"New to 6mm Sci Fi" Topic

I'm just getting started in scifi. I'm thinking of starting a skirmish level game using hexes (It cuts down on so many measurement arguments). I want the game to be more infantry rather than Microarmor or Battletech. Those are great games, but I'd rather play something like Space Hulk where a small group of marines are getting overwhelmed by bugs and they call in mobile reinforcements. More like Vietnam where you have patrols, ambushes, and rapid insertion of mobile troops once the patrol runs into something bad.

I've got some old GW Eldar to try as one force. Simple infantry, dreadnoughts for support, light at guns, and jet bikes. I'm going to use old Falcons as dropships. The theory that I'm working under is that the Eldar are elite light mobile infantry. They've got the best tech, the best active and passive countermeasures, the fastest transportation, etc. In short, they're elusive, but they're light on heavy infantry or armor. They have to shoot and scoot.

The bad guys are low tech. I picked up some dropzone commander destroyers to use as very heavy infantry and I plan to fill in with DZC Scourge armor (mostly Hunters) and "bugs". Bugs at this point are some "Workers" from Dark Realm. I'm looking for more "aliens" to add. Not cat people, lizard people, snakes, barnyard animal people, etc. I going to use some aquarium sand and vegetation to create some odd and vibrant scifi terrain.

I have some GW Space Marines, but I hesitate to use them. I still detest those old landraiders and rhinos.

I'm thinking of going with CinC Solar Empire Marines or Microworld Foundationists. I wonder if someone who's seen them in person can compare them? I need standard 10-12 man armored infantry sections with SAW support. I plan to supplement them with some DZC PHR walkers, some recon buggies, and ground attack aircraft. Heavier than the Eldar, but less mobile as well. Enough different kinds of troops and scenarios to keep it fresh.

So, I need troops and rules (or I can write my own, I suppose). Any wisdom that you might pass on would be appreciated.

Fot rules try Dirtside link need modified for hexes but not difficult and affordable (free).

x42

I've got SEM and DRM among other 6mm Sci-fi like Exodus Wars, Onslaught, Microworld, TMG, GZG, GW/FW Epic, etc. … it's all good … and as I tell everyone who is interested in 6mm Sci-fi … Join the FREE Tactical Command site – link As I always tell guys here … if you were on Tac Cmd you have know about all the stuff you asked about already … If you have any questions about joining … just let me know on this thread … Also … those old SM Rhinos and L/Raiders, etc., you may be able to trade or sell those on Tac Cmd … before you even try eBay … And here's some of my SEM –

More pics – link

Adapt Net Epic (which you can get for free) to suit your needs. Net Epic simply is a modernized version of Space Marine/Epic from GW. To my knowledge it is the 6mm scale game with the most emphasis on infantry, and where infantry is relatively powerful vs AFVs.

Dirtside is a good game, but it is very much grounded in a near-future/hard sci-fi mindset. The action really is focused on AFVs from a combined arms perspective (AFVs, Artillery, AA, VTOLs, infantry, etc.) with infantry in itself being of limited effectiveness in combat, and mainly used to capture objectives in tight confines (cities) or to screen AFVs.

Wargames Emporium has some new rules coming out soon for the Command Horizon range which will be using hexes

Try Angel Barracks KR16 rules…….

angelbarracks.co.uk

Check out his blog and forum for more pics and examples of play etc……

Tac command is a great site! Just wish they would approve my sign up so I could post. Who knows maybe I smell bad or something! :)

If arguments about measuring are a problem, suggest you need new gamers not new rules.

Funny I never hear contractors arguing about measuring.

Crispy,

Yea, the arguments get tiring quickly. It's one of the big reasons I don't play DBX style games. Fortunately, the hexes remove any question about measurements, arc of fire, inside or outside blast areas, etc. It's really sped up play.

I checked out the TAC Command site. If I were to sum it up in a sentence it's "Screw You, Games Workshop!" (Not that there's anything wrong with that). It didn't seem to be supporting a rule set as a challenger to EPIC as much as finding proxies for for their products. Frankly, the undercurrent of seething GW hatred is fascinating considering EPIC is about 20 years old.

I found a French adaption of 40k for single EPIC figures called EPIC&Scarmouches. Is that pocket 40k or Adapt Net EPic?

Hi Joe:

I have two sets of rules I'm writing for SciFi. Email me off line and I'll send you drafts of the play test versions.

