 p.m. PST |
Gloranthan RuneQuest is bronze age with Iron being a super material. The Dragon pass area is Greek/Barbarian, the South of Pamaltela is African/Australian tribal inspired, Prax Native American , the East Japan/China plus the unique takes on Elves, Dwarfs, trolls and all sorts of other non humans. Empire of the Petal Throne is very far away from D&D with a sort of Indian pantheist vibe to it. |
optional field | 30 Aug 2014 4:37 p.m. PST |
Dark Sun (for AD&D and originally published by TSR) has most of the qualities you're describing. Metal is know, but extremely rare and magically powerful beings rule many city states. Having said that Dark Sun also has a divergent views of many fantasy tropes. There are elves, and they do have pointy ears, very long lifespans, and they are graceful, but there the similarities end. Likewise there are no gods, and what clerics there (such as they are) simply commune with the elements themselves. Life is brutal, and cheap, in Dark Sun and the setting itself, reflects that not just in the typical way D&D does (PC death) but in every detail of daily life. No doubt in order to keep Dark Sun unique the world cannot be accessed by any form of travel from the other D&D settings. Obviously, that rule was no doubt broken many times by players, but it was rather integral to keeping the setting so atypical. |
Mardaddy | 30 Aug 2014 6:21 p.m. PST |
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saltflats1929 | 30 Aug 2014 7:38 p.m. PST |
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rvandusen | 30 Aug 2014 7:54 p.m. PST |
I've often considered non-traditional settings such as using the historical Late Bronze Age Mediterranean, but with fantasy elements added. Characters could be Mycenean, Egyptian, Hittite etc. Some wizards or priests would have extraordinary powers. There could be various monsters from mythological or artistic sources. Armor would be expensive and concentrated mainly in the hands of the elite. Social status would have to be rolled at the beginning and a character might be fated to be the servant or (possibly a runaway) slave of another, or a lowly shepherd armed with a sling, and so on. It would be interesting and fun, but ONLY if you have a group that can get into the spirit of such a world. |
Cyrus the Great | 30 Aug 2014 9:33 p.m. PST |
I think the real challenge would be coming up with novel fantasy races. They are either going to be humans with proto human civilizations or fantasy races that are, or remind us, of elves, dwarves, etc. |
Peachy rex | 30 Aug 2014 9:41 p.m. PST |
One of Turtledove's series is Bronze Age. |
boy wundyr x | 30 Aug 2014 9:59 p.m. PST |
Charles Saunders has a couple of series set in Africa, Imaro being the better known one, and Dossouye the other. There are a range of cultures in each, based for the most part on historical African cultures with fantasy elements (rhino riders, Cape Buffalo riders, Ice Age mammals). China and India alikes are there too. None of the cultures are up to high medieval Europe in terms of armour, and they range down to bronze. From Mr. Saunders work there's been an increase in African-based fantasy fiction by other authors in the last few years, but it's pretty hit and miss for quality (most is small press or self-published). |
willthepiper | 30 Aug 2014 11:17 p.m. PST |
I remember eons ago, there was a Dragon magazine article on setting up a stone-age D&D campaign. It would have been sometime in the '80s, about when 'Clan of the Cave Bear' was popular. The article had ideas on how how dwarves, elves, halflings and other non-human societies would have managed, clerics being mostly shamans, and how survival of the tribe would replace treasure hunts as the primary campaign motivation. No idea how you'd find that article today, unless someone has an archive of the old articles. |
Stronty Girl | 31 Aug 2014 4:44 a.m. PST |
Wargods of Aegyptus is fantasy Ancient Egypt, complete with races based on Horus the falcon-headed god, Anubis the jackal-headed god, etc. |
Huscarle | 31 Aug 2014 6:04 a.m. PST |
There was a DnD Ancient Egyptian setting called Hamunaptra. I used to run a DnD Hyksos fantasy campaign with the Hyksos being various non-humans and the Croc Games Aegytus figures for the various indigenous people like Sobeki, Basti, etc. I also picked up Necromancer Games "Mesopotamia" link and Green Ronin's "Testament: The Biblical Age" & their "Trojan Wars". link Atlas Games, "Nyambe: African Adventures" looks good. atlas-games.com/nyambe Don't forget the Epic of Gilgamesh |
kallman | 31 Aug 2014 6:10 a.m. PST |
