"52nd Light Infantry question" Topic

I am finishing up my first unit of Peninsular War British and getting ready to start on my next one. In order to not get burned out on repetitive facing colors, I have decided to depict the 52nd Light Infantry but wanted to find out if anyone had an opinion regarding the markings on the backpacks. Based upon what I have learned since joining the site, black backpacks with white regiment numbers/insignia were more of a late Peninsular War/Waterloo thing. Although I would like to paint the backpack in the facing color of buff, I am unsure as to how the regimental number would be painted on there or what it would look like. Would it have been the light infantry bugle with the number 52 above it, or perhaps 52 shown as roman numerals with or without the light infantry bugle? And would it have been in a red disc or perhaps in black on the buff colored pack?
Anyone care to take a stab at this or have info that might be of assistance? Any help is greatly appreciated and thanks in advance

I just painted the backpacks black with white straps. Probably should have been buff according to people who have commented to me about it.

Yes, the backpack straps should be buff, as should the crossbelts, for buff faced units like 52nd and 71st. Doesn't look as good as white, but strictly speaking correct……….not the coat tail turnbacks though, they stay white.

link

The Cent Jours website shows buff turnbacks edged white. I did not realize that even the musket slings were buff!

GdeP

Interesting plate GdeP – I hadn't realised that "gentlemen volunteers" wore an officer-style uniform. Would make an interesting conversion! But wouldn't volunteers have worn the LI wings, since even the officers had them?

Since Alexis illustrates this for the 52nd only, does this mean they wore normal uniform in other units, that there were more volunteers in the 52nd, or just that there's pictorial evidence for the 52nd? Sometimes – most of the time – I wish he were a little more specific about his sources…

Garde de Paris. I just knew that buff faced "British" regiments did not extend to wearing buff turnbacks on their coat tails. So I checked several sources and everyone tells me I was wrong. White lined coats for line infantry were instead buff lined and, so, coat tails showed through as buff………..

I was speaking with great authority despite profound ignorance. I do that a lot………..

All

I cannot read French. What does the paragraph under the volunteer say? I would like to know more about them

F

It's the explanation of the "gentleman volunteer" concept: An officer candidate who, by agreement of the colonel, would serve in the ranks, usually obtaining a commisson after one or two campaigns.

What the text doesn't say is that these gentlemen would fight in the ranks, but mess with the officers (who they would be joining ere long) – so I suppose the officer's uniform makes sense; I just hadn't thought about it before seeing this inforgraphic.

It's an 18th C. practice linked to the purchasing of commissions. The old (royal) French army had an equivalent in the 'Anspessade'. Still, it must have been strange to have a few chaps hanging around, essentially waiting to step into a dead man's boots…

Sorry, folks, but I have been "away" working! I did not even notice the volunteer among the 52nd, and confess I know nothing about them. I do recall the anspessades of the French of the 7YW period.

Deadhead: I am prone to admit that I "am often wrong, but never in doubt" until someone on TMP "helps me clean up my act." My painting skills are abysmal, and I still plan to do 2 British buff-faced battalions, both in the Peninsular War uniform – 27th and 48th. Not sure how to make them less "boring" with all that buff!

GdeP

G de P, the snag is it is these things you "just knew", so you pronounce without checking.

Within 24 hours I declared here that Neufchatel, in their wonderful canary yellow coats, were not in the Peninsula and this thing about "buff faced" British infantry being prepared to leave their leather belts in plain buff, but surely not going to the extent of lining their coats with a different fabric colour to all other line units!

Buff against red is "dull" though, as you say. 71st is a uniquely uniformed unit….no tartan to do, but a hint of Scottish…..but they look so much better with contrasting white, even if wrong. At least the lace was white (whitish, if you allow for the threads through it). Did the bagpiper really exist for 71st??? Often wondered…….did he wear trews? Does it really matter? (OH yes, it really does)

Did the bagpiper really exist for 71st???

Haythornthwaite & Chappell's Uniforms of the Peninsular War shows one in full Highland kit, including kilt. I'm at work right now so I can't check what he says about a source, but I'm pretty sure he's in there.

You are right, so he is, in my much treasured copy. I guess I have always wondered if, by 1815, there was a piper in the blue covered diced shako, without a kilt, but overalls instead, as is sometime shown in illustrations….and apologies for getting off 52nd, especially as my contribution was so bad earlier ( I am a West Ham fan, so cannot get much right)

The "gentleman volunteer" serving as a ranker bothers me. I know that in earlier times they were gentleman serving without pay or position while waiting for a commission to became available, but usually they severed as an aide or such. They would serve in some position that would not require them to be in with the other ranks and were to be treated as officers. This was a time of separation of classes. It doesn't seem to make sense to me, to have a guy who some day would have to command his mess mates.

Anyone have more information on them?

Oh, the term and concept are well established old chap, it's just the uniform we were wondering about…

link

That said, it can indeed hardly have been a comfortable position, as others have noticed:

link

Hmm

An interesting concept. I think I will read up more about it

F

a suggestion. Start a new thread on this topic. Few will read about 52nd and expect to be reading about gentlemen volunteers. There are some really knowledgeable folk here, but they may not know you are asking this. It needs to be a title….and then it needs to stay high on the chart or it is forgotten in days….so every so often thank folk for any input and guess what that does to the ranking.