Set #1: Steel Crush. Hex based, focused on tanks (infantry aka tread meat more an afterhtought).

Set #2: Untitled set for small unit action. Infantry focused for maybe a platoon for player, plus a few vehicles. Running a game of this one on Spet 6 in Evanston IL if you're in town.

mark@scalecreep.com

John Da law … I'll let the webmaster know … any one else ?

Joe Rocket – I started playing Epic in '90 … so Epic is more than 20 years old. And went thru 4 iterations. Yes, there is a lot of distain for GW of Tac Cmd. However, you won't find a better place for finding model proxies for 6mm Sci-fi anywhere. And if you look around further, you'd see there are a number of other rules that have been vetted/aired, etc., on Tac Cmd. NetEpic being one of top choices. Also DRM's Seeds Of War, free from that site, Strike Legion, FWC, DSII, the 6mm version of The Crucible … to name a few … Exodus Wars is also making a rule set too … The new Command Horizen owners also are working on an updated/new rule set … All talked about on Tac Cmd … You may want to take another look … or not…

* Science Fiction Army Scale Wargame –
* Command Horizon
Development of the 6mm large scale action game now under the Wargames Emporium banner.

* EMP_Games

* Epic 40K
The place to discuss the third edition of Games Workshops Epic game.

* Subforum: Other Epic and Titan Games

* Epic Armageddon
Tactics, questions and ideas for Games Workshops newest Epic game.

* Subforums: EA Strategy, Tactics and Army Lists, EA Battle Reports, Epic Background

* Exodus Wars
Discussion and development for Exodus Wars in 6mm.

* Subforum: Fractured Empire

* Future War Commander
An extension of the Blitzkrieg Commander and Cold War Commander rules sets, which were themselves an extension of Warmaster, giving a science fiction set of rules designed to include miniatures for a variety of sources.

* NetEpic
For players of NetEpic, discuss the game and developments in here.

* Subforums: The EPICentre, NetEpic Platinum, NetEpic Core, NetEpic Army Lists, NetEpic Alternative Rules, NetEpic Battle Reports, NetEpic Background

* Polyversal
6mm Science Fiction gaming that crosses backgrounds. This is your chance to get involved and shape the game.

* Seeds of War
Discussion on the miniatures and mass combat rules set from Dark Realm Miniatures in 6mm.

* Strike Legion
Strike Legion, from Legionnaire Games, includes rules for electronic warfare, unit creation, fighters and more.

* General Science Fiction Wargames (10mm, 6mm and smaller)
Any army scale science fiction wargame or setting which does not have a dedicated section can be discussed here.

Yeah … you may be right Joe … there are no rules worth looking at on Tac Cmd …

@Extra Crispy: Is your offer of the rule sets open to others?

Sean

Sounds like you are of a similar mindset to me in terms of what you are looking for. In regards to comparing Microworld infantry to SEM, I have both and they match very well. In fact, I think some of both lines were made by the same sculptor. Both are excellent, and the two companies have good customer service.

In terms of rulesets, you might find one of the one written for multi-based 15mm a good fit. But there is very little out there written for hexes other than Ogre and mech combat games. Let us know what you end up using!

Set #1: Steel Crush. Hex based, focused on tanks (infantry aka tread meat more an afterhtought).

Being a former Infantryman I can truly say … those really are Sci-fi rules !

To my knowledge it is the 6mm scale game with the most emphasis on infantry, and where infantry is relatively powerful vs AFVs.

Epic:A is a bit Closer to reality, than E/Crisy's offering. And it is a pretty good combined arms game. Again, not like E/Crisy's tank-centric very much Sci-fi rules. After playing Wargames of all types for over 35 years [and over 10 years of serving in 4 Regular Army Infantry Bns in my youth and a grad of US ARMY Combined Arms School too !]. I've found many have problems handling/gaming with Infantry. As it is a bit more challenging and takes a bit more tactical savvy than things like OGREs, and Mechs/Titans/Combat Walkers/ie.: Very Large Targets … But it's just a game … so do what works for you not me …
But I might make fun you anyway …

@ Joe Rocket: Honestly, you could probably pick from a variety of 6mm rules sets. Most rules are relatively easy to mod from freeplay to hex based, simply by dividing all distances by the width of a hex and measuring all lines from the centre of each hex. But, you will want something which will highlight the variety in infantry units. Most combined arms games will classify infantry into about four or five general types as they are only one facet of the game, and this may be too limiting for a game with only grunts.

