dsfrank | 26 Jul 2014 1:02 p.m. PST |
To be honest I'm a long time GW fanboy – even went so far as to work @ GW's US HQ in Baltimore from 91-97 – doing convention stuff & starting/running the now dead long dead Outrider Program. Have tons of WFB & 40k minis but no longer want to run the rat race of keeping up with the newest, coolest thing – so my conundrum is this…. what other rule set captures the feel of the coolness of the minis, is easy to learn, not fiddly, and most importantly – I will be able to find opponents or entice others to play? And…. GO! |
Coyotepunc and Hatshepsuut | 26 Jul 2014 1:06 p.m. PST |
It's that last bit that's the kicker… trying to sell people on non-40K rules. Vor: The Maelstrom was a great game, now sadly defunct, that had some nice custom force rules most of us used for our 40K stuff. Flying Lead from ganesha games can do a fair 40K approximation, but not as a company level, you probably would want more than a platoon equivalent per side. I have been out of the loop for a while now myself, and would be very interested in some other suggestions myself. |
Privateer4hire | 26 Jul 2014 1:24 p.m. PST |
40k 3rd edition. It has all army lists in the book. Folks can re-skin Tau to be Eldar (a largely Ranger force with sniper rifles nicely replicates Tau pulse shooting). Necrons can either be played using the WD rules for them originally or can be reskinned as Chaos Marines. It has the general turn sequence similarity and terms and it's 40k so possibly little easier to sell. It's easily found on ebay or local used bookstores and doesn't require codexes unless you agree to buy/use them. Doesn't have flyer rules unless you use the Vehicle Design Rules in a later WD (at least I think flyers were allowed in that expansion). |
CPBelt | 26 Jul 2014 1:28 p.m. PST |
Why not play an older version of the 40K and WHFB rules you like? Surely you can make friends with a bloke or two with the same POV and have fun? Now, if you are caught up in the tournament mentality, then only heaven can help you. ;-) |
Kmfisher | 26 Jul 2014 1:34 p.m. PST |
I've heard One Page 40k gives a pretty fun game and ticks off all the things on your list. link |
NOLA Chris | 26 Jul 2014 1:57 p.m. PST |
|
DyeHard | 26 Jul 2014 2:15 p.m. PST |
There is "TOYMALLET 40 CENTS" link Which read much better than 40K, although I have not actually played them. It is a parody rule set. And like Weird Al songs, parodies are often better than the original. But on a practical note, just freeze the rules at some point you thought they were playable. Chances are you still have all the books and can find others who recall when it was done that way. |
nvdoyle | 26 Jul 2014 3:09 p.m. PST |
Tomorrow's War for 40K, Pulp Alley for Necromunda/Inquisitor. They do 40K better than 40K. |
Ed the Two Hour Wargames guy | 26 Jul 2014 3:22 p.m. PST |
|
gamedad25 | 26 Jul 2014 3:46 p.m. PST |
+1 3rd ed. 40K. Star grunt II is a free download at shop.groundzerogames.co.uk/index Look under rules for three part pdf, plus counters. You would have to define your 40k units in Star Grunt terms. |
Ron W DuBray | 26 Jul 2014 3:59 p.m. PST |
2nd ed was good but RT was the best. all the rest are all about selling minis and ripping off players from their money. |
tmason | 26 Jul 2014 4:02 p.m. PST |
It does sound like an older version of 40k is your best solution as long as you can find some like minded opponents. Any other solution requires at least as much adaptation and persuasion. If you are interested to try star grunt, I have done some conversions for imperial forces and have outlines for converting all other armies. link But, star grunt is much fiddlier than 40k and you won't be playing with large forces as in 40k. Half a dozen squads or so is the practical limit for games to play in a couple of hours (although I do have some rules somewhere for larger games). Also, if you use my rules for space marine genetic enhancements, you won't need many of them. 5 terminators is a whole army! (just like in the novels and fluff) |
etotheipi | 26 Jul 2014 4:58 p.m. PST |
40K minis work in about any scifi genre. With Cadians, SM, Necrons and Eldar or Tau, you have the basic archetypes of the genre … troopers, power armour, evil robots, and aliens. Pretty much any scifi ruleset you want will work. I use tons of WH40K minis* to playtest my own games. ----- * Rather than complain about GW, I would like to praise them for their insightful business model that allows figures to become "worthless" to their owners so I can buy them for less than a buck a figure. |
DsGilbert | 26 Jul 2014 6:05 p.m. PST |
The challenge is to find opponents who will play without 40K rules. The people I have met seem to be pretty fanatical about playing the current editions. They spent a lot of money on the figures to fit the specific rules. |