Willthepiper, I was thinking of the old Dragon Magazine article when I posted this thread. Stronty, yea the Wargods is a bit of different take and I think pretty cool especially now that they have added the Greeks and Trojans into the mix. To be forthright the original reason for my posting is that while graduate school and work have taken up most of my time my webcomic has languished in limbo. However, ideas and stories continue to pop into my mind and I always keep a sketchbook handy to jot down ideas and drawings. Of late these stone age characters keep demanding to be drawn and when the muse speaks I have learned to listen to her. Ergo I am toying with creating an additional web comic that is a stone age setting. Originally I was thinking of doing something that was more of a light hearted Alley Oop kind of thing and the original sketches reflected this as the characters were simple in concept. Then I began to draw more of these and the images morphed into a more representational style and went from being light to serious. As I continued to work on these characters, even from the beginning, it centered around a particular extended family and one of the characters of note is the eldest son who just seems to be supernaturally strong,as in he will go toe to toe with a saber toothed tiger. Now this trope has its origins in many a mythic cycle-think of Samson or Hercules for example. Then the entire idea began to spiral out of control and suddenly I was thinking more epic than the struggle for survival motif that would be expected of such a sub-genre. Hence my query about examples as I want to be original but know that nothing is truly original, it is only how you present the concept that can be fresh. And yes it might make for a cool miniature war game as well. Kim P.S. If you are curious here is a link for my webcomic Nigel the Nosferatu. link |
Gone Fishing | 31 Aug 2014 8:08 a.m. PST |
You are probably already aware of it, but the world of Glorantha (Runequest) created by Greg Stafford is set in a bronze age world. In my opinion it can get far too detailed for its own good--much of it becomes quite ponderous--but it remains a fascinating creation. I actually don't like the whole concept of heroquesting (which is actually a major reservation, a little like skipping the whole Rings of Power bit in LOTR), but the different cultures, their religions (both the sublime and the horrible--the chaos cults are much better done than in Warhammer), and the Gloranthan bestiary (plantlike elves, machinelike dwarves, jack-o-bears, walktapi, the trolls) are all fantastic stuff. You might find it just what you are looking for. If you are interested I can provide some links when I have more time. |
The Gray Ghost | 31 Aug 2014 8:22 a.m. PST |
one of the things that has thwarted me is trying to find suitable figures outside of ancient Greece and Egypt |
altfritz | 31 Aug 2014 1:59 p.m. PST |
Gray Ghost: How so? (What scale are you looking for?) |
The Gray Ghost | 31 Aug 2014 3:41 p.m. PST |
28mm mostly your character classes and different races, orcs are pretty easy to come up with but bronze age elves and dwarves. |
Cyrus the Great | 31 Aug 2014 4:05 p.m. PST |
I think part of the solution is to re-imagine historical and fantasy figures in new ways. Different paint jobs, simple or complex green stuff conversions or maybe hiring a sculptor to produce figures from your designs. |
willthepiper | 01 Sep 2014 10:21 p.m. PST |
There are a couple of places to find 'wild' or 'feral' elves that do not seem to be from a Tolkein-inspired source. Alternative Armies has Celtic sidhe: link There's Maidenhead miniatures, but that's only if you want your army to consist entirely of naked cave-babe elves. Actually, that's just two. Hmm. Thought I was on to something… |
Coelacanth | 04 Sep 2014 7:53 a.m. PST |
Jean-Jacques Annaud's Quest for Fire seems like a good starting point for a prehistoric fantasy. First of all, there are three different species of human represented in the film: Homo Neanderthalensis – the party in the film are Neanderthals, who would likely be the default character type. Homo Sapiens – Modern humans, with a more advanced culture could take the place of elves in the setting (although actually being a younger race). Homo Erectus – More primitive humans, taking the place of orcs in a fantasy setting. Of course, it's just a start; to make it a proper fantasy setting, you would probably want to throw in shamanic magic, prehistoric fauna, etc. It sounds like an interesting project; keep us posted. Ron |