@ Legion 4: Thank again for the recon work, my friend!

@ John Da Law: My sincere apologies. I run TacCmd and we have had a high volume of attempted spam registrations for a while now. This has left a lot of genuine registrations caught up in the system. I did a quick check for your handle over there, but couldnt find it, so please just hit reply on the original registration confirmation email that the boards should have sent you and I will get your account approved. Alternatively, just drop me an email – webdude(a)tacticalwargames.net

@ Joe Rocket (again): I do take your point. A lot of the guys on the boards are passionate and die hard Epic fans. Personally, I dont like 40K as a game, but live the background that I have 'lived in' for two decades. So, the 'fringe games' are the only way to get that. And, most of us over there have lived through four editions of the game we love, all changing things for good and bad from the previous version, and most compromised in many ways for marketing purposes. We often relate to ourselves as the 'battered partners' in the GW relationship, and its an accurate depiction of our love-hate for the company.

The site isnt about challenging Epic in any way. Its about supporting the game and providing a focus for its community, and also a home for 6mm online – which is a horribly under-represented niche within a niche. Even before Epic was dropped (which really gave us no alternative but to look elsewhere) the community was enthusiastic about other miniature lines and home grown rules and stats. Expanding other games alongside Epic is something that I am encouraging in recent times.

Legion,

I have the same problem. Too much time in the field. I know just where I want the point, the flank guards, the platoon leader and weapons section in my column. None of what I know from experience makes sense in a gaming world where five guys with advanced communications technology have to be close enough to hold hands to be in command control. It's a little frustrating.

I was messing around tonight with some EPIC space elves. Infantry is smaller than I remember. Any suggestions for 10mm manufacturers?

I gently suggest Troublemaker Games.

We have both 10mm and 6mm ranges.

Some "space elf" type models in our 6mm range that might suit you (they're taller than 6mm, because elves should be tall…).

Cyber Legion,

My observation of what goes on at TAC Com wasn't a criticism, just an observation. I live in a work world where everything I touch, every form, gets evaluated and re engineered every five years. To have an intellectual property survive in its niche for over two decades is remarkable. For all it's shortcomings and the battered relationship between the producer and its customer base, I'm shocked that something else hasn't replaced it the way GW replaced TSR, Ral Partha, etc. TAC Com feels like the French Revolutionaries gathering to storm the Bastille. They're just waiting for and idea to replace the Ancien Regime.

Cybershadow – @ Legion 4: Thank again for the recon work, my friend!

Anytime ! Recon is my thing !

Joe Rocket 25 Aug 2014 11:58 p.m. PST
Legion,

I have the same problem. Too much time in the field. I know just where I want the point, the flank guards, the platoon leader and weapons section in my column. None of what I know from experience makes sense in a gaming world where five guys with advanced communications technology have to be close enough to hold hands to be in command control. It's a little frustrating.

I was messing around tonight with some EPIC space elves. Infantry is smaller than I remember. Any suggestions for 10mm manufacturers?

I hear ya bro ! One of the things that sold me on Epic in '90 with SM 1. My shoulder fired AT weapons could actually do what they were supposed to do > Kill Tanks ! In my real world Infantry units … Each of my Grunt Squads could pack an M47 MAW, and as many LAWs as I could load on my guys if need. Plus I had 2 M203s per Squad. And the M203 could fire HEDP rounds with could also penatrate thin armor. Not to mention all my M2 .50 cals, could chew up light armor like BMPs, etc. I don't know what universe E/Crispy is living in ?!? Too many games, again, like E/Crispy's, was not even close to accurate. No fun for a former Grunt like me ! Also, I could dismount and separate my APCs from my Grunts. They become separate units. Not like in SM2 where the PCs had to stay within 6cms of the dismounts. It don't happen that way. Also I could call-in off-board/CAS in SM1. Just like in real life. I could go on, but you get the point. Also, from Day 1, in '90 we added unit activation to Epic. Based on something I saw when I played Avalon Hill's Tobruk game long before. It took GW 4 iterations with Epic:A before they figured that out. The IGOUGO rules systems IMO are absolutely Stone Age/Primative/Feral. IMO many guys who write wargame rules, read about it, but never actual "Wargamed" for real. But again like with E/Crispy's rules, if it is fun and works for them … it's a good set of rules … It is for them … not me …

I was messing around tonight with some EPIC space elves

Joe … don't call'm Elves … they get real upset if you don't call'm Eldar ! Here's some of my "Eldar" I messed with … link

Troublemaker Games 26 Aug 2014 2:26 a.m. PST
I gently suggest Troublemaker Games.

