"Okay I was bored " Topic
10 Posts
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charles popp | 18 Apr 2014 10:49 a.m. PST |
As we usually go into the topic of who was better with the big names I thought maybe of dropping down a few ranks. Who was a better leader of men? Joshua Chamberlain or Richard"Dick" Winters. Way different era but both showed very good abilities to use small forces. Both non traditional officers. Both rose from a low rank to fairly prominent rank. They also both had defining actions that cemented them in American Military history. I give the edge slightly to Winters. |
Shagnasty | 18 Apr 2014 11:15 a.m. PST |
Chamberlain rose to Maj. Gen., Winters topped out at Major. The scale of war, of course, was vastly different. |
ScottWashburn | 18 Apr 2014 11:59 a.m. PST |
The nature of combat was so vastly different it's almost like comparing apples to oranges. In the Civil War, battles were rare and superior leadership usually involved just a handful of moments of supreme effort and courage. In WWII, it went on day after day, week after week. Did Harcourt Manor demand more of Winters than Little Round Top did of Chamberlain? How to measure? But after Gettysburg, Chamberlain didn't really see action again for months. While Winters saw action each day for weeks. (and honestly, as brave and tough as the paratroopers were, they at least got pulled out of combat from time to time. The poor GIs in the other divisions never got a break at all). So I'd just say that they were both superior commanders and darn brave men and leave it at that. |
ChrisBrantley | 18 Apr 2014 12:08 p.m. PST |
Per Wiki, "In all, Chamberlain served in 20 battles and numerous skirmishes, was cited for bravery four times, had six horses shot from under him, and was wounded six times." One of those wounds were so serious as to be thought mortal at the time. Not to knock Dick Winters..both were brilliant leaders. I give the edge to Chamberlain because for pretty much three years, he kept putting himself into the critical points of battle
regardless of rank or risk. Most of Easy Company's exploits occurred in the eight month period after D-Day, after which Winters role was focused on occupation and demobilization. In that sense, Chamberlain's leadership was tested more often and for amore sustained period. |
Toronto48 | 18 Apr 2014 12:21 p.m. PST |
It is interesting to note that both men owe much of their 'current' fame to mass media in the form of a movie and a TV series. Both men either wrote ( Chamberlain) or had written ( Winter) popular books that summarized their campaigns.With all due respect to both individuals it is not a fair comparison. Maj. Winters was an exceptional small unit commander who had the fortune of being featured in a popular book then TV series His actions and leadership while remarkable are no better then many of the countless acts of leadership and valor performed by his contemporaries in WW2 that have not had the "luck" of being in a book. Many of these won high decoration, for example the Medal of Honor, citing their actions and continued leadership. With the possible exception of the D-Day attack on the artillery position Maj. Winter's actions did not have any significant effect on how a campaign or battle was fought or lost. He was a small unit commander carrying out his assigned orders. Perhaps it was unfortunate that Maj Winters decided to leave the Army except for a short stint during the Korean War . Maybe he could have risen to command of larger forces with the opportunity to demonstrate his leadership at tat level as well. Maj Gen Chamberlain is also well known today by many due to popular media .I would argue that his leadership and personal bravery was displayed over a longer period of time and in a variety of circumstances. He served in 20 battles and numerous skirmishes, was cited for bravery four times, had six horses shot from under him, and was wounded six times His actions at Gettysburg and at Petersburg had important effects on those battles. His determination to continue to serve in spite of several wounds was an inspiration to those around him and for which he was recognized by both decorations and promotions. Even the enemy recognized him as an exceptional leader. Confederate Lt Gen John Gordon, in his own memoirs, called Chamberlain "one of the knightliest soldiers of the Federal Army." |
Herkybird | 18 Apr 2014 1:53 p.m. PST |
I don't mind, both men did very well! |
79thPA | 18 Apr 2014 2:46 p.m. PST |
Chamberlain with a Thompson SMG. |
Robert666 | 18 Apr 2014 3:11 p.m. PST |
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charles popp | 18 Apr 2014 4:22 p.m. PST |
Winters rose I believe to Lt Colonel. |
ArmymenRGreat | 18 Apr 2014 6:43 p.m. PST |
@Robert666 – He started with "Okay I was bored" and you came back with "Pointless question." I don't think your expectations were in line with the title. I vote for Chamberlain. |
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