"New kit ideas for 1/72 - 20 mm?" Topic

What quick build kits do you think Armourfast, PSC, and other companies should sell?

My suggestions would be the M18 Hellcat, Matilda II, M7 Priest, PaK 40, British Crusaders!

MU

Humber LRC
Valentine with alternate turrets and Archer conversion
Ram Kangaroo
SU-122, -85 and -100

All the best,

John

Humber IV armoured car

I second the suggestion for a M18, Valentine/Archer, Ram Kangaroo etc. S-Model, Pegasus and Italeri, between them, already do most of the others in "quick build" kits. The S-Model kits are really nice.

henk.fox3000.com/sModel.htm

I'd like to see T28s and some of the smaller Russian tankettes; T38 and T40s

M18 hellcat above all, is almost impossible to find in 1/72 at a good price. The various russian SU are already well covered by pegasus hobbies.
Humber mark IV would also be a good choice. Another dream that i have is that PSC will do, in the near future, an M10 kit with options for building wolverine or achilles and british/american crew.

since speaking a lot to armourfast recently their criteria for fast build would mean, as far as possible, single piece hulls so this so far has stopped them from doing a lee/grant.
they are keen to expand the range, but have to bear in mind the technical difficulties of getting the plastic out of the moulds and making assembly easy and to fit right.
they are not dragon so cost is also a factor.
hence the reason why we have done quite a few conversions on the kits to help in getting those odd conversions like this:-

the valentine should be with me shortly so i can finish the bridgelayer conversion as well as the bishop and archer.
thanks
shaun

Matilda 1

Any engineering & recovery vehicles.
Canadian CMP trucks with the number 13 cab.
Russian tracked guns like the 203mm B4 & 152mm Br2. Some serious presence there !
Russian T 28 tank
Matador truck.

Semovente 90/53 Tank Destroyer in 20mm.

M3 Stuart
Matilda II
Valentine
Crusader
M3 Halftrack
Panzer II
Sdkfz 10

Humber IV armoured car

Humber would be awesome!

Valentine

Another good choice.

As well, an A9 or A10 tank. I am doing early desert war so those would be fabulous.

John

Will from PSC here – i hear you all!

@RichBliss, PSC make some Stuarts… Just do some conversions panzer IIs by S-Model
I think we all agree that there needs to be a M18 Hellcat on the market, as there are none at all!

MU

Armored cars! Any.

Kit ones are nice, but can be very brittle. I would love to see some of those 8 wheeled monsters.

Also later marks of the Panzer III. I would love an M or N with the side skirts like the one PSC Panzer IV (that was a good call Will)

More lorries as well.

Hi Guys most of the stuff you are asking for is already made by us ( 20mmZone ) in light weight resin hulls with metal tracks & fittings & true fast build. The models not already converted to this format from the old Skytrex list are on the to do list inc the Hellcat.
Ian ( 20mmZone & Shell Hole )

Hi Guys most of the stuff you are asking for is already made by us ( 20mmZone ) in light weight resin hulls with metal tracks & fittings & true fast build. The models not already converted to this format from the old Skytrex list are on the to do list inc the Hellcat.
Ian ( 20mmZone & Shell Hole )

Is there a Humber IV in the stash you are working through?

Trucks-especially the CMP as mentioned above, Marmon Herrington a/c's and the German 8-rad series of recce vehicles…..

H'mmm. All of the vehicles suggested are made by one manufacturer or another. Most in 4-piece resin kits. My vote goes for the Tetrarch or M22 Locust.

Sorry no Humber Mk4 but we do have a Locust
Ian ( 20mmZone & Shell Hole )

My Wishes of PSC:

Soviet Motorized Recon Platoon: 6 M3A1 White with scouts hanging on the sides.

Motorized Recon Jeep Platoon: 6 Jeeps with crewmen (either British/Poles or GI or Soviet/NKVD or GBParas or Arab/LRDG or Israel or African), some with MG and one with bazooka, some uparmoured.

M8 Greyhound Platoon – 3 Greyhounds with some crewmen.

Jeeps would be good. The only real fast assembly kit isn't more in production (italeri). Even m3a1 would be a welcomed newcome. Italeri's one is not exactly fast assebly

we will have a 'very few parts' jeep out soon with choice of gb, german, us or russian crews as well as a gb para jeep & crew.