I Highly Recommend TMG …

For all it's shortcomings and the battered relationship between the producer and its customer base, I'm shocked that something else hasn't replaced it the way GW replaced TSR, Ral Partha, etc. TAC Com feels like the French Revolutionaries gathering to storm the Bastille. They're just waiting for and idea to replace the Ancient Regime.

Yep, been there … did that … Here's what I always tell any gamer … Do what works for U … not me … We modified SM1 a bit to make it work for us … added stuff from SM2, E40K, etc., as it suited us. Based on all our gaming and real world experiences … We even played with a hybrid Epic/DS rules … Good system … but took too long to resolve combat, etc. … No one from GW is going to send a Commissar to come to your gaming table and "cleanse" your heretic ways. Do What Works For U … like Crispy's rules … they work for him and his crew … Or even … do I dare say, guys play 40K !?!?! As silly, over-the-top, etc., I think it is … I'm not going to stop them from playing, buying, etc., and drinking the GW … But as I said, being a former Grunt/ some times referred to as an Alpha Male … I'll make fun of ya !

Oh … before I forget …

I have some GW Space Marines, but I hesitate to use them. I still detest those old landraiders and rhinos.

The Rhinos remind me of my old "beloved" M113s …

Legion

Anyone who has ever been around a Javelin when it hits something will tell you infantry packs a punch. It's got a range of a mile, and it's self guiding (lock on before firing), and once it leaves the launcher, there's nothing you can do but hit the ground. About $80 USDK per round but that's nothing compared to the cost of one MBT.

Getting hit by something as small as a RPG isn't fun. I couldn't wait to get a football mouth guard in the mail after being in a vehicle that got hit by an IED. I didn't get hit by metal but the shock wave cleaned my clock. I was concussed, lying on the floor of the vehicle, and I nearly bit my tongue off.

107mm Rockets hitting your camp, also not a lot of joy. Unfortunately a twelve year old can fire those things. The funny thing is that you know they're on their way before they hit. You hear the outgoing counter battery before the first incoming round impacts. You don't shoot those thing, you lob them.

I read ya loud & clear bro ! And I wish I had Javelins, Joe !!! And as I said, some one who "has seen the elephant", can write or tech advise most guys who write wargame rules. Much better than some one who read about combat ops or saw a movie …

Legion

Civilian gamers think in the wrong scale. Instead of thinking in terms of mm, think weight. A hand grenade and a 50mm mortar round weight around two lbs. A 2 lb AT round weighs 2 lb. A midwar 6 lb (75 76mm) round weighs 6 lbs. A Russian 152mm round weighs 100 lbs and will go through one side of a tiger tank and out the other side. It produces around 5 lbs of fragments that move at 2000 ft/second. .1 lbs of fragments per meter is lethal. Important survival tip #1: Have a lot of respect for heavy artillery.

If you're a serious wargamer, get a hold of Superquicky II. It works on an HP calculator and you can quickly calculate the number of artillery rounds that you need to fire into a 100 yard area to achieve % casualties. It can also do the reverse. You put in the casualties you want and it will tell you the number of rounds you need to fire to achieve that casualty rate.

I got my Microworld samples today. Very nice.

Civilian gamers think in the wrong scale.
Important survival tip #1: Have a lot of respect for heavy artillery.

Yes, that among other things is the paradigm of civilain gamers vs. Vet Gamers. Most have never had held or fired an 81mm mortar round, etc. … Which is … well because they are civilains … As far as FA, that is why in real life you dig in, use camo, cover, and concealment, etc., as you and I know … Any game rules worth the paper it's printed on, includes those types of states of nature, as the Combined Arms School intructors called those factors … Which plays into one of my favorite GW Rants. Showing up on the battlefield in bright circus colored armor, AFVs, etc., just seems down right "goofy" based on everything you and I were trained and experienced. And yet some here and on Tac Cmd will argue the point ?! Regardless of tech levels … you don't want to do anything to make you stick out, be a target, etc. … But again, it appears many gamers like bright shiny things based on what you see in GW and GW-esque type models … so as I said, I will make fun of them … Often …

Microworld makes great stuff too ! Here is one of their Dino Riders I painted for my Eldar Exodites –

Note … no circus colors …