Pictors Studio | 26 Jul 2014 6:28 p.m. PST |
We use 40K 3rd more or less when we play. |
MacrossMartin | 26 Jul 2014 8:33 p.m. PST |
+4 3rd Edition. That rulebook gave me more gaming enjoyment than anything else I've ever played. And it felt like a battle. (Well, within my rather limited ability to appreciate what a battle actually feels like..) |
Black Cavalier | 26 Jul 2014 8:51 p.m. PST |
In a smaller level, there is the In The Emperor's Name rules for skirmish/small unit games. It's similar in concept to Necromunda but has forces for all the rogue trader era figures including zoats. The newish In Her Majesty's Name VSF rules fromfor Osprey are based on them. |
ordinarybass | 26 Jul 2014 8:57 p.m. PST |
A few suggestions. All of the below (except the last) are free, so that might help you to convince your friends to play. They all have a vibe that feels 40k to me. Sci/Fantasy space opera with more close combat than you'd expect from the far future and just a tiny bit of goofyness. Shockforce/Warengine. Really captures the 40k feel to me with less rules but more tactical options However, it doesn't handle large vehicles very well, so it's more of a platoon v platoon ruleset. Still available via the yahoo group. Warpath 1.0 for Company size and above. Has more factions than the current 2.0 rules, but plays even faster. More abtract than 40k but has a similar feel. It's basically Kings of War "in Space". You could probably play an apocalpyse size game with this ruleset in not much more time than a regular game of 40k. In The Emperor's Name (stick with 2nd edition, despite being published on a shiny website, 3rd is not finished yet). 40k universe warband combat based on the FUBAR engine. Retinue lists already published for nearly every 40k faction and a nice campaign system. If I had to pick an edition, 3rd edition would probably be the one and having all the basic army lists in the main rulebook would definitely help get folks into the game. I have 2 copies of it. Maybe I should try and get a game in with some of my buddies. I tried 2nd a while back and it was just too much crunch. |
Midgetmanifesto | 26 Jul 2014 11:35 p.m. PST |
We had some fun in December playing kill team. It's small model counts and breaks apart units into more individuals. Felt a bit necromunda-ish if you took away the skills and campaign advancement. Not sure what's happening with the change of edition, but like has been pointed out above….just don't update. Smaller model counts and short games with familiar mechanics are usually an easy sell to people. Rules here: link My game writeup w pics here: link |
CPBelt | 27 Jul 2014 9:50 a.m. PST |
The people I have met seem to be pretty fanatical about playing the current editions. They spent a lot of money on the figures to fit the specific rules. Looks like GW's marketing team is doing their job really well. |
Puster | 27 Jul 2014 10:04 a.m. PST |
+1 on Tomorrows war. Finding out the ratings for the different factions is part of the fun, and the mechanics really support small mobile forces slugging it out with hordes. |
Sealion | 27 Jul 2014 10:32 a.m. PST |
We use our 40k minis for Tomorrow's War, too. We even use them for Infinity sometimes, but that only requires a few models compared to the usual 40k size/mini count. TW rules work well, and you can actually create units that match the 40k background(s) fairly well. Here are some Dark Eldar vs. Space Marines TW style. link |
BlackWidowPilot | 27 Jul 2014 11:52 a.m. PST |
|
dsfrank | 27 Jul 2014 12:10 p.m. PST |
Thanks all – but keep the suggestions coming I got rid of my copies of older (than 6th) editions of 40k (except Rogue Trader for nostalgia reasons) – not super interested in buying them back. I own both Tomorrow's War and ShockForce – leaning more towards ShockForce but I'm concerned that finding opponents may be an issue. I haven't quite wrapped my head around Tomorrow's War/Force on Force/Ambush Alley – after a few games the rationale of the dice mechanisms still elude me Don't know much about 5150 but would love to learn more as it seems like a reasonable contender – of course I could wait and see what the Mantic 'not 40k' game looks like – Warpath I think – any thought on Warpath? |
Norrins | 27 Jul 2014 2:03 p.m. PST |
I knocked up some 40K profiles for the original 5150. link Haven't used them for a while, so don't know how they fit into the latest version of 5150. |
GT3000 | 27 Jul 2014 2:04 p.m. PST |
Wait for the KS early next year. As it stands now, it's not very interesting but by all means go read the rules. They're free. One Page 40k gets my vote. Kill Team follows closely. |
