"Choosing a scale: 6mm / 10mm or 1/72" Topic

I'm doing a club project (EIR and Celts to start with)for Hail Caesar and with a limited budget, I must decide between the most affordable options in scale.

I've boiled it down to a choice between 6mm (Baccus & Rapier), 10mm (Old Glory) and 1/72 scale.

I want the miniatures to be easy to transport and store, and look recognizable (I want the Auxilia to be recognizable from the Legion at a distance, and not just by the shield colour). Also, the unit frontages must be small enough so that the games will easily fit on a normal 180x120 table (playing in cm:s)

For 6mm I was thinking 48 minis per unit (approximately €4.50 EUR per unit from Baccus). as anything less might be defeating the point of 6mm – although just 24 per unit is of course very playable – but I'd rather do 'em larger and enable us to do bigger games by halving the units if needed.

For 10mm, approximately 30 minis per unit seems like it'd be about the same frontage.
The price is 100 minis for 14,4€, so about the same price.

Other 10mm suppliers are significantly less affordable, as are 15mm unfortunately – though the best in 15mm (Mirilton, Xyston) clearly are worth it in case money isn't a big issue.

As for 1/72, 16 models per base would suffice as per Hail Caesar rulebook, and the price per unit would be about 2.65€ (possibly ex. postage, don't remember ATM).

What would be your recommendation, TMP?

I prefer 3 mm (but not really on your list and not really available yet,) so I would say Baccus for the win.

I've switched to 10mm for massed battles, and I'm a big fan of Old Glory's 10mm minis. I started with their ACW range and enjoyed them so much I bought a bunch of Romans and plan to build my fantasy armies around OG minis.

1/72 (Caesar and italeri) for Celts… idk about Romans.

I have Celts in all those scales, and Caesar 1/72 is my favorite.

I painted up two 1/72 Punic Wars armies solely for use with my little gaming group and I was quite chuffed I used 1/72 . These days the quality of the plastic 1/72 is very good and the paint sticks just fine with a good undercoat beneath . The cost of the project did not break the bank and I was well pleased with the result once i had completed the two armies.The two armies get used for Hail Caesar and Command and Colours.
Send me your email address and i'll forward on some pictures if you like. cheers Tom

Cheers Tom, I'd like that, here's a disposable e-mail so that spam bots don't find my real one: zelekendel@yopmail.com

Heard so much conflicting stuff about 1/72s and painting that I decided it wouldn't be an issue and most of the flak stems from the 90s or even before that (Airfix!)

I have to say though, if this is how 6mm ancients look in actual play it might be worthwhile to pick a bigger scale (and why not at least 10mm if OG are the same price, after all one'd think you can get more detail in even a mediocre 10mm than a good 6mm)

I think you will find much of the negativity concerning 1/72 plastic figures comes from those that don't follow proper painting procedures. I have a ton of them and have had no problems. Wash, prime (I use Gesso), paint(acrylic), varnish and done. There are a lot of good plastics anymore and cost is not too prohibitive.

I've gone 1/72 and am quite happy--easy to figure out what is what, lots of selection and easier to paint as my eyes age, Kids "get" them more easily that hocks of smaller troops. The upside of 6mm is the massed look.

I like big figures, so I'd vote for 1/72. I've tried many times over the years to like 6mm figs but they are just too small for me.

The basing of those 6mm is a real problem I think – the gary and bare bases really kills it.

6mm is best with larger units I think. BUT

If doing Hail Caesar you could use 20x20mm bases packed tight (three ranks for formed troops), so a unit of 6 bases would be 72 figures.

Also: for tightly packed troops don't paint the whole figure – there's no real reason to. Paint the front of the front rank, the rear of the rear rank, the tops of everybody (head, shoulders, spears). Leave the rest primed black.

Doesn't work for skimishers butI've seen pahalnxes like this and you could never tell.

I think since I use polyuretanes for shading ("The miracle dip" and then a coat of varnish on top (oh, and I do of course prime them too), that 1/72s might not be a problem.

It's also a scale where I could prove to others that they work as well, and they're not a scale that people would refuse to play at "because they're too damn small"!

So, I think 1/72s seem like the safest bet with the best selection! Thanks for your help, but keep it coming!

I've done both sides in 4 scales (10mm, 15mm, 1/72 and 28mm) and I would go with 10mm Old Glory if I had to do it again. The main reason is the strips paint up very quickly and look great en masse. Easy to store too.

While I am a huge fan of 6mm for WWII and Napoleonics, I do my Ancients in 28 mm – given the scales you are looking at, I would go for 10mm

if you are doing celts and Romans than late Republican/Julius Caesar would be more appropriate opponents. Rapiers Hastatii figure will work for Caesar's legions.

Well, Celts as in Britons, and then Dacians – just doing miniatures for the two Warlord-released campaign books so far, then probably moving on to other interesting eras.

'Tis true, the Punic Wars would be quite interesting to do, but alas, the same Romans won't be usable there – well in 1/72s at least, in the smaller scales the temptation would probably be high – in which case doing them as republicans to start with would make more sense – since hamata works in all periods.

By the way, what's the approximate frontage per 1/72 warrior – say the Caesar Imperial Romans? It's always important to keep frontages under control so the games don't require a huge amount of space. I'm aiming for a maximum frontage of 100mm for a standard unit – could I squeeze in 8-9 models in there for Romans?

I also found out how cavalry becomes surprisingly more expensive in 1/72, and there's some difficulty in finding artillery etc.

Cavalry / artillery with 6 & 10mm is relatively cheap – and I can always try and mix Pendraken and OG, I hope, if I there's something I need from Pendraken that OG doesn't have. Choices, choices…

Only recently (end of 2013) fallen in love with 6mm and for massed battles, I wouldn't go back to a larger scale. link

To convert the 28mm scale rules to 6mm figures, we have agreed on the following basics:
All measurements changed from inches to centimetres.
Small units to have a width of 40mm (expanding to up to 80mm for open order skirmishers)
Regular sized units will have a width of 80mm
Large units will have a width of 160mm

To maintain an easily adaptable system, all my bases are 40mm wide, sabotted together for regular units – I don't use large units. Except for skirmishers who are based on two 40x20mm bases per unit, all other bases have a depth of 40mm. I have mainly pike phalanxes or irregular non-Greek contingents, on foot, both of who look better on deep bases, and either little wedges of heavy horse or scatters of irregular light horse, so again, the deeper bases allow for flavour. Other members of out group use shallower bases so a standard sized unit might be 80x30 or 80x20.

After a little experimenting we came up with the following rule of thumb regarding figure numbers per unit.
Skirmishers – 10 (small unit skirmishing)
Light infantry – 15 (small unit) or 30 (regular unit)
Medium infantry – 36-40 (regular unit)
Heavy infantry – 48 (regular unit)
Pikemen – 96 (or perhaps 84 plus officers and standards)
Light cavalry – 6 (small unit)
Medium cavalry – 16 (regular unit)
Heavy cavalry – 20 (regular unit)
Elephants – 2 plus four skirmishing escorts
Divisional commanders – 2 (based on a 1p coin)

My Ancients are all 1/72nd scale plastics, and very nice they are too. Cheap and light, although storage for pike phalanxes is a problem.

Personally I'd go for a more portable generic basing system (DBx) and use multiple bases for other related if required. Far more flexible than huge bases.

I would recommend 6mm. Baccus and Rapier both do great figures that work well together. Storage and transportation are much easier with small figures, even if you have thousands of 'em. That also applies to terrain and scenery of course!

The secret to making them look good on the table, as has already been mentioned, is basing. Have a look at the Baccus forum. There are a couple of threads there with photos of some amazing basing. I have also found that photos never do justice to 6mm figures, they always look better in the 'metal'.

6mm also allows people to do crazy things like the guys who put together the "rather large Towton project". They refought the Wars of the Roses battle of Towton with 18,000 figures! It looked more like a battle than anything I have seen in any other scale……

We think 6mm Baccus on large bases is the way forwards.

6mm Baccus (although Rapier also do good EIR) on big bases for the win.. they look great.

10mm is, I think, the smallest size to satisfy your criteria of recognisable units, fit the table size etc. They are easy to paint, look good in mass. As well as OG, you have Pendraken, Steve Barber and now Adler ranges.
I would avoid 1/72, but I have a thing about plastic figures and flaky paint-probably prejudice from painting Airfix in the '70s.

6mm would be (and in fact, is) my absolute first choice. Distant second choice would be 1/72 plastics.

Doug

I game solely in 28mm, and am considering moving up to 40mm or 54mm for smaller actions with ancients.

Having said that, were I just starting out, I'd likely go with the plastic 1/72 scale minis. Back when I started gaming in the 60's, all you had was Airfix and they weren't that good. However the new ones are light years ahead in detail and paintability.

If cost is an issue, though, consider the 28mm hard plastic minis. I have scads of them and am really hasppy with that.

I play Impetus & Saga, and use 120mm wide bases. I can get 12 infantry easily on them and if you use an 80mm depth, you have ample room for scenicing the bases, etc.

Best of luck regardless of your choice.

An alternative approach using 6mm:

TMP link

MH

I think your criteria was that things should be recognisable from a distance and not just by shield colour – that being the case, 1/72 sounds like the scale best suited to you.

I think your criteria was that things should be recognisable from a distance and not just by shield colour – that being the case, 1/72 sounds like the scale best suited to you.

Opinions differ, of course. I can distinguish light from heavy cavalry, cataphracts from heavies, pahalngites from hoplites, and so on in 6mm. Even where the figs for different types happen to be very similar, in 6mm (particular on larger scale bases) you have the option to distinguish types by formations.

Doug

Agreed with elsyrsyn. Horses for courses obviously, but the quality of Baccus (especially the newly released stuff) and Rapier figures means that you can easily tell the difference between different unit types. And, also seconding what he said above, massed basing of 6mm figures allows you to play around with formations which hopefully will be apparent in the shots below.

Agree with Normsmith, if you "want the Auxilia to be recognizable from the Legion at a distance, and not just by the shield colour" then of the options you mentioned 1/72 is the way to go.

I use 6mm myself though, I think it it looks the best for making the action look like a battle on a given table size. Scales better with terrain too IMHO.

Regards

10mm is the smallest you can go without either lapsing into cartoonist or being unable to discern any detail. I once played with 6mm Romans and it wasn't until halfway through the game I noticed they were all facing the wrong way! I would go 1 72…

Green Tiger,
You wouldnt be the first Roman commander to make that sort of mistake……….in real life lol
There's some very nice 6mm stuff out there so Id say that was a little harsh myself.
Personally as a maker/designer I've gone for 10mm scale for the ancients as gives me a bit more room for detail and animation which for Napoleonics isnt quite so important as the uniforms do a lot of the detail work.
Just finishing off the Ceasarian/Gaul range.
Personally Id look at the 6mm and 10 mm scales ( then again I would wouldnt I!

L