"The Legendary AC-47" Topic

"By the time the first Air Commandos arrived in South Vietnam in late 1961, Vietcong forces operating throughout the country had seized the initiative everywhere. In the process, they had demonstrated their contempt for South Vietnam's poorly trained and small air force by striking their targets even in broad daylight, contrary to traditional guerrilla tactics. Remote government outposts routinely fell to attacking Vietcong forces, as did outgunned pro-government villages whose elected officials frequently suffered follow on atrocities at the hands of their "liberators."

The government's widespread introduction in 1962 of reliable, two-way radios to these isolated outposts and villages provided a much improved Vietnamese Air Force (VNAF) response, albeit one still limited to daylight-only operations as the fledgling VNAF had no night attack capability. The Vietcong responded to this government tactic with a switch to night attacks, and the dismal rate of government losses soon resumed. Looking to the recently arrived Air Commandos for help, the VNAF soon learned the Farm Gate contingent also had no night attack capability.

What the Air Commandos did have, however, was a small number of C-47 and (later) C-123 tactical transports and a license to use their imagination. If the Air Commandos couldn't yet effectively defend hamlets under siege at night, they could at least use one of their transports to circle above a beleaguered outpost and drop illumination flares, exposing the attacking Vietcong to the defending troops. This was done, at first with 50,000-candlepower and later with three-million candlepower flares…"
From here
link

Hope you enjoy!.

Amicalement
Armand

Puff the magic dragon flies again!

The amount of fire a single AC47 could put down is just obscene, filling an entire football field with one bullet per square inch.

Thanks, Tango, that was a very good read and brought back memories of stories told to me as a boy by relatives and friends of my Dad returning from the war.

18th SOS flew AC-119's out of NKP when I was there. Once you've seen a gunship working at night, the sight never leaves you.

Neat find!

Rob

Happy you enjoyed it boys!.
And to bring good memories to you my friend Ragbones! (smile).

Amicalement
Armand

"The amount of fire a single AC47 could put down is just obscene, filling an entire football field with one bullet per square inch."

I don't think that's possible. A football field is, counting the end zones, 369' x 160'. 57,760 square feet.

That's 8,294,440 square inches.

A quick web search shows that the AC-47 carried 24,000 rounds of ammo. Source: link

It's an impressive system, to be sure, but I think the "every square inch" assertion is a bit off.

Agreed, ScottS. One per square foot is more accurate- I calculated it to be something like an 18-inch square. Still terrifying.

Yes, very impressive. The current AC-130 is truly amazing.

Thought the AC-47 was a cool idea. I still remember AC-130s night firing off in the distance. The sound of those miniguns, at Ranger Cp Rudder, Eglin AFB, FL …

"One per square foot is more accurate"

The equivalent of this; it couldn't actually fill a football field with a round per square foot. Certainly agree we wouldn't want to be on the receiving end.

So, given that the AC-47 is a fairly cheap, simple platform, why couldn't we use it in Afghanistan, as opposed to all these really expensive and overly complicated systems we use?

Because "fairly cheap, simple platform" translates to less money for the contractors and kickbacks for the politicos involved.

You could do it with any little light turboprop, a turreted FLIR, and fire-control servos. Wouldn't be too difficult, but see the above.

You do realize that the only thing that kept the various gunships alive in Vietnam was the cover of darkness, right?

Even the ultramodern AC-130U was shot down when one lingered past dawn over Iraq. 23+mm AA guns versus large, slow target results in a dead large, slow target.

You need something that can provide fire support day or night, it's not going to be cheap because of all the defenses and countermeasures needed to stay alive during the daytime.

Lt. Col. MacDonald had submitted a similar proposal back in 1942 (then a 1st Lt.) for mounting a .50 calibre machine gun to fire laterally for use against enemy submarines. Later, in 1945, he proposed mounting a bazooka in observation aircraft which would fire laterally on tanks and troops from a banked turn. He "proposed that a fixed machine gun mounted transversely in an aircraft flying a banked circle could keep (an enemy) under continuous fire if necessary." Once again, the proposals were shelved. In September 1961, MacDonald again sent in his proposal for a side-firing weapons system mounted in a light aircraft and "flying a banked circle, (could) keep the gun pointed continuously at a target." For the third time his proposal failed to arouse any interest from the brass.

They must have thought old MacDonald had a quack, quack, here and there. He was very determined to stick at it until he found the right weapon to deploy. In the end he had a very impressive legacy.

Even the ultramodern AC-130U was shot down when one lingered past dawn over Iraq. 23+mm AA guns versus large, slow target results in a dead large, slow target.

Have to use the right tool at the right time … in the case of AC-47s and AC-130s … air superiority and as importantly … darkness. My fav more modern AC-130 mission is in Afghanistan when a few hundred AQ/Taliban/Jihadists, etc. were held up in an old British fortress Qala-i-Jangi … 2 Spectres sent a bunch to Allah that night … link

Oh, by the by, the gunship shot down during the Gulf War was an AC-130H, and I read that they were refused permission to return to base, despite the rising sun.

With daylight, SOP was for the AC-130s to go home, and other forms of air support was to be brought in.