*Renault UE Tracteur Legere. Most numerous AFV of any type in service in Western Europe in 1940. Hundreds used by the Germans during Operation Barbarossa as primer movers for Pak 36 and weapon carriers. Modified UEs served as airfield security vehicles armed with a variety of machine guns and improvised armored bodies. Others were modified into artillery spotter's vehicles.

The UE was also built under license in Rumania as the Malaxa, and used by the Rumanian Army as a prime mover for their anti tank guns.

*SOMUA S35 cavalry tank. Arguably the best tank the French Army had in 1940, the SOMUA S35 was the main battle tank of the DLMs, and the Germans used captured SOMUA S35s as company command tanks for captured tank units, and in anti-partisan duties. German-service SOMUA S35s turned up in combat during the battles around the Normandy beachhead, and in the Balkans.

The French Army smuggled a number of SOMUA S35s to their colonies in North Africa after the Fall of France in June 1940, and brought them back into action in 1943 against the DAK in Tunisia with a surprising degree of success despite the SOMUA's obsolescence. Some later turned up in the ranks of the FFI during the Paris uprising in 1944, and until the end of the war supporting Free French forces in metropolitan France fighting to eliminate the last pockets of German resistance on French soil.

Like most French tanks of the 1940 campaign, the SOMUA S35s were finished in multi-color camouflage and often had elaborate national and unit markings, making them a very colorful subject for the war-game table.

*Type 89 Medium Tank. Mainstay of the Japanese Imperial Army and Imperial Navy's SNLF tank forces until 1942 when the Chi-Ha came into service in sufficient numbers. The Type 89 saw action in China, against the Red Army in Manchuria, and against the Allies both on the mainland and in the Philippines.

*Fiat 626 N. Besides serving in the Italian Army, this handy lorry turned up in the German Army whenever the German soldats could manage to relieve their former owners of the keys, and several hundred were in service with the French Army in 1940 as well (and the Germans no doubt appreciated however many examples they managed to acquire from their previous owners in time for Operation Barbarossa).

*Sdkfz 10 haltrack prime mover. Why no one has done this ubiquitous German light halftrack prime mover in a fast build plastic format in 1/72 scale remains one of the great unknown mysteries of the universe…

*Sdkfz 232 8-rad. Hell, from the first examples in Fall Weis and Fall Gelb to the ultimate iteration the Puma, this is another one whose time has come for 1/72 scale plastic fast build format.

*M8 Greyhound and M20 Utility Car. If you're going to do an American recce force, you may as well do it right the first time 'round.

*T-26 medium tank. This was the main medium tank in service with the Red Army in 1941 until the production of the T-36 got going. Seeing that we already have the BT-7, the T-26, and now the T-35(!!!) in fast build plastic kit format in 1/72 scale, IMHO why the Hell not the T-26 to complete the early war Russian tank stable?!

Just a heads-up on what's already out there in 1/72 scale plastic fast build kit format:

Pegasus:

SU-122
SU-85
SU-100
BT-7

S-Model

T-26
A-13 Cruiser Tank
Hotchkiss H-38/39
Panzer II Ausf. C
Panzer I Ausf. A
Panzer I Ausf. A Ambulance
Vickers Mk. IVB light tank
Daimler Dingo Mk. 1A
Crusader Mk. I/II
Kfz. 13
Willys Jeep w/Browning .50 cal. and 37mm anti-tank gun
T-35
Kettenkrad
L3/33 tankette
L3/33 flamethrower with fuel trailer
GAZ-67B jeep
Panzer III Ausf. G

And God help me if somebody releases the Hotchkiss H35 in a fast build plastic kit format…

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Soviets:
GAZ Trucks – (Only know of high-parts model kits, and some resin 1-piece kits)
SU-76 – (same as above)

Germans:
Panzer III L,M,N (Revell so far has the best price/kit imo, but man it takes forever to assemble the tracks)
Panther G – (Italeri fast build is OOP with wonky drive sprockets, and the Armourfast is lacking in hull/tool details and the late production mantlet option)

US and UK:
M10 – (Again, Armourfast is low on details, so a better-detailed kit could be useful)
Jeep – (Italeri is OOP, and while the S-Models kit is great, it has a lot of assembly needed)
M8/M20 – (really a prime candidate)

And I'd need to research a bit more for North Africa, early war '39 and '40, and the Pacific, but I imagine there are some kits that could be produced for those theaters that would warrant fast-build kits.

The big thing about a fast build kit is, will I be building more than a few of these kits, and is the potential loss of some details worth the speed gained during assembly? If not, and I'm building a few of them, then I may want to just spring for a couple model kits and slog through the assembly. More than 4? Okay, fast build would be nice, but I could still go for the model kits if I can't get anything else. More than 6 and I start looking for easy-assembly kits or die casts, because there's no way I'm assembling Dragon T-34's or M4 Shermans, or anything German with their (seemingly) hundreds of road wheels, when I need dozens of them. It's just time wasted assembling fiddly bits that I'd rather spend elsewhere.

Basically, was it mass-produced and widely used throughout the war, and currently under-represented or capable of being improved on in the current models market? If so, chances are people would want a fast-build kit.

~iPaint

The Renault UE tractor- great suggestion with conversion sets and possibilities- also the SU-76 open top, used post war all over the world too.

Leland – did you mean the T-28 multi turret monster?

The Renault UE tractor- great suggestion with conversion sets and possibilities- also the SU-76 open top, used post war all over the world too. The 8-rad 232 series opens a lot of options too, 20mm turrets/short 75 mounts/pak mounts and Puma's.

(Leland – did you mean the T-28 multi turret monster?)

Both Paul at Early war Minis, My self at Shell Hole do several versions of the U/E & we also have the rocket versions soon to be re-released from the skytrex range.
Ian ( Shell Hole & 20mmZone )

Some simple 1/72-20mm Japanese kits would be….different. The Dragon kits are a paint in the patoot to put together.

The Renault UE tractor- great suggestion with conversion sets and possibilities- also the SU-76 open top, used post war all over the world too.

Leland – did you mean the T-28 multi turret monster?

Yup, the one and only T-28 three turret medium tank that made such a nice target for German gunners in 1941, yet that managed to hang on in Red Army service in dwindling numbers until 1943(!).

As for the Tracteur Legere UE, I have four with trailers from Skytrex in metal. Plastic is lighter, easier to modify for conversion projects, and unlike resin doesn't make me sneeze…

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Now Skytrex will live on in mixed resin/metal as 20mm Zone, I think the more obscure things asked for above don't stand a chance.

Someone has rightly pointed out above that 'fast build' is directly suited to vehicles that were truly mass-produced during ww2 (which excludes most German kit really!)

Soft skins therefore really win the day, and are easily the most underrepresented items. The modern economic justification for the effort of producing a fast-build kit is pretty similar to the economic case for the original standardized vehicles.

Who is going to produce fast-build kits for weird stuff in weird armies? (I love em, but don't expect anyone to help me build them!)

So – my answer – any Sdkfz series German half-track, GMC, Gaz truck, Bedford, CMP. All these will sell shedloads – whether I personally want them or not!

although anyone doing a Semovente 90/53 would be my pal for life!

Incidentally Italeri already – supposedly – do the M7 Priest. PSC have a Pak40 due, and Armourfast will soon have a Valentine.

I'm amazed. I can think of 3 or 4 suppliers for most items above. Hellcat is the only 'armoured' obvious return on investment for a producer.

I have done a T28 in plastic/resin with metal tracks & turrets only 8 parts so it is a real fast build for 3 years now.
Ian
Shell Hole & 20mmZone )

I think the more obscure things asked for above don't stand a chance.

Well, looks like this lot didn't get the memo:

auction

auction

auction

auction

auction

…and they don't look like they're going to slow down any time soon… although I still don't get why there's no fast build Sdkfz 10…

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Some quick-build plastic kits in 1/72 scale that I would buy:

SU-76 – After building a couple Unimodel kits, something quickbuild sounds like a dream!

BA-10 – I know Zvezda has sold a bunch of these in 1/100, I figure they have to be economical in 1/72 as well

ZiS-5 – Ditto on Zvezda doing these in 1/100. Would love a kit akin to the Pegasus German and U.S. Trucks. I know I've bought a half dozen of the kits myself and would surely buy even more than that for ZiS-5 trucks to go with my Russians!

T-60 – Personal favorite, perhaps too niche (although veyr numerous during 1942 on the Eastern Front)

Panzer 35(t) – All the rest are there to be had, but not this one. Also could double as the Romanian R-2. Might be worth it to coordinate release to go along with the Romanian 1/72 scale soldiers coming from Zvezda this year.