Goose666 | 27 Jul 2014 2:15 p.m. PST |
I am going back to RT.. building up some small forces and getting back tot he games I enjoyed.. skirmishes with a slight Roleplay element to them. 40k is now tournament focussed miniature sales platform, where the ever increasing need to sell more miniatures now means, they are getting more and more outlandish and soon, they will reach the completely broken point. I know lots of players who happily play 6th and the latest and so good for them, but for me, its back in time I go. As for alternaitves.. tomorrows war does not work well for me.. too much like force on force and has the same reaction rules issues.. you wind up just playing the rules not the "mission".. 5015 etc.. not tried, but heard good things.. so one to look at. The other suggestions I cannot say.. But give old RT a go.. |
ordinarybass | 27 Jul 2014 8:46 p.m. PST |
I've only played Warpath 1.0 and as mentioned above, I like it quite a bit. I've read through 2.0 and it looks like alot of fun and scaled down slightly to a platoon or small company ruleset, where as 1.0 is pretty clearly meant for company and bigger. Warpath 1.0 has 8 or so force lists. 2.0 has 4 so far, but it's a good start and when the KS picks up you can bet there will be more. It's free and I'd give it a shot. I'd still give shockforce a go though. I don't think it'd be much harder to get your friends to give it a try than Warpath. |
Privateer4hire | 27 Jul 2014 8:58 p.m. PST |
Warpath 2.0 is more 40k friendly. It uses model removal to show casualties to a unit. It treats vehicle more like they were in 2nd ed 40k, too. |
Last Hussar | 28 Jul 2014 10:06 a.m. PST |
28mm a bit big for the look of it, though would make no difference to the game but Quadrent 13 from TFL – SF version of I Aint Been Shot Mum. |
Mithmee | 28 Jul 2014 5:47 p.m. PST |
they will reach the completely broken point. They have already reach that point with 7th Edition and the rulebook spamming. I agree about Tomorrow's War the reactions need to be tone down. Like to a unit only gets to react to one thing that is happening to them per turn. |
Turtle | 29 Jul 2014 10:08 a.m. PST |
I always thought that the best rules to rework into alternate 40k rules would be the old Starship Troopers rules. It has a few features that make it great for fast play, such as the way shooting works where you roll against a target or critical value I really don't think going with heavy rules like tomorrow's war as a base is a good idea. 40k was never supposed to be anything like a realistic shooter. Warpath, also works since it was designed to be a 40k clone, by a former 40k designer. |
chromedog | 05 Aug 2014 10:17 p.m. PST |
TW should play like FoF. It is, the SAME CORE RULES after all. I'd expect them to play somewhat the same way. I've yet to play a game of it where someone has done multiple reactions with the same unit – although we have discouraged certain persons from playing the game and breaking yet another one (we'd rather he not play and leave us a game we still like.) It's like complaining about WHFB and 40k sharing the same mechanics yet playing differently (40k is 4+ I win, and WHFB is "Double 6, winraxxor, I win".) |
Mike Target | 07 Aug 2014 4:13 a.m. PST |
Ive joined the playtest for Gates of Antares and it looks very promising: cant see a problem with using 40k miniatures for it, as thats what Im using for the playtesting! |
Stoss55 | 09 Aug 2014 10:54 p.m. PST |
deathsquadsgame.com it's a fan made, small skirmish mashup of the various editions. it's really only a handful of minis per side, and you can customize the crap out of those few guys. it's definitely worth a look, you just have to register on the forum to get to the download section. they've never sent me any emails after the first confirmation one. |
TheGaffer | 10 Sep 2014 9:03 p.m. PST |
Dr Who Miniatures Game for Squad / Platoon Level and a couple of light skinned vehicles / Trukks. That 12 to 30 figures per side. It's a hoot. |
sean68333 | 12 Sep 2014 9:29 a.m. PST |
+1 to In the Emperor's Name. I've played 2 games so far and I like the rules. It is intended for small groups of models, not whole armies, but I think it could work for that if you wanted. I've posted a review of my game on my blog. link |
TheRedEpic | 12 Sep 2014 6:35 p.m. PST |
Bolt Action Scifi. Very easy to modify Bolt action to anything. Alternating activation and vehicle combat. You can use lots of models with no problem. Simple, but fun, and you can use existing templates in bolt action to cover any models you have. |
Capt Flash | 12 Sep 2014 9:13 p.m. PST |
Lets not forget Fast and Dirty. Good set with extensive equipment, morale, and DIY rules. |