"Favored method of resolving close combat" Topic

In my quest to achieve the best rule set possible, I'm considering how to resolve close combat.

What is your preferred method? Please give a brief description rather than just listing the name of a rule set.

I prefer to still be alive after combat is resolved. :-)

Seriously though, I like the opposed die roll. Modifies are added to the roll and high roll wins.

I agree (to both of 45thDiv's posts!), I like the opposed die roll method.

Infinity uses a "blackjack" mechanic on a d20, where you need to roll UNDER your modified stat, but the higher roll wins and causes a wound roll. If you roll exactly the modified target number, that's a crit and the target automatically takes one wound, then rolls for any other effects your close combat weapon may have.

Tied numbers (no crit on either side) go to the model with the higher base stat. Crits on both sides go to the higher base stat.

And having friends in combat is a good thing, they give a +3 bonus to every Close Combat roll.

There are skills which grant you a first strike, a BIG bonus to your to-hit roll, or even completely counteract your opponent's Martial Arts skills.

A knife explicitly does Strength stat -2 damage, while a plain Close Combat weapon does Strength stat damage. There are several different types of Close Combat Weapon, with different damage effects (ammunition types).

Make it consistent. If rolling low is good for shooting, make it good for fighting, morale, etc.

I prefer higher rolls = better results.

Only one kind of dice throughout the system.

Opposed rolls for close combat. Continue the fight in the same turn until one side is down.

I like the opposed roll too.
If you roll double what the other guy rolls he's dead.
If you roll less than double but more than equal the other guy runs away wounded and you suffer minor injuries.
If you roll equal both suffer a minor injury and roll again.

Opposed die with modifiers all the way!

We role for a group in a single D20 for the attacker. The basic table accounts for the result based on tactical factors and the "damage done". The result is approximately a normal distribution so about 50% of the time you get the expected result and 5% you get a large variation and 5% a low variation. Speeds play and gives a reasonable result. Worst result is a near even fight as neither side will want to give in so troops may not be up to much on either side under such a situation. You should have a good idea of what result you want before even writing the rules for it.

Roll to hit based upon your HTH skill.
Hit = enemy model dead unless they save.

Both sides roll simultaneously.

Simple as.

Ask 10 people and get 11 opinions…

Roll to hit based upon your HTH skill.
Hit = enemy model dead unless they save.

Both sides roll simultaneously.

Simple as.

Trouble is, that means:
1)your hit roll is not affected by the opponents fighting ability, i.e. you can hit a master swordsman as easy as an untrained peasant
2) You will get a lot of combats where the two combatants kill each other.

I like opposed rolls. Modifiers based on ability (or you could use different dice types, eg a knight uses a d10 and a peasant uses a d4). Winner has a chance to kill / wound / stun the opponent, with weapon type and armour factored in at this stage.

That's right MM.
Quick simple and deadly.
I did miss the skill level of the troops though, which does make a slight difference.
To be avoided at all costs unless you outnumber the enemy and have better armour.
It is simple and it is abstract.
It is also how I like my HTH in sci-fi.

Any HTH (Historical, Fantasy, SF, VSF) should be fast and brutal but there also needs to be a (morale?) factor where troops rush forward and one or both sides decides, "Um, no…" and pulls away to avoid combat (with resultant penalties.)

Whereas ranged fire might vary results because of ROF, more deadly weapons, range advantages, tech, etc., HTH is pretty much HTH in all eras/genres.

Ask 10 people and get 11 opinions…

Sounds right as there's always one who changes their mind after seeing what others have said. That said high (modified) die wins is what I like. Guess you can call that opposing rolls.

Opposed rolls. Greater difference in numbers yields more deadly results: +1: pushed back. +2: disadvantaged. +3 hit, roll again to wound depending on armor/toughness.
Disadvantaged models suffer a penalty in the next round of combat.
Quick and visceral.

How about this:

-Roll a d6.
-Add your skill.
-Add a bonus for outnumbering (maybe +1 per, max of 2 additional on a human scale)
-Subtract enemy defenses (armor, reflexes, defended barrier, whatever).

Compare both 'primary' combatants' results. High roll wounds the lower.

For heroes, give multiple wounds; for rank and file, just one.

Send my royalties checks to…

Stack as many modifies as the game designer has built into the system to demonstrate your mastery of tactics/skill then add and opposed die roll to find out who is successful.

For me, the die roll is the fun part, but in the end, it is the available modifiers that decides whether the game designer and I have a similar view of what matters in any particular form of combat.

Opposed dice rolls with varying types of dice according to skill or advantage etc…. unarmed pleb with a d4 to a mashing power-suited maniac with a chainsaw on a d12…a very slim chance of surviving but its there….you could kill outright if you score three or more than your opponent, stun/wound on two more, force a retreat on 1 more or stay 'stuck in' on a draw….clumsy to describe but clean and abstract in practice.

I prefer playing cards, each opponent having a hand of cards and playing them and opponents countering them. For me personaly I think dice are too random for close combat, using playing cards give the palyer a bit more of a tactical input so there'sa bit more of an actual fight

Thanks for the input. All this has been very helpful. Much to reflect on.

Any additional opinions appreciated.

"And having friends in combat is a good thing…"

This is under-appreciated in many HTH systems.

As Recovered 1AO remarks, I think most HTH situations are actually resolved when one side decides *not* to fight and flees. You could make different, and probably equally convincing arguments that this is happening "inside" or "outside" the close combat section.

Infinity uses the same method as Pendragon – I never realised that. Never heard it referred to as the "Blackjack" method, either, but I can see why.

In Pendragon you have to suceed with your roll to gain a shield benefit if you happen to roll lower than your opponent. Armour always counts, but not shields.

In Pendragon the damage roll is more character dependant than weapon dependant. Great weapons might add a bonus but the character does the same base damage regardless of weapon.

As I think Howard Whitehouse says in one of his rulesets, a warrior uses a particular weapon because he is good a killing with it. If he likes to kill with an axe, that's what he uses. Another warrior might kill just as well with a sword. Is an axe or a sword "better" than the other? Or is one warrior better than the other? Riddick kills just fine with a tin cup! ;-)

I have to say that I quite like the opposed roll approach used in the melee exchange mechanic for Bushido. You have a dice pool and have to decide how many from the pool you are putting into attack and defence. Attacker normally tries to hit and wound first then the defender gets their go (if they survive).

bushido-thegame.com has the rules in pdf for free download so you can have a look see.

Any HTH (Historical, Fantasy, SF, VSF) should be fast and brutal but there also needs to be a (morale?) factor where troops rush forward and one or both sides decides, "Um, no…" and pulls away to avoid combat (with resultant penalties.)

Depends on your scale of game.

Infinity is 1:1 skirmish, and includes an Automatic Reaction order if the active model is executing an order within Line of Sight of the reactive model. The player gets to decide what the reaction will be (and it's usually SHOOT THEM!!!!).

But in a unit:unit game like Force on Force, I can see the logic for having a Morale Test in there.

That Bushido mechanic sounds interesting, but maybe better for an RPG than a miniatures game? Depends on the scale of the game, I suppose. Not a problem for ten figures to a side.

Same thoughts about the playing cards.

Personally, I like it simple and bloody. I also prefer one dice roll to resolve it. And, having it where both sides roll simultaneously helps prevent IGOUGO boredom for the 'inactive' player.

Its the zen of the dice for me. With units of 10 upwards you need to watch the time factor and keep things stream lined. Get the characters out of the way first. Though I play very few with "Super Human skills" etc.

Yet another vote for opposed die rolls. It's what I use in pretty much all my games.