I do several versions of the Zis 5 & a T60 (the Romanian Takam T60 & a 35t/ Romanian R2 & Takam R2 all metal but also fast build & similar price to plastics
Ian ( Shell Hole & 20mmZone )

Leland- thanks for the Ebay link to the T35- just treated myself- cheaper than all other European suppliers and included p&p….happy bunny!

BA-10
Greyhound armored car
White scout car
Does anyone make half track passengers?

Gaz, glad I could help. I for one am looking forward to adding a fully fledged BEF brigade to my Early War collection in the coming year, along with expanding my motor pool of early Russian armor, especially lots of T-26s for my SCW Republicans, KMT Chinese, and Red Army all at once…

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Almost forgot, Pegasus makes a fast build two-to-a-box BA-6 armored car. I have a pair and they're very nice indeed.

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

We must be 'shadowing' – I am looking at improving my BEF collection too, got some UK armoured cars and infantry etc but am deciding on MkVI's and A10 types now…..I started with 1940/41 German Panzers and opponents for Barbarossa- lots of T26's,BA-6's and Bt series with a couple of T34's and some of the 'big' Soviet monsters (T28/T35/KVi/2) fo a challenge…..even got some Finns too.
Got a few Belgians and some French armour and infantry in the pipeline, all awaiting the paintbrush….even got some Polish for a change against the Russians….resisting the draw to Greece '40-1 as I have the Axis troops and with a BEF force could 'battle' that too….
Of course much of the equipment is SCW too so accordingly have a pile of that too- that is mostly finished with a few add-ons to pitch into……why can't we 28 hour days and 5 day weekends?

Half track crews We have lots in the old skytrex range to re release (American, British & think Russian also.
Ian ( 20mmZone & Shell Hole )

Would any self propelled guns be nice?
Like jags panzer, jagdpanther etc.
MU

MU,

ArmourFast makes a very nice Jagdpanther. I for one would love to see a fast build Hetzer as well with a Flammhetzer barrel option…

Pegasus already makes a fast build Panzer 38(t), so the next logical step for them IMHO would be the Hetzer or one of the Marder variants.

Since S-Model has released a Panzer II, we might hope they'll follow up with the Marder and other SP gun variants that were based on that chassis.

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

Gaz,

Must be, as I have been resisting the siren call of the Greek campaign 40-41 like a fiend for a number of years now so I can stay focused on my Early War French, Germans, and Red Army in equal measure.

Never enough hours in the day…

Leland R. Erickson
Metal Express
metal-express.net

S.P.G's
We at 20mmZone Already do have now or will have by next weekend nearly all the 38t & Lorrain S.P.G/Panzer Jaeger conversions + Hummel & Nashorn & Sigg.
Ian
"0mmZone & Shellhole )

A Japanese Type 2 Ka-Mi SNFL amphib tank, with or without the pontoons. Optimal would be to have detachable pontoons since they were dropped as soon as the tank landed, but that would be pushing things I think.

Late war reconnaissance vehicles such as German Sdkfz 250/9, Russian T-70/BA-64, British/Canadian Humber,Lynx,Staghound.

SU-76M

Ram Kangaroo

Another fast assemblies are in 20 mm scale (well, 1:72 actually) from First to Fight. They will cover German and then eventually Russian invasion of Poland in 1939.

TKS armed with 20 mm gun (released)
PzKpf I Ausf. A (released)
Sd.Kfz. 265 (released)
C2P artillery tractor (released)
Kfz. 13 (released)
TK-3 (released)

Next in line is wz. 34 with machine gun armoured car (in two weeks).

Then…
PzKpfw II Ausf. C
wz. 34 II with 37 mm gun
PzKpfw II Ausf. D.
Polish and German infantry. Series will have 72 issues.

This is english website: wrzesien1939.pl/en
And Facebook: link

BlackWidowPilot – we seem to be at cross-purposes. I wouldn't regard the early part of WW2 as 'obscure', just less popular. Also the question was what we want in the future, rather than what has already been optimistically provided. Maybe S-Model are at this very moment learning the hard way the limits of the T35 market?

Your point about Fast-Build manufacturers hopefully re-using chassis (Pzkw II, Pzkw38(t) etc)is an excellent one – and again likely – because it's a mirror of what happened in real life.