"Have you ever read the Declaration of Independence?" Topic
39 Posts
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Winston Smith | 03 Jul 2014 10:38 p.m. PST |
Not just the famous quotable parts. The whole bit including the bill of particulars against George III. He should be ashamed of himself!!!! |
Sundance | 03 Jul 2014 11:03 p.m. PST |
Some of the bill of particulars is a bit exaggerated and some of it is so esoteric that historians have a hard time identifying exactly what they're talking about, but he should still be ashamed of himself! |
COL Scott ret | 03 Jul 2014 11:17 p.m. PST |
Multiple times. I have also read it to my children and at church functions. After all that is what the original signers said we ought to do, they pledged their Lives, their Fortunes and sacred Honor, can I do less? |
Walter White | 03 Jul 2014 11:43 p.m. PST |
Thank you for the reminder. I shall read it again today. |
nevinsrip | 03 Jul 2014 11:55 p.m. PST |
Yes, many times. Everyone should. |
Flashman14 | 04 Jul 2014 2:51 a.m. PST |
Why is this in Utter Drivel? |
Ottoathome | 04 Jul 2014 3:17 a.m. PST |
Dear Flashman 14 Because as I understand the rules, any sort of political leaning, like love of country and honoring our fathers comes under the blue fez. It would be especially invidious in this day and age to read the Declaration of Independence and see how many of the more wilder infractions of George III are recognizeable to us today. |
Herkybird | 04 Jul 2014 3:48 a.m. PST |
It should be read in the light of the Geopolitics of the time, and also with the understanding that it was written by the most ardent believers in independance. You got your independance, enjoy! |
Florida Tory | 04 Jul 2014 4:45 a.m. PST |
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Nashville | 04 Jul 2014 5:11 a.m. PST |
Finest legal document ever written by an American lawyer. |
ACWBill | 04 Jul 2014 5:39 a.m. PST |
I've a copy in my hands right now. It has been many years since I have read the document. Seems appropriate to read it again today. Thanks for the reminder. |
goragrad | 04 Jul 2014 5:49 a.m. PST |
More than once. For some reason it is getting a lot of electrons these days. |
Bobgnar | 04 Jul 2014 6:34 a.m. PST |
IN CONGRESS, July 4, 1776. The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America, When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world. He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good. He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them. He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only. He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures. He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people. He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within. He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands. He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers. He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries. He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance. He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures. He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power. He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation: For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us: For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States: For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world: For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent: For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury: For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies: For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments: For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever. He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us. He has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people. He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation. He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands. He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions. In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people. Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our Brittish brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends. We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor. |
Royal Air Force | 04 Jul 2014 6:36 a.m. PST |
Read it aloud to my Boy Scout troop this morning at our camp flag raising |
FingerandToeGlenn | 04 Jul 2014 6:52 a.m. PST |
When I taught GED Social Studies, my students read both the Declaration and the Constitution. My family reads it every 4th. |
Caesar | 04 Jul 2014 8:23 a.m. PST |
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Rrobbyrobot | 04 Jul 2014 8:52 a.m. PST |
I've read it many times. Both as assigned in school and on my own. The latter as a reminder. It's a well written document. It is written with great clarity and states our purpose well. |
Jemima Fawr | 04 Jul 2014 9:41 a.m. PST |
They said that like it was a bad thing
;) |
David Manley | 04 Jul 2014 10:05 a.m. PST |
In many parts it reads like a description of contemporary politics :) |
Timotheous | 04 Jul 2014 10:16 a.m. PST |
I've made it my personal tradition to read it every ID since '99 or 2000. Somehow, I knew John the OFM would be one to bring up this topic; and I'm glad he did! |
Militia Pete | 04 Jul 2014 10:20 a.m. PST |
Yes. Priceless gripe letter! |
John the OFM | 04 Jul 2014 10:31 a.m. PST |
Why is this in Utter Drivel? Because it was late at night and Winston had been drinking. |
Rebelyell2006 | 04 Jul 2014 11:09 a.m. PST |
In many parts it reads like a description of contemporary politics :) I wish the internet could thoroughly convey how severe my eye rolling is at that statement. |
The Virtual Armchair General | 04 Jul 2014 11:17 a.m. PST |
Thank you, Bobgnar for posting the text here. Reading it again, I can feel again the thrill of cutting the bonds, standing up, and declaring "FREEDOM!" And thanks to you, too, for starting this thread, John! Uh
. I mean, "Winston." TVAG |
Winston Smith | 04 Jul 2014 11:42 a.m. PST |
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Winston Smith | 04 Jul 2014 11:44 a.m. PST |
Note that one of the grievances is GIII sending Hessians over. Shoot, they ate some of my favorite figures to paint. Aside from the white straps of course. |
John the Greater | 04 Jul 2014 11:45 a.m. PST |
He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance. Now it's my family that comes over to eat out my substance. |
Intrepide | 04 Jul 2014 3:28 p.m. PST |
I've read it many times. DHS would have droned those guys. |
Major General Stanley | 04 Jul 2014 4:29 p.m. PST |
It's treasonous venom. Burn it and repent! |
jgibbons | 04 Jul 2014 5:06 p.m. PST |
I have a framed copy hanging on my office wall at work
. An i periodically re-read it
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venezia sta affondando | 05 Jul 2014 10:02 a.m. PST |
You are celebrating your Independence Day and having a party. Good for you. The OP was probably intended light heartedly. However, the later inclusion of the Declaration got me reading the words up to the part - We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.-- and I think no, you are all overlooking something important, say something. Blue Fez terrority?
the Declaration of Independence affected Blacks in two significant ways distinct from other U.S. citizens: First, was the role slavery played in drafting the document; second, the Declaration contains an apparent promise of liberty and equality that was unfulfilled for African-Americans before the Civil War and only partially fulfilled after. In his original draft of the Declaration, Thomas Jefferson condemned King George II of England for supporting the slave trade and imposing it on Virginians. This provision has led to the myth that he attempted to attack slavery in the Declaration. Rather, Jefferson's attack focused on the slave trade. In his draft, he complained that the King had "waged cruel war against human nature itself, violating its most sacred rights of life and liberty" by continuing the African slave trade. Jefferson also condemned the King for encouraging slaves to enlist in the British army, "exciting those very people to rise in arms among us, and to purchase that liberty of which he has deprived them, by murdering the people on whom he also obtruded them: thus paying off former crimes committed against the LIBERTIES of one people, with crimes which he urges to commit against the LIVES of another." This was in reference to Lord Dunmore, the royal governor of Virginia. Congress deleted this section written by Thomas Jefferson. It is a fair assumption that Jefferson, the primary author of the Declaration never intended "equality" to extend to Blacks. Though writing the document, he owned more than 175 slaves. Many Englishmen read the Declaration and wondered, as did Samuel Johnson, "How is it the we hear the loudest yelps for liberty among the drivers of Negroes?" In 1863, the promise of liberty remained unfulfilled. In 1964, Congress passed and President Johnson signed legislation that outlawed segregation in schools, public places, and employment. President Johnson signed the bill and then allegedly put down his pen and said, "We have lost the South for a generation." The promise of liberty remained unfulfilled for decades, and, despite significant progress, many would argue that for most African-American it still is unfulfilled in the 21st century. The African American Desk Reference Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture Copyright 1999 The Stonesong Press Inc. and The New York Public Library, John Wiley & Sons, Inc. Pub. If you are reading the Declaration of Independence, as often as you say you are, aren't you thinking the same as me – as a document, as a Declaration, it fails to properly address a significant minority of the population and is rendered meaningless. I wouldn't have published it on this TMP post. link |
Rebelyell2006 | 05 Jul 2014 11:21 a.m. PST |
Well yeah, it's the 18th Century. White male property owners were the only people with the rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It is merely our modern culture that defines "all men" as literally all human beings. The nice thing about our government is that we create our laws and constitutions instead of basing it on the whims of a strongman, a person blessed with strong genetic ties to former rulers, or a religious leader. So while the right to vote and an inclusive definition of "men" were not in the original constitution, the voters (through elected congressional proxies) and the courts decided to change it. |
Last Hussar | 05 Jul 2014 12:03 p.m. PST |
TL:DR version We want protecting from natives, but aren't prepared to put up with the inconvenience of garrisoning or paying for troops. |
TNE2300 | 05 Jul 2014 10:16 p.m. PST |
I prefer to agree with Jefferson's biographer John Ferling the Declaration was "the majestic document that inspired both contemporaries and posterity" |
Muerto | 06 Jul 2014 7:49 a.m. PST |
Everyone should. If you mean that in the sense that everyone should read documents that underpin modern states, then yes, heartily agreed. It should be followed with version #2 of the ideas in that and the US constitution, enacted in 1901 – the Australian constitution – and then version #3 enacted after the war – the Italian, German and Japanese constitutions. Dry, but important, stuff (though the Italian one begins with a joke.) |
KTravlos | 06 Jul 2014 8:22 a.m. PST |
I read it out loud to my american govt classes once a semester. Than as so k them why no mention of Parliament in it , since it made all those decisions. Much fun ensues. |
KTravlos | 06 Jul 2014 8:31 a.m. PST |
Jefferson and many slave owners did believe slavery would go away and that it is bad.Half the compromises on the issue in the early period were possibe only on that ground.Ln Unfortunetly the cotton gin blew such a consesus to the air, and fed the rabid racist and pro-savery views that made the civil war in my opinion inevitable. Do not forget that many of the colonies permitted free africans who met the property criteria to vote. Only by the 1770s had the racist restrictions started arriving to the scene.Same for women.Independence did set that part back. |
KTravlos | 06 Jul 2014 8:35 a.m. PST |
Also the declaration wa primarily used to motivate reluctant colonial elites, pro-colonies MPs like Burke et al, and assure international monarchist audiances that the revolt was a political and not social revolution.Common sense was the pro-revolution case made to the colonial masses. A much mre radcal na and subversive docunent. |
Weasel | 10 Jul 2014 6:08 p.m. PST |
I'm a Scandinavian living in the US for a while. At my old job, I'd occasionally get questions about "What do Danish people do on Independence day?" Happened at Thanksgiving too. |
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