"crowbarring star wars into flames of war rules" Topic

I'm going to put together some 15mm star wars-based armies to play using modified flames of war rules.

For the fow and star wars experts out there, how would you rate stormtroopers? Fearless veteran? Fearless trained?

Also, did the empire use non-stormtrooper ground troops?

I guess rebel troops could vary greatly in morale/quality.

Unskilled fearless, or incompetent fearless, based upon their shooting abilities, and loss to teddy bears on Endor, despite Obi Wan's comments to the contrary, in the first film (Episode 4).

Of course, I think the stormies really should be at least fearless veteran, but that wouldn't have made for a very good ending for our fearless, and intrepid, reluctant heroes.

Unfortunately for your thesis, Flames of War does not resolve shooting on the ballistic skill of the shooter. Thus, Stormtroopers cannot be accurately modeled.

Should Stormtrropers be given a Stormtrooper Move?

But to get back to your question, if there is a question about their ratings, you might want to consider the Italian or Romanian quality tolls.

Stormtroopers (as the classic naval troops in Ep IV)
Confident Trained, Assault Rifle 8" ROF 2 AP 2 (use the German "stormtrooper" movement.

Imperial Ground Troops (as the snow troopers in EpV+VI)
Confident Veteran, Rifle MG, 16" ROF 2 AP 2 (use the German ST move)

Republic Clone Troopers (as in Ep II and III)
Fearless Veteran, MG team, 16" ROF 3 AP2 (use the german ST move)

Jedi/sith Independent team, no small arms, tank assault 6, makes 2 skill rolls in close assault with rerolls, has 3+ "warrior save".

Use the Vietnam helicopter rules for the LAATs, and tank rules for armored vehicles.

Thoughts on the above:
The Stormtroopers grew out of the clone army of the Republic era. When first developed the clones were the cream of the crop. Hence the FV rating. As casualties mounted and the Kaminoans stopped growing clones, the skill level dropped off. By the time of the Rebellion the clones were all gone (Boba Fett being one of the last). The new STs were selected more for ideology than skill.

So, some thoughts on the other forces.

Battle Droid Fearless conscript rifle team
Super BD: Fearless Trained Assault Rifle team
Droideka: Fearless Veteran MG team with 2+ infantry save
Rebel Trooper: Confident Trained Assault Rifle team
Rebel Commando: Fearless Veteran Assault Rifle Team

And, now that I've thought about all that, it's made me want to paint up the TSF minis I got from a secret source. :)

The Stormtroopers don't seem to have much tactical skill nor practice seeking/making use of cover.

Fearless Conscript at best.

So, that makes Ewoks Confident Elites (assuming Imperial Ground troopers are Confident Vets)?

Seems to fit with the silliness of the movies.

Do try to use Flames of War terminology please.
"Confident Elite"?

I was actually thinking of inventing a category for that. :) You can either call them confident elite (making them a 5+ to hit), or you can give them a bonus to being concealed. Personally I'd go with the "elite" status because that's a skill rating and would also buff their close assault prowess. :) They'd pass skill checks on a 2+. Once the Ewoks got to close assault (not too hard since all of Endor would be concealing woods (no shooting beyond 6") the storm troopers would be toast.

I'd also give the Ewoks quality of quantity as well. No pinning without 10 hits. Combined with fearless that should usually see them into HTH combat.

They'd have no small arms value (sticks and bolas are so short that it's close assault) but would have some kind of support weapons (catapults) that could be used against lightly armored vehicles.

They'd also need to have a special ambushing fortification called "booby trap" to take on vehicles. (to represent the log traps and such they use on the AT-STs).

Now I want to write up Flames of Star Wars. Dangit.

Storm troopers seem perfectly competent at boarding the Tantive IV. Their "problems" seem to come when up against the heroes, or under orders to simply keep them bottled up. From that point of view, making them Fearless Trained or Veteran, Rebels can span the skill and morale ranges and the command teams (i.e Luke, Han and co) Fearless Veteran would accurately represent the "plot shields" that they had throughout the films.

I'd say the Ewoks should be a 6+ to hit, since they are small, too.

Have no idea on how FoW rates troops, but there WERE 'regular army' forces within the Empire, and the Navy had it's own troops as well for projecting force planetside. The Stormtroopers were technically a force unto themselves, like the SS.

-Will

I should have mentioned that I'm thinking in terms of the star wars expanded universe/novels, not just the schizophrenically good-bad movies.

Ewoks and jar jar will not be making an appearance.

btw Dan, why would you rate the ground troops (snow troopers) as better that the regular storm troopers?

Snowtroopers on Hoth were supposed to be a specialist unit within the stormtroopers. I'd have to go check my WEG stuff but I think they had better stats than base stormtroopers.

Does anyone have a link to an image of non-stormtrooper imperial ground troops?

My own response was getting far to geeky for my own good, so here's a link. Enjoy

link

Is there any other picture of Imperial Army troops than this one?

"Stormtroopers (as the classic naval troops in Ep IV)
Confident Trained, Assault Rifle 8" ROF 2 AP 2 (use the German "stormtrooper" movement.

Imperial Ground Troops (as the snow troopers in EpV+VI)
Confident Veteran, Rifle MG, 16" ROF 2 AP 2 (use the German ST move)

Republic Clone Troopers (as in Ep II and III)
Fearless Veteran, MG team, 16" ROF 3 AP2 (use the german ST move)

Jedi/sith Independent team, no small arms, tank assault 6, makes 2 skill rolls in close assault with rerolls, has 3+ "warrior save".

Use the Vietnam helicopter rules for the LAATs, and tank rules for armored vehicles.

Thoughts on the above:
The Stormtroopers grew out of the clone army of the Republic era. When first developed the clones were the cream of the crop. Hence the FV rating. As casualties mounted and the Kaminoans stopped growing clones, the skill level dropped off. By the time of the Rebellion the clones were all gone (Boba Fett being one of the last). The new STs were selected more for ideology than skill.

So, some thoughts on the other forces.

Battle Droid Fearless conscript rifle team
Super BD: Fearless Trained Assault Rifle team
Droideka: Fearless Veteran MG team with 2+ infantry save
Rebel Trooper: Confident Trained Assault Rifle team
Rebel Commando: Fearless Veteran Assault Rifle Team

And, now that I've thought about all that, it's made me want to paint up the TSF minis I got from a secret source. :)"

I would add that the Imperial Army (much larger organization that the Stormtroopers) would use the 8 Million Bayonets rule, would not have a Stormtrooper move (in fact, have no special abilties), and as for weapons Assault Rifle 8", ROF 2, AP 1.

YMMV.

what models do you intend on using for this?

this discussion has the old star wars juices flowing now….

I've thought about putting together some sort of Halo Wars based FOW game before… however it might just be easier to jump into drop zone commander…

I'd go with stormtroopers as fearless or reluctant conscripts, as befits their role as the faceless disposable minions of the Evil Empire.

Rebels, being a thinly veiled expy for western first world soldiers, will tend to be confident trained or veterans depending on their combat experience.

Essentially, nick the ratings from

link

with the Evil Empire playing the role of the USSR with hordes of terrible troops in their cheapo T-72s/TIE Fighters facing the Rebels as NATO in their M1s and Challenger tanks/X